Vuelta a España - Stage 11 Vilanova i la Geltrú - Andorra 208.4km

[ttrider]

Yeah caisse is the dark horse but they need to use sanchez and arroyo as domestiques now, then i think unzue should leave Bruzeghin and gamble with Uran and Plaza early in stages like 16 or early attacks on the finishing climbs

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Always in the red zone trying to limit his losses? Sounds like Gesink at this year's Tour to me.

No, because Gesink never goes over his limit. He drops immediately and choses his own pace.
Nibali choses a pace which is not good for him (trying to follow Mosquera/Anton), and then blow
Again, you are not paying any attention at all when you are watching, are you?

In the Tour, Gesink usually dropped at the bottom of a climb (with all the accelrations). Chose his own pace. And then passed guys who blew themselves up trying to follow (LL sanchez, Leipheimer most notably).

Nibali is the exact opposite (aka, same as Leipheimer/LL Sanchez, trying to follow until you blow). Yet you think they are similar. Seriously, do you watch at all? You might SEE the stage, but you are not watching.

 

[Kwibus]

I'm not contradicting myself, I see him hanging at one point. There is the point where he cannot improve anymore. Like I said, kinda like Breukink etc..

Ask yourself this question, has Valverde improved much after his 23th? Has Boonen? Has Contador?

People who are at the top pretty quickly don't improve that much every year, even when they are 'just 25'.
There is still room for improvement. But not by large quantities....

About the contradicting part: You were giving Nibali no chance at a GT win, but also said he keeps on hanging in there longer and longer. So you also pretty much said that he is still improving, which could result in..........
I know what you meant though and I also know you don't expect him to get much better then he is now. Still despite you saying Nibali will never win any GT you also pretty much gave a reason why he could still win a GT in the future.

I know Nibalis flaws, but I also think that he could have a GT where he won't crack or atleast not as badly for once.
Some riders reach their best lvl at 30 and some allready at 25. I'm sure Nibali won't improve BIG time anymore, but he certainly will get a bit better. Just not by a huge margin, but maybe enough to once win a GT in a lucky year.

 

[Kwibus]

What about BRUSEGHIN? he is climbing better than pure climbers. If can keep that up, he would be a threat with the ITT coming up.

Another point of view is that GCE team can attack any day now and play their cards. Anyone of the top 3 will have to be willing to be sacrified. Which one would be?

Definately a dark horse here. Allthough as DT allready mentioned there are still 2 MTF on really painful climbs that could really really hurt Bruseghin. Still if he rides like today... You just never know
On belgian tv the commentator said Bruseghin looked slimmer then the time in Italy. The co-commentator laughed about it and probably I should've too (also did a bit), but it does look like it. Could also be the outfit, or just him having less kg then he ever had?

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

I just think Nibali needs a whole lot of luck to WIN a gc.

 

[Kwibus]

I just think Nibali needs a whole lot of luck to WIN a gc.

Maybe..... So far you have been right about waaaay too many things

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

But wrong about many things as well
Keep the faith Kwibus.

Cycling is an unpredictable sport and suprises pop up everyday.

 

[Aguirre]

I just think Nibali needs a whole lot of luck to WIN a gc.

me too!!!! I totaly share this. He will be always around the podium in Giro and Vuelta, top 5 in Tour. Difficult to win instead.

He is not enough climber, nor the best TT, but he is good in both and also in one day classics. He is like LL Sanchez maybe a bit lest fast

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

Like I said, if he managed to become a top time triallist somehow, or a top climber, it can still happen

But I just don't see it happening. It would definately suprise me

 

[luckyboy]

I just think Nibali needs a whole lot of luck to WIN a gc.

I have a hard time thinking that he won't win at least a Giro one day. Don't really remember the Zoncolan stage this year (was it Zoncolan?) where he lost a few minutes, but was that more to do with working for Basso and then taking it easy rather than blowing up? Then again, he stayed up there for the final 2 MT stages..

And that was one bad day - Piti always had a bad day every GT until last year's Vuelta.

Still, I think he'll be able to win it once.

 

[Wergeland]

Man, how about that victory salute? Awesome. What was he doing? Chopping down his rivals?

I like Anton, but he's really pushing it with ridiculous antics like that.

 

[indurain666]

I like Anton, but he's really pushing it with ridiculous antics like that.

I agree, and I thought Contador was bad.

 

[Aguirre]

back to Antón, he is pure class, a pure climber, he is fragile like glass and his way of speaking reminds to that of a tennager, his voice sounds very "infantile" and doesnt even sound like adult. He didn't say anything special, he is humble, use always clichés, comes from a very normal millieu.
He is not a "big mouth" or has a strong personality.

