What do you think should be done about stage 16?

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What would you do about stage 16?

  • Other (say below)

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    0
  • Poll closed .
Sep 4, 2013
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jaylew said:
Why are you surprised when that's the solution the teams came up with?
Yes, it would be a solution to make every DS happy. But it wouldn't be a legitimate result. Either the results counts or it doesn't. Period
 
At this point, I'm not sure imposing a time penalty is even allowed by the rules. The courses of action open to the organizer when there is an "Incident," again, are these:

• to modify the course,
• to temporarily neutralize the race or stage,
• to declare a stage null and void,
• to cancel part of a stage as well as the results of any possible intermediate classifications and to restart the stage near the place of the incident,
• to let the results stand or
• to restart the race or stage, taking account of the gaps recorded at the moment of the incident.

Obviously, since the stage is completed, some of the options aren't available. The only things they could do under the rules, as I understand them, would be to (1) declare the entire stage void for everyone, (2) let the results stand, or (3) restage the day's race from the bottom of the Stelvio (a practical impossibility).
 
Aug 31, 2012
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Take away the time gained from the descent, that is the closest approximation we could get to the results that would have been, had the race organisation not ****ed up and miscommunicated.
 
I voted to adjust the time for the three riders in order to keep everybody happy. Hec, even Movistar agreed to this.

After reading most of the posts in the other thread I see there is too much confusion and not one solution that will make everybody happy. But at least all the DS's from the teams involved in the race agreed on something.

These reflects the thoughts from the posts 2463, 2478 and 2484 from Mellow Velo, Cineteq and FoxxyBrown1111 in the other thread.
 
Aug 4, 2010
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Fearless Greg Lemond said:
DSQ:

Movistar
Europcar
Sky
the Columbians
Ag2R
Yellow Fluids

Kick m all out of this Giro!
Lol I hope this is ironic post;),cuz its ridiculous to dq those teams and LOL! riders acordding to their nationality (even bad written:eek:)?You cannot be serious:eek:.If you are,it would be totaly understable with your signature,Lemond signature only makes you look stupid,as he is one of the biggest clowns of our sport in history.

Edit:Ok,I see it was irony,taking back then :)
 
I voted to keep the results.

It has been discussed it to the last bit on the stage 16 thread, and yet people are willing to drag this issue purposelessly. :rolleyes:

bottom line: RCS did not do anything about it when the incident was happening, nor they took proper action afterwards when the stage was over, neither within the next 24 hours, & having already had the next stage completed- is simply nothing they could or would do to reverse it.

RCS fvcked up -then deal with it-but please don't intend to re write history.
 
Jul 6, 2012
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The way i see it, the problem is not the miscomunication. The problem is the teams that "lost" now wan't to take advantage of something when the fault lies on them alone.

So the information was ambiguous: keep racing untill things are clear, and as a DS you should press the organisation to clarify things ASAP. They had lots of time to change things and did exactly nothing until way after the end of the stage.

When watching the stage, the first time I heard neutralization mentioned they're still half way throug climbing the stelvio, if the information was not clear they could have asked to clarify things.

After that when some riders attacked on the descent they had all the way until the bottom to ask the organisation about what was happening and make a decision, and they could have:
1. contact the riders and tell them they should stop the attack
2. make the attacking group wait at the bottom if needed.
They've done absolutely nothing.

The same thing when they're on the last climb, nothing was done, even at the very end no one even mentioned a thing.

Leave things as they are and move on. No one to blame but themselves.

The way things are now it seems more like a bunch of sore losers that lost fair and square, and realized later that there was some confusion on the media and are now trying to take advantage of things.
 
hfer07 said:
I voted to keep the results.

It has been discussed it to the last bit on the stage 16 thread, and yet people are willing to drag this issue purposelessly. :rolleyes:

bottom line: RCS did not do anything about it when the incident was happening, nor they took proper action afterwards when the stage was over, neither within the next 24 hours, & having already had the next stage completed- is simply nothing they could or would do to reverse it.

