- Mar 17, 2009
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Reading part 2 of the excerpts from the interview produced this nugget:
Which seemed to conflict with his criticism of Contador in the first part of the interview.
So what should Contador have done? Spent less time training and focusing on winning the Tour de France and more time building a team behind the rest of his team's back, and taking most, if not all of the staff and riders with him? Announcing his new team at the Prologue?
Which seemed to conflict with his criticism of Contador in the first part of the interview.
So what should Contador have done? Spent less time training and focusing on winning the Tour de France and more time building a team behind the rest of his team's back, and taking most, if not all of the staff and riders with him? Announcing his new team at the Prologue?
Slayer said:Is there a longer version of the interview somewhere that I haven't read? I'm trying to work out what is making people so upset.
Come on, read between the lines. If you threw a piece a meat to a pack of ravenous hyenas and they didn't use a knife and fork you really wouldn't need to question their manners. Same animal, different day. Who do you trust? LMAO
Hi Everyone. I started the thread, but stayed away so as not to try to influence any conversation beyond that. I just need to vent a bit now that the dust has settled. For a while there it seemed that Lance moved into a Bizarro World where everything he had done to Contador had actually been done by Contador to him. He even tried a version of he's a great cyclist, but I don't think anything of him beyond that.
The rest was a bunch of stuff tossed together to make it seem like a whole case against Contador to make the accusations of using the Spanish media to spread lies and make personal attacks.
I've been trying to fight the battle elsewhere, so haven't followed anything but the counts here. I apologize if this repeats something already said. But the whole story about looking in the mirror, and trying to make it look like it's Contador's fault that his teammates left is such utter nonsense, and another attempt to rewrite history. The rest of this is from an e-mail I sent to a couple of cycling publications, including CN, after seeing the coverage. Happy New Year, everyone, and thanks for contributing to the discussion.
Armstrong's statements are really thin when applied to common knowledge of what went on in the past five months. He faults Contador for not doing enough to keep his Tour de France teammates with Astana. He claims he would have done whatever was necessary in that situation, he says, and taken a long look in the mirror. In real life, he was starting to sign away those teammates in July. Bruyneel stayed in the manager position and worked some kind of deal to get everyone he wanted out of their 2010 contracts. I read at least four Radio Shack signees - Chechu Rubiera was one - that said that Johan had recruited them personally for Team Radio Shack (while JB was being paid by Astana). These were just the ones that casually mentioned it when their signing was announced.
Contador had no power to offer anyone anything. People expected Astana to lose their license, and Alberto planned to join an existing, complete team like Garmin, Quick Step, or Caisse D'Epargne. By the time Bruyneel finally stepped aside and allowed new management in the form of Sanquer and Martinelli to step in, all eight of Contador's Tour teammates had been signed away. But the interviewer who was invited to Armstrong's spacious home in a star-studded California neighborhood never bothered to mention that. Lance was spouting nonsense that was the opposite of reality just so that it would seem that he can handle any situation better than Contador.
Lance was around 27 years and 10 months when he won his first Tour de France. Alberto has won two already, plus a Giro and a Vuelta, which apparently have no value in Armstrong's eyes. He also has time to race another Tour de France, and hopefully a Vuelta, and still be younger than Armstrong was at his first podium. Armstrong was years older when he had a famous "bonk" during one of the Tours. Contador suffered one during Paris-Nice, and Lance told the world that Alberto still has a lot to learn.
The main reason that the cycling world is letting these personal attacks against Contador continue is that Alberto was universally misquoted after the Tour, causing sensational headlines. Reuters and the BBC both posted video of the interview with simultaneous expert translation. Here's my transcription:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/8172975.stm
http://www.reuters.com/news/video?videoChannel=1004&videoId=108718
My favorite photo the whole year was the perfect Graham Watson shot of Lance intercepting a water bottle Gutierrez offered to Contador on Mont Ventoux. Gutierrez is the one who told the story about trying to give water to his friend who had no bottle. Alberto refused Lance's sloppy seconds, and I can understand him not wanting to share saliva. But water on Mont Ventoux has the value of water in the desert, and the story is true and the photo is real.
The rest was a bunch of stuff tossed together to make it seem like a whole case against Contador to make the accusations of using the Spanish media to spread lies and make personal attacks.
I've been trying to fight the battle elsewhere, so haven't followed anything but the counts here. I apologize if this repeats something already said. But the whole story about looking in the mirror, and trying to make it look like it's Contador's fault that his teammates left is such utter nonsense, and another attempt to rewrite history. The rest of this is from an e-mail I sent to a couple of cycling publications, including CN, after seeing the coverage. Happy New Year, everyone, and thanks for contributing to the discussion.