But, but, he is so passionate of this sport, he is like a child dreaming and in terms of class: he is following the path of pure, pure cilmbers of the history of this sport, he is obsessed with Pantani.

After this Vuelta for me is clear, he has everything to be one of the climbers of the last 20/30 years. Would be surprised if he doesn't win.

He can be with Conti and Andy at least at the same level. Of course he is not a TdF contender. But he is a contender for Vuelta and Giro too.

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

What Aguirre says.

For the Tour Anton would need to be very lucky with the course. Or somehow magically learn how to TT

 

[Aguirre]

hey, I'm writing from Basque country... so I know the price of the fish...

Anton will never be a TdF contender, even being the best climber of that edition!!!!! is not only about his weak TT skills (and in a TdF weekness in TT increases regarding Giro and Vuelta), simply that the rythm in Tour is too high for a pure-glass climber like him.

There will be always a crash, cross winds, cuts at the end of flat stages, etc where he will lost time, even the high rythm would undermine his climber skills... that's why Euskaltel thought this year Samuel in Tour and Anton in Vuelta

He can be to 5 in a TdF, maybe 3rd with a lot of luck, winning stages and polka dots. But not a threat for Conti and Andy and guys of that kind.

 

[icefire]

What Aguirre says.

For the Tour Anton would need to be very lucky with the course. Or somehow magically learn how to TT

...or Alberto being ill and Andy riding day and night

 

[Aguirre]

...or Alberto being ill and Andy riding day and night

and he doesn't have even the body adapted for TT at all, he cannot learn, he is even clumsy as a climber...

In a 40 km TT he can be correct, but in a 60 km... he will lost a world... but wait, TdF has less and less TT, no?

 

[The Hitch]

I like Anton, but he's really pushing it with ridiculous antics like that.

If you win a stage you celebrate it how you want. I understand people complaining about Contador doing the pistol salute when on the podium, but when he crossess the line first he can celebrate how he wants it. Same with everyone.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Definately a dark horse here. Allthough as DT allready mentioned there are still 2 MTF on really painful climbs that could really really hurt Bruseghin. Still if he rides like today... You just never know
On belgian tv the commentator said Bruseghin looked slimmer then the time in Italy. The co-commentator laughed about it and probably I should've too (also did a bit), but it does look like it. Could also be the outfit, or just him having less kg then he ever had?

When Bruseghin was 3rd in the Giro, that included a stage to Alpe di Pampeago, a multiple climb stage over Pordoi, San Pellegrino, Giau and Falzarego before finishing on Fedaia, an ITT to Kronplatz, an MTF on Monte Pora, and a descent finish after the Gavia, Mortirolo and Aprica. If he's in that kind of shape and form, he could be able to at least hold on for a reasonable position in the climbs of the Vuelta.

 

[icefire]

and he doesn't have even the body adapted for TT at all, he cannot learn, he is even clumsy as a climber...

In a 40 km TT he can be correct, but in a 60 km... he will lost a world... but wait, TdF has less and less TT, no?

Everything that is being said about Anton right now could have been said about Pantani back in the day.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

When Bruseghin was 3rd in the Giro, that included a stage to Alpe di Pampeago, a multiple climb stage over Pordoi, San Pellegrino, Giau and Falzarego before finishing on Fedaia, an ITT to Kronplatz, an MTF on Monte Pora, and a descent finish after the Gavia, Mortirolo and Aprica. If he's in that kind of shape and form, he could be able to at least hold on for a reasonable position in the climbs of the Vuelta.

the more climbs a stage contains the better bruseghin gets, this is well known thing from him.

 

[luckyboy]

Everything that is being said about Anton right now could have been said about Pantani back in the day.

Yeah and Pantani got the strength from somewhere to do that great final TT in 98 right

 

[Kwibus]

But wrong about many things as well
Keep the faith Kwibus.

Cycling is an unpredictable sport and suprises pop up everyday.

Hehe don't worry I definately keep the faith.
I was referring to your earlier posts in this thread when you had to point out to everyone that you were right about everything so far

 

[Kwibus]

I agree, and I thought Contador was bad.

Oh I actually thought it was quite funny as I didn't get the impression he had thought the way he was going to cheer out before the stage or something.
If he keeps on doing it every time he wins then it certainly will be crappy:/

 

[hrotha]

Oh I actually thought it was quite funny as I didn't get the impression he had thought the way he was going to cheer out before the stage or something.
If he keeps on doing it every time he wins then it certainly will be crappy:/

I didn't think it was bad, or funny, or anything. I thought it was confusing and awkward. It took me out of my comfort zone.