RCS fvcked up -then deal with it-but please don't intend to re write history.
Well, the rules do allow for "after the fact" corrections and punishments to be handed down (even to the point of stripping Grand Tour "winners" of their placings for rules violations that came to light post-race), so the timeline isn't really all that germane. I'm still researching this, but of the options in this poll (setting aside the last two, of course), the only things allowed to the organizers or the commissaires at this point would seem to be to either declare the entire stage null and void or let the results stand. And to my understanding they could take the former action at any point if new information came forward, even after the Tour is completed.

On the day, the actions of the race organizers were inadequate to say the least. They seem to have ignored even the insufficiently robust and specific rules they had to rely on, to the detriment of their own race.

But again, I believe the interests of the sport, the race, and even the negatively impacted riders are all best served by letting the results stand and by following the rules as they are written.
 
christopherrowe said:
Well, the rules do allow for "after the fact" corrections and punishments to be handed down (even to the point of stripping Grand Tour "winners" of their placings for rules violations that came to light post-race), so the timeline isn't really all that germane. I'm still researching this, but of the options in this poll (setting aside the last two, of course), the only things allowed to the organizers or the commissaires at this point would seem to be to either declare the entire stage null and void or let the results stand. And to my understanding they could take the former action at any point if new information came forward, even after the Tour is completed.

On the day, the actions of the race organizers were inadequate to say the least. They seem to have ignored even the insufficiently robust and specific rules they had to rely on, to the detriment of their own race.

But again, I believe the interests of the sport, the race, and even the negatively impacted riders are all best served by letting the results stand and by following the rules as they are written.
Pardon me, but I seem to understand that in your view a "doping" offense and a On-road/in situ incident caused by the Organizers are equally liable to be "overturn"? :rolleyes:

hope you're kidding :eek:
 
Oct 13, 2012
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The race organisers were watching the same images we were. They saw Cataldo attacking on the descent so they knew at least one rider was putting time in. If they had a problem they should have done something about it there and then. It's far too late to change the result (regardless of whether they could do it or not, according to the rules), if they couldn't make their mind up on it on the day while they race would going then just let the result stand. Force Uran, Evans et al to have to attack for the remainder of the race because they weren't willing (or able?) to go with the leading group on Stelvio.
 
hfer07 said:
I voted to keep the results.

It has been discussed it to the last bit on the stage 16 thread, and yet people are willing to drag this issue purposelessly. :rolleyes:

bottom line: RCS did not do anything about it when the incident was happening, nor they took proper action afterwards when the stage was over, neither within the next 24 hours, & having already had the next stage completed- is simply nothing they could or would do to reverse it.

RCS fvcked up -then deal with it-but please don't intend to re write history.
Of course now is too late. I agree with you with keep as it is. Maybe the title should have been" What would you have done".
 
If an illegal feed in last part of a stage or drafting a team car can mean a time penalty , then passing a red flag motor can also allow the organisers to give out a time penalty surely. I think a one and half minute penalty to anyone who overtook a motor with a red flag would probably do the job.
 
hfer07 said:
Pardon me, but I seem to understand that in your view a "doping" offense and a On-road/in situ incident caused by the Organizers are equally liable to be "overturn"? :rolleyes:

hope you're kidding :eek:
Oh, no, I don't think they're equally likely to be overturned at all. I'm merely stating that it's my interpretation of the rules as written that such an outcome would be supported by said rules (as written). The likelihood of such occurring, especially on a Grand Tour, seems vanishingly small. I point it out simply as part of larger projects: (1) I'd like people to look at this particular incident in the light of the UCI rules as they are written and enforced (or not enforced), and (2) I'd like to see community agitation for rules reform in the service of increasing rider safety, decreasing human errors of judgement on the parts of organizers and commissaires, and increasing sporting excitement.
 

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