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Wiggo as a climber is on par with Nibali, at the very least. And there's a 50 k flattish TT in the race. If he approaches the form of the Tour next year, I don't see how Nibali can beat him.Afrank said:Different team, different parcours, different climbs, different competition, different level of motivation. Just because Wiggo beat Nibali on a course custom made for him doesn't necessarily mean he can do it again in a completely different race.
Afrank said:Just because Wiggo beat Nibali on a course custom made for him doesn't necessarily mean he can do it again in a completely different race.
airstream said:He smashed Nibali and he would have smashed Nibali even more unsparingly if it had been needed. It was an unconditional victory on all counts. Everything Nibali could do on the climbs was miserable school boy La Toussuire move when he could hang at the distance of 15-20 sec during 4-5 km's. What are we talking about?
wait, Nibali attacked on the descent in that stage? I must have missed thatPentacycle said:Very much true. His best performance was the 2010 Giro, still without the pressure of leadership. In the 2011 Giro he attacked on a descent, but immediately dropped on the next climb. He did the same in TdF, on the stage to Peyragudes, but he finished the stage together with Van Garderen. Terrific rider indeed. His podium spot symbolized the poor field of the Tour.
Pentacycle said:Very much true. His best performance was the 2010 Giro, still without the pressure of leadership. In the 2011 Giro he attacked on a descent, but immediately dropped on the next climb. He did the same in TdF, on the stage to Peyragudes, but he finished the stage together with Van Garderen. Terrific rider indeed. His podium spot symbolized the poor field of the Tour.
Eshnar said:wait, Nibali attacked on the descent in that stage? I must have missed that
You're trying to confuse some readers here. The only serious attack was on stage 10 on the descent of Grand Colombier. In the stage (17) that Valverde won, he was already injured. It was just a bluff attack in an effort to mask his injury, but Valverde convinced him to drop back to the peloton so that the breakaway would have a chance.Pentacycle said:Very much true. His best performance was the 2010 Giro, still without the pressure of leadership. In the 2011 Giro he attacked on a descent, but immediately dropped on the next climb. He did the same in TdF, on the stage to Peyragudes, but he finished the stage together with Van Garderen. Terrific rider indeed. His podium spot symbolized the poor field of the Tour.
cineteq said:Thanks. I guess Henao/Uran combo is option 9
Poor guys, for some posters and Sky, they're always the mules, the donkeys, the columbians...but never mentioned by their names. No much respect for them.
PS: Not talking about you or the OP.
airstream said:He smashed Nibali and he would have smashed Nibali even more unsparingly if it had been needed. It was an unconditional victory on all counts. Everything Nibali could do on the climbs was miserable school boy La Toussuire move when he could hang at the distance of 15-20 sec during 4-5 km's. What are we talking about?
oh, right. Wasn't exactly the same as he did in the Giro though.jens_attacks said:yes he followed the breakaway early on the mente descent but alejandro told him to stop.
Eshnar said:wait, Nibali attacked on the descent in that stage? I must have missed that
That wasn't a proper attack so I just deleted it from my memoryDazed and Confused said:We forgive you. Most of us nodded off multiple times during most stages.
18-Valve. (pithy) said:We're talking about a climb that suited Wiggins perfectly... and yet he still got dropped by his teammate.
The absence of them. Or their bad positions.airstream said:What didn't let Nibali attack on more suited climbs?
Planches des Belles Filles. Attack! I don't wanna...Eshnar said:The absence of them. Or their bad positions.
He's not an outstanding master, but he should be better than Wiggins. Again we have no proof since the Tour had none of them But Nibbles did very well on the Zonc in 2011 and last year he was easily with the very best on the Muro di Sormano. So I'd say he goes pretty well on steep climbs.airstream said:Planches des Belles Filles. Attack! I don't wanna...
My opinion is there is no principal difference between a 6% av. climb and an 8-8.5% one. If one is good, one is good at any climbs and it works almost always. A really powerful team can arrange an up-and-downer even on a climb like.. Sierra Nevada... I don't know. It is exceptionally a matter of purpose. But even if it is the case. Since when has Nibali became an outstanding master of steep ramps?
Eshnar said:He's not an outstanding master, but he should be better than Wiggins. Again we have no proof since the Tour had none of them But Nibbles did very well on the Zonc in 2011 and last year he was easily with the very best on the Muro di Sormano. So I'd say he goes pretty well on steep climbs.
Let's say I expect him to lose a bit more but you're right, the Wiggins of last Tour would never lose as much as he gained in the ITT. But we have to see if he will be the same of the Tour, I already said that in the beginning and in the former thread too.airstream said:