verb
Armchair Cycling
The act of watching professional cycling
whilst reclining in a comfortable chair
Armchair Cycling
The act of watching professional cycling
whilst reclining in a comfortable chair
Such a *** unnecessary comment, you have no idea what Team order they have. But one more time. Armchair Cyclist
- Aug 13, 2011
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If he and Roglic are together and bonus seconds are in play, I don’t see Roglic not sprinting against him.
- May 5, 2010
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I think the real question is:
Why isn't this thread stickied, when the stage 17 thread still is?
@Red Rick, can you help solve that mystery?
Why isn't this thread stickied, when the stage 17 thread still is?
@Red Rick, can you help solve that mystery?
- Jul 16, 2015
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If the team order is to make Vingegaard gain 1 minute for 'free' (like on Tuesday), then it's a sh*t team order.
- Aug 13, 2011
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Vinge doesn’t need 1 min now though, only 8 seconds and he gets the jersey due to the TT. Vinge could drop him at will or if Roglic attacks use him as the motor or springboard to ride ahead. Roglic needs to have like that split in 2021 when MAL and Bernal got caught behind but instead it be Vinge and someone else while everyone else rides away so Roglic could win.
As I said, you have no idea behind your keyboard.
But contact Jumbo Visma, you might get answers to your questions there.
- Aug 29, 2009
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Has Team Remco announced all details about their plans for today yet?
- Nov 16, 2013
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noun
Road cycling discussion forum
A place where people can discuss road cycling
Professional cycling licence not a requirement for participation
- Aug 16, 2021
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Situation now is that JV bring the team to beat Remco, but it Remco who blew up spectacularly first. Others GC guys (Ayuso, Mas) not good enough to challenge them. Kuss got into a break that got large amount of time, made him 3rd wheel for JV, which was intended to be another tactical piece against Remco (and others assault). But here, as mentioned Remco blew up first, and others just simply not good enough which left JV in weird tactical situation, which is not good for PR or whatsoever, but still great in terms of result.
"I think Vingegaards plan is to pretend to be dumb enough to "accidentally" take red with bonus seconds. Of course, Kuss might easily drop a at least a few seconds to make that scenario easier."
A place where people can discuss road cycling
Professional (with nasty words towards cyclists you don't like) cycling license not a requirement for participation.
Treat other people as you would like to be treated.
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Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
- Mar 22, 2010
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That's what I do. (well, on a sofa actually)
- Feb 16, 2010
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Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
- Mar 22, 2010
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- Jul 16, 2015
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Honestly I don't see how Rog can win this race. Tuesday's stage 16 time loss sealed his fate.
He needs a split in the bunch, none of the main rivals there (Mas, Ayuso, Landa) & he needs Jumbo to not chase behind him (which they most likely would if there's someone like Ayuso who is 4 minutes behind Kuss).
Maybe a two-man solo raid on Saturday with Evenepoel? But that seems fanciful. Vingegaard is going to mark him now anyway. I mean I'm a believer in him (& he showed he had great form here) but there's just a point where putting over a minute into Vingegaard cannot 'realistically' happen in the current race scenario.
It's too bad he had his ITT gains taken from him via team decisions.
Armchair Cyclist
Moderator
- Mar 22, 2010
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That is an appalling attitude.
Professional sport exists because enough people have enough interest in it to sustain sponsorship/subscriptions/attendances to make full time dedication to the sport financially rewarding and well organised events practical.
If an activity is sustained purely on the back of participants, it is a hobby, not professional sport.
- Aug 31, 2019
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Commenting about professional cycling based on what we see on our TV screens (and without knowing everything 100%) sitting in our comfortable chair is what we all do. Or do you claim that you were there for Pogacars ITT reconnaissance or that you personally know Pogacars state of mind?
Or is “armchair cycling” only a bad thing when others do it?
- Mar 29, 2012
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Back in the days when cycling logic was still my friend, the most likely scenario for today would be;
1. a break up the road, making it until the end. Remco has to make sure Bahrain is represented, or they will chase again for Landa's bid for a much-wanted 4th place in GC;
2. the group of favourites together until the last climb;
3. some minor reshuffling as the top 3 won't attack each other, so only attacks from place 4 and further, and JV trying to cover / cancel moves
4. a small sprint by the GC group for minor placings / honour.
Now, it's 2023 and things are different.
The only way I see Kuss winning (if Roglic and Vingegaard again go full), is by attacking himself first. Yes, you heard that right. Kuss attacks, nobody follows (*) and Roglic / Vingegaard can't move either.
(*) If only 4th-6th in GC allow Kuss to go (as they have reason to cover any move by Kuss), it would be a crazy scenario.
1. a break up the road, making it until the end. Remco has to make sure Bahrain is represented, or they will chase again for Landa's bid for a much-wanted 4th place in GC;
2. the group of favourites together until the last climb;
3. some minor reshuffling as the top 3 won't attack each other, so only attacks from place 4 and further, and JV trying to cover / cancel moves
4. a small sprint by the GC group for minor placings / honour.