Armstrong's statements are really thin when applied to common knowledge of what went on in the past five months. He faults Contador for not doing enough to keep his Tour de France teammates with Astana. He claims he would have done whatever was necessary in that situation, he says, and taken a long look in the mirror. In real life, he was starting to sign away those teammates in July. Bruyneel stayed in the manager position and worked some kind of deal to get everyone he wanted out of their 2010 contracts. I read at least four Radio Shack signees - Chechu Rubiera was one - that said that Johan had recruited them personally for Team Radio Shack (while JB was being paid by Astana). These were just the ones that casually mentioned it when their signing was announced.
Contador had no power to offer anyone anything. People expected Astana to lose their license, and Alberto planned to join an existing, complete team like Garmin, Quick Step, or Caisse D'Epargne. By the time Bruyneel finally stepped aside and allowed new management in the form of Sanquer and Martinelli to step in, all eight of Contador's Tour teammates had been signed away. But the interviewer who was invited to Armstrong's spacious home in a star-studded California neighborhood never bothered to mention that. Lance was spouting nonsense that was the opposite of reality just so that it would seem that he can handle any situation better than Contador.
Lance was around 27 years and 10 months when he won his first Tour de France. Alberto has won two already, plus a Giro and a Vuelta, which apparently have no value in Armstrong's eyes. He also has time to race another Tour de France, and hopefully a Vuelta, and still be younger than Armstrong was at his first podium. Armstrong was years older when he had a famous "bonk" during one of the Tours. Contador suffered one during Paris-Nice, and Lance told the world that Alberto still has a lot to learn.
The main reason that the cycling world is letting these personal attacks against Contador continue is that Alberto was universally misquoted after the Tour, causing sensational headlines. Reuters and the BBC both posted video of the interview with simultaneous expert translation. Here's my transcription:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/other_sports/cycling/8172975.stm
http://www.reuters.com/news/video?videoChannel=1004&videoId=108718
My favorite photo the whole year was the perfect Graham Watson shot of Lance intercepting a water bottle Gutierrez offered to Contador on Mont Ventoux. Gutierrez is the one who told the story about trying to give water to his friend who had no bottle. Alberto refused Lance's sloppy seconds, and I can understand him not wanting to share saliva. But water on Mont Ventoux has the value of water in the desert, and the story is true and the photo is real.
theswordsman said:
“I was in the breakaway when the group of Armstrong and Contador caught up with me. I was on the left of the road when Contador got to me. I offered him my bottle because I saw that he didn’t have any water and I am his friend,” says Ian Gutierrez, who is number one in breakaways (in the entire Tour did 581 miles by himself.) “But, I extended my arm with the water when Armstrong who was a little behind me grabbed it on the fly taking it from Alberto’s reach. After drinking it, he offered it to Alberto, but he passed. And he was going to keep it when I reminded him it was mine and for him to return it."
You mean that one..
I'm tired of this Armstrong vs. Contador vs. everyone vs. he said this, he said that bulls**t!!!
I'm rooting for Andy Schleck!
I'm rooting for Andy Schleck!
- Mar 17, 2009
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Velonation has a more complete version of the interview:
http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/2642/Armstrong-reflects-on-2009-takes-different-approach-to-Tour.aspx
It's amazing watching someone try to rewrite history on the fly, but that's what Lance is doing (in small ways). I guess it's what he has to do to make sure he's motivated coming into the season, but it still is a strange phenomenon to see.
I'm so looking forward to the start of the season. Happy New Year's!!!!
http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/2642/Armstrong-reflects-on-2009-takes-different-approach-to-Tour.aspx
It's amazing watching someone try to rewrite history on the fly, but that's what Lance is doing (in small ways). I guess it's what he has to do to make sure he's motivated coming into the season, but it still is a strange phenomenon to see.
I'm so looking forward to the start of the season. Happy New Year's!!!!
- Jul 1, 2009
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But the main difficulty will be, once again, the competition. Former teammate Alberto Contador "will be very hard to beat. Like Andy Schleck. He is a very good rider, perhaps the best we ever saw.”
This is the part to worry about, when Lance starts praising you.
Don't listen to it Alberto. Keep playing the Danish National Anthem, every day.
This is the part to worry about, when Lance starts praising you.
Don't listen to it Alberto. Keep playing the Danish National Anthem, every day.
