Vuelta a España Vuelta a España 2023, stage 11: Lerma - La Laguna Negra, 163.2k

[Devil's Elbow]

The most pointless MTF.

After starting from Lerma, a frequent host of the Vuelta a Burgos, it’s a rather uninteresting trek over relatively flat terrain, taking in a loop around Viñuesa before heading to the MTF. We’ve seen it once before in 2020, when Dan Martin somehow bested Primoz Roglic in a sprint of the elites. This climb simply isn’t hard enough for the favourites to hurt each other and so we should see a big breakaway take this one with action in the peloton limited to the ramp to the line at best.

Or another way to put it: don’t do ten MTFs if you don’t actually want ten mountain stages, Unipublic.

 

[ice&fire]

The most pointless MTF.

It's a close contest with stage16

 

[Devil's Elbow]

It's a close contest with stage16

That MTF is way harder so something will actually happen there. This is just a breakaway stage pretending to be a GC stage,

 

[saunaking]

Weren't the stages shown on live TV from the start last year?

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Roglstomp is on the cards.

 

[Brullnux]

Weren't the stages shown on live TV from the start last year?

Perhaps but I don't see any reason why anyone would want to submit themselves to watching the entirety of this stage.

 

[SHAD0W93]

Breakaway vs Jumbo


Hopefully Kamna from the break.

 

[Red Rick]

That MTF is way harder so something will actually happen there. This is just a breakaway stage pretending to be a GC stage,

Stage 16 is just funny cause they could've done a monster MTF but only go 40% up.

In reality, I don't really hate this cause I don't know what else the stage is supposed to be anyway. I guess you can want it to do part of Lagunas de Neila first but I think we both know it doesn't really change how GC guys raced it.

 

[Moose McKnuckles]

Obligatory Egan Bernal from the break post.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

We're already almost halfway through the race, so it must be time an Oier Lazkano stage win.

 

[tobydawq]

The most pointless MTF.

After starting from Lerma, a frequent host of the Vuelta a Burgos, it’s a rather uninteresting trek over relatively flat terrain, taking in a loop around Viñuesa before heading to the MTF. We’ve seen it once before in 2020, when Dan Martin somehow bested Primoz Roglic in a sprint of the elites. This climb simply isn’t hard enough for the favourites to hurt each other and so we should see a big breakaway take this one with action in the peloton limited to the ramp to the line at best.

Or another way to put it: don’t do ten MTFs if you don’t actually want ten mountain stages, Unipublic.

All the negativity of yours is wearing me down...

 

[tobydawq]

Weren't the stages shown on live TV from the start last year?

No, only a select few.

 

[ManicJack]

Breakaway vs Jumbo

SQS to control. Bonus seconds before the climb and at the finish are way too important to Remco. He's going to need every second he can get.

 

[Netserk]

All the negativity of yours is wearing me down...

Thankfully for us, you at least make up for it!

 

[tobydawq]

Thankfully for us, you at least make up for it!

Yeah, well, it's intrinsically difficult to complain about complaining without being hypocritical.

 

[Samamba]

Weak breakaway win.

 

[Red Rick]

All the negativity of yours is wearing me down...

These kids be stealing my jobs

 

[Devil's Elbow]

All the negativity of yours is wearing me down...

Do tell me, which things about this Vuelta have I been negative about that the majority of the forum wasn’t?

Or alternatively, what things have I been negative about in the previous OPs? The only thing that comes to mind is the safety of the sprint finishes and those criticisms sadly proved to be entirely justified.

Or alternatively, which part of this OP you disagree with? You don’t think this is the weakest of the ten MTFs of this Vuelta?

 

[tobydawq]

Do tell me, which things about this Vuelta have I been negative about that the majority of the forum wasn’t?

Or alternatively, what things have I been negative about in the previous OPs? The only thing that comes to mind is the safety of the sprint finishes and those criticisms sadly proved to be entirely justified.

Or alternatively, which part of this OP you disagree with? You don’t think this is the weakest of the ten MTFs of this Vuelta?

There will always be one MTF that is the weakest. I don't know why it is so bad. Last time this climb ended up in a sprint between the favourites. That's okay. There can't be 10 Granon stages.

And yes, complaining about sprint finishes is unnecessary. As I said before, they can never be safe enough for some people, so there will always be something to complain about even if most often they will pass by without incidents. Spain has a lot of roundabouts. Especially in the cities. It's unavoidable that they will feature in the finales. It doesn't need to be addressed as though the whole organisation is an incompetent clump of halfwits every time there is a curve in the road inside the final 2 kms.

 

[topcat]

This is better than a flat stage. Is that positive enough for you, Toby?

 

[Valv.Piti]

What else do you really want from this stage? A weak MTF seems just about right at this point in the race with stage 13 and 14 looming after the ITT.

The real tragedy is that stage 2 and 9 were not raced. As in literally not raced, apart from a select few riders that were not deemed important enough.

If the alternative is Geoffrey Soupe is winning after 4.30 hours of nothingness, then this is infinitely better.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

It doesn't need to be addressed as though the whole organisation is an incompetent clump of halfwits every time there is a curve in the road inside the final 2 kms.

Yes, that's exactly the tone I have used about the sprints. Thank you for giving a fair representation of what I've said and not putting words into my mouth in an attempt to defend your point.

 

[Netserk]

What else do you really want from this stage? A weak MTF seems just about right at this point in the race with stage 13 and 14 looming after the ITT.

The real tragedy is that stage 2 and 9 were not raced. As in literally not raced, apart from a select few riders that were not deemed important enough.

If the alternative is Geoffrey Soupe is winning after 4.30 hours of nothingness, then this is infinitely better.

I think the two stages the Giro had after its mid-race ITT were better. More classic breakaway stages.

EDIT: I mixed up stage 11 and 12.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

What else do you really want from this stage? A weak MTF seems just about right at this point in the race with stage 13 and 14 looming after the ITT.

The real tragedy is that stage 2 and 9 were not raced. As in literally not raced, apart from a select few riders that were not deemed important enough.

If the alternative is Geoffrey Soupe is winning after 4.30 hours of nothingness, then this is infinitely better.

A non-MTF here (assuming you put the finish in Vinuesa itself instead, either a clear sprint or a stage with the hard side of Lagunas de Neila midway through and a flat finale) because Laguna Negra just does nothing. Then in exchange for that put some walls in the finale of stage 7 (there are actually good options in that area and this route lacks hilly/mid-mountain stages) and approach Bejes from Collado de la Hoz because there would be literally 0 metres between the descent and the MTF so the peloton would be completely strung out going into the MTF. One MTF less in exchange for a better route overall, rather than doing MTFs for the sake of doing MTFs.

Obviously agree on the neutralisation of stages 2 and 9 being far bigger issues, but that shouldn't shield the remainder of the race from criticism where it's justified, and for that matter, neither should it make praise impossible.

 

[search]

Weren't the stages shown on live TV from the start last year?

last year all weekend stages were shown from the start (no matter the profile), as far as I can remember. This year they mainly went for some in the 2nd half (1, 13, 14, 16, 18, 20, 21)