Now, it's 2023 and things are different.
The only way I see Kuss winning (if Roglic and Vingegaard again go full), is by attacking himself first. Yes, you heard that right. Kuss attacks, nobody follows (*) and Roglic / Vingegaard can't move either.
(*) If only 4th-6th in GC allow Kuss to go (as they have reason to cover any move by Kuss), it would be a crazy scenario.
The truth is that Tadej is as good as Jonas at ITT. Many commentators came to the same conclusion that Tadej was not as prepared when looking at comparison videos. However, I regret the word "sloppy" it was bad of me.
But my point is nobody knows what team order is. So accusing one or the other of stabbing their teammate in the back is no big deal.
- Feb 20, 2010
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In what world is that praise?Haha Sepp is starting to grow on LS
There is a clear agenda to present Kuss as the 'good guy' of the piece and Jonas and especially Primož as villains. As I say, it's the only storyline the Vuelta has left, so the media and pundits are going all out portraying Sepp as the lovable underdog in the face of the destructive, ruthless machine to try to coax at least some drama out of watching the team strangle the race.
Unfortunately for that narrative, he himself is part of said ruthless machine.
- Aug 31, 2019
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There isn't really anything we can say as a given "truth" in a situation like this. Pogacar have done some great ITTs and he's beaten Vingegaard a couple of times, but it's a speculation / opinion to say "Tadej is as good as Jonas at ITT".
If you want to look at what is confirmed as "true" there are two things that comes to mind for me in this context:
Vingegaard is 3-0 up on Pogacar in last week TDF ITTs.
Pogacar have never completely crushed a ITT like Vingegaard did that day. Not even Plance des Belles Filles comes close when looking at the time gaps compared to the opponents and base on length (either if you look at time or distance of the race).
It's not a good look to me to claim your own speculation/opinion as truth when you are attacking other people for speculating (everyone speculates and share opinions, that's what a discussion forum is for).
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- Jul 16, 2015
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Hiding behind team orders is a funny one. Did it look like Roglič accepted his fate on Tuesday? In what world is losing 2nd in GC & over a minute against his real closest rival good for his race prospects?
And what about Kuss? He almost lost the jersey right there & then on Bejes when no one chased. If those were team orders... then it's a one way street, isn't it? All for Vingegaard.
Truthfully, I believe both Vingegaard & his DS (Niermann most likely) are at fault for engineering an attack which seriously hurt his teammates in GC. Yesterday on the slopes of the Angliru we merely witnessed the natural escalation of that GC battle.
There's not much else to it.
- Feb 20, 2010
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How did the attack on Bejes seriously hurt his teammates on GC? It's not like they lost time or positions. They just made their own position at the top of the GC more secure.
Remember, they have lost races by letting the wrong people go (Giro 2019) and by not gaining time when they had the legs to (Tour 2020) before. Riders can always get sick, have a pajará, or crash out. We've seen a couple of safe-looking GTs change hands late on as a result of this - Simon Yates at the 2018 Giro, Tom Dumoulin at the 2015 Vuelta - and Sepp Kuss is not a proven GC rider largely because historically he's always had a bad day here and there and hasn't settled in to a leadership role, preferring the pressure off, so they would surely want to have contingency plans in place to ensure they still won the race if he faltered.
They put the onus for chasing on others, but it seems the rest of the teams are now pretty much cowed into submission. None bar UAE have the numbers to contend and no individual rider has the strength to, so why should they chase just to help Jumbo sort out their internal hierarchy, when Jumbo riding against one another is their only remaining chance of getting onto the podium?
Remember, they have lost races by letting the wrong people go (Giro 2019) and by not gaining time when they had the legs to (Tour 2020) before. Riders can always get sick, have a pajará, or crash out. We've seen a couple of safe-looking GTs change hands late on as a result of this - Simon Yates at the 2018 Giro, Tom Dumoulin at the 2015 Vuelta - and Sepp Kuss is not a proven GC rider largely because historically he's always had a bad day here and there and hasn't settled in to a leadership role, preferring the pressure off, so they would surely want to have contingency plans in place to ensure they still won the race if he faltered.
They put the onus for chasing on others, but it seems the rest of the teams are now pretty much cowed into submission. None bar UAE have the numbers to contend and no individual rider has the strength to, so why should they chase just to help Jumbo sort out their internal hierarchy, when Jumbo riding against one another is their only remaining chance of getting onto the podium?
- Nov 16, 2013
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How can you even ask this question?
In the fight for the win, the attack and subsequent UAE-show absolutely hurt them both.
If one still subscribes to the fantasy that they're all equally happy with either of the three winning, then of course it didn't hurt them, but nobody really thinks that anymore.
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