- Aug 12, 2009
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L29205 said:
Didn't you hear? Garmin ride the bike manufactured originally for triathlons. A Felt. Honestly who buys a Trek before a Specialised or a Cervelo? Check out a triathlon event. What bike is the most popular amongst Ironman competitors? Colnago, Giant, Trek, Pinnnarello, Scott, Orbea, Cervelo or Specialized? It's not Trek. I'm almost tempted to offer a prize to the first person who guesses correctly.
Don't get me started on the wheels. Yes they looked nice. Zipp look better. Perform and sell far better as well. What do pro triathletes (the ones who win) use? You guessed it, Zipp. Maybe Americans are daft enough to buy a product because Lance uses it, but he doesn't have the best, he just says he does. But you are right about triathletes finding some appeal in Lance. Most are daft and have no clue who he really is. A hero? In some of their eyes. But not a distinguishing portion.
My point is the majority of the triathlon market do not buy products because Lance uses them. They buy the best they can afford and that is neither Trek, nor HED.
- Aug 13, 2009
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Polish
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gonna party like its 1999
If you have followed the sport for the last 2 decades, it would have become clear LONG LONG ago that Lance has a dislikeable side to him. Lance was instantly dislikeable upon arriving in Europe to race in the early 90's...just ask Moreno Argentin lol.
Lance has been consistently dislikeable his whole career.
You are right, though, in thinking many fanboys may have their
bubbles burst boohoo waawaa. HTFU fanboys.
Self-Inflicted Dismantling? It is only Lance being the same old Lance.
Just wait until Lance is Hinault's age....fat and bald....Alberto
an 8 time TdF winner...that should be lovely too.
PS....Contador was a weenie, whining about the wheels waawaa.
Francois the Postman said:
If you have followed the sport for the last 2 decades, it would have become clear LONG LONG ago that Lance has a dislikeable side to him. Lance was instantly dislikeable upon arriving in Europe to race in the early 90's...just ask Moreno Argentin lol.
Lance has been consistently dislikeable his whole career.
You are right, though, in thinking many fanboys may have their
bubbles burst boohoo waawaa. HTFU fanboys.
Self-Inflicted Dismantling? It is only Lance being the same old Lance.
Just wait until Lance is Hinault's age....fat and bald....Alberto
an 8 time TdF winner...that should be lovely too.
PS....Contador was a weenie, whining about the wheels waawaa.
Galic Ho said:
Poor Alberto and Astana, how did they ever beat those other teams in the TT and ITT with such inferior equipment?
Also, who gives a damn what triathletes ride? When a triathlete holds the hour record, then I'll give a damn.
- Nov 2, 2009
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I am eagerly awaiting Lance's next retirement. Can't wait. Can't wait. Can't wait.
It seems to me that Lance probably suffers from a personality disorder, likely Borderline or Narcissistic Personality Disorder, or a combination of both. It would account for a lot of his behaviour.
Doesn't account for his riding of a bike ..... although as many people have noted on other threads, he seems to be motivated by perceived grievances and personal grudges and this does fit the behavioural patterns of people with these PDs. And fits with his "Complete Control" approach to teamwork.
It seems to me that Lance probably suffers from a personality disorder, likely Borderline or Narcissistic Personality Disorder, or a combination of both. It would account for a lot of his behaviour.
Doesn't account for his riding of a bike ..... although as many people have noted on other threads, he seems to be motivated by perceived grievances and personal grudges and this does fit the behavioural patterns of people with these PDs. And fits with his "Complete Control" approach to teamwork.
- Dec 23, 2009
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The thing is lance doesnt really have anything to lose anymore. so he is going after grudges which is the wrong way to do things. He is just making himself look bad, but it will be interesting to see when he and basso go at it again. but the fact is he isnt the same old lance he needs to shut his mouth ride his bike. he isnt the best anymore.
- Jul 4, 2009
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Galic Ho said:
Well, I guess you are a little late in the understanding of tri-geeks. Quintana Roo was the the first of the specialized bikes for the Tri-geeks they brought the 78 Degree seat tube angles and 650c wheels to the market.
Next you are looking at the the average joe going out to do a triathlon. You are not looking at a person whose goal is to get to Kona. That person is willing to spend what ever they have. hey will spend whatever to buy the fastest wheels on the market. I was not talking about Trek when I was bringing this up. I was talking about HED and their marketing.
Polish
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Spare Tyre said:
So back to the OP, may I presume you feel that Lance is not telling the truth in regards to WheelGate and Alberto is? Fair enough.
Well, at least Lance will serve as a Beacon of Inspiration and Hope for all those suffering with Borderline Personality Disorder.
BTW, what do you make of Alberto's obsession with Finger Bang Bang?
Is it a defense mechanism triggered by psychotic hallucinatory images springing out of a paranoidal worldview reinforced by legions of YesMen?
Maybe that is why he hangs out in his Pueblo so much?
thehog
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- Jul 27, 2009
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Do I look worried?
Do you feel that when he calls you “pistolero,” deep down, Armstrong is sending a message that he admires you?
The pistol sign is just a gesture, it’s not really important. And I don’t want controversy of any sort. I don’t see it as admiration. It’s not something that I can say I like.
Is it worth the trouble of everything that’s happened—three weeks of greatest difficulty, as you said, an impossible relationship with the best cyclist in recent years, plus an entire year of sacrifices—to win the Tour?
Yes, of course. The sacrifice to win the victory is huge, but what you give the Tour, you don’t give to any other race. And the satisfaction is always worth more when it comes with suffering. The higher the price, the better it feels.
Is all your life as a champion compatible with being a normal guy from Pinto?
No doubt, no doubt, no doubt. I consider myself a very normal person, although I’ve got less time than before to be with my friends. It’s clear that I miss having time for myself, but it is possible to live a normal life. And it’s what I want. I enjoy the bike and my work, I don’t aspire to more.
Do you do the same things for fun that you used to do?
That’s right.
There are athletes who want to be something more, to become celebrities, people who are said to be charming, who are idols…Is becoming a celebrity a fascination to you, becoming something more than a guy from Pinto who won the Tour?
No, no. I don’t want to give up being a regular person and make myself a celebrity. It’s natural to me to be quite modest, and that’s what I want. Although now with the victories I get a lot of attention, I want nothing to do with the glamorous life of the stars.
Many of your colleagues have become fanatics about Facebook, about Twitter, about Tuenti, all of them social networks. That’s what people of your age—twentysomethings—are like. You, on the other hand, are reluctant.
All the means of communication are good as long as you have the ability to control them. They allow you to make contact with a lot of people, and whoever has the most is the most popular. Yes, I do have my profile on all the social networks, but I redirect them to my webpage, and when I want to send a message from there I send it. But I don’t have any active profile for talking through them. In the end it’s too time-consuming, and I don’t have so much time that I can afford to spend it like that.
Do you feel that when he calls you “pistolero,” deep down, Armstrong is sending a message that he admires you?
The pistol sign is just a gesture, it’s not really important. And I don’t want controversy of any sort. I don’t see it as admiration. It’s not something that I can say I like.
Is it worth the trouble of everything that’s happened—three weeks of greatest difficulty, as you said, an impossible relationship with the best cyclist in recent years, plus an entire year of sacrifices—to win the Tour?
Yes, of course. The sacrifice to win the victory is huge, but what you give the Tour, you don’t give to any other race. And the satisfaction is always worth more when it comes with suffering. The higher the price, the better it feels.
Is all your life as a champion compatible with being a normal guy from Pinto?
No doubt, no doubt, no doubt. I consider myself a very normal person, although I’ve got less time than before to be with my friends. It’s clear that I miss having time for myself, but it is possible to live a normal life. And it’s what I want. I enjoy the bike and my work, I don’t aspire to more.
Do you do the same things for fun that you used to do?
That’s right.
There are athletes who want to be something more, to become celebrities, people who are said to be charming, who are idols…Is becoming a celebrity a fascination to you, becoming something more than a guy from Pinto who won the Tour?
No, no. I don’t want to give up being a regular person and make myself a celebrity. It’s natural to me to be quite modest, and that’s what I want. Although now with the victories I get a lot of attention, I want nothing to do with the glamorous life of the stars.
Many of your colleagues have become fanatics about Facebook, about Twitter, about Tuenti, all of them social networks. That’s what people of your age—twentysomethings—are like. You, on the other hand, are reluctant.
All the means of communication are good as long as you have the ability to control them. They allow you to make contact with a lot of people, and whoever has the most is the most popular. Yes, I do have my profile on all the social networks, but I redirect them to my webpage, and when I want to send a message from there I send it. But I don’t have any active profile for talking through them. In the end it’s too time-consuming, and I don’t have so much time that I can afford to spend it like that.
Nice kit. From the eyebrows up, Periero looks like Frankie Andreu. Vino looks like the cat that ate the canary.
Jonathan Vaughters on Twitter today: "Alberto called this AM to wish me Happy New Yr. Controversies aside & that we'll be trying to beat him this year, he is a polite young man."
Jonathan Vaughters on Twitter today: "Alberto called this AM to wish me Happy New Yr. Controversies aside & that we'll be trying to beat him this year, he is a polite young man."
- Aug 13, 2009
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Say what you like about Vino, but I could never see Armstrong in a team photo, where his off centre and a step behind, in deference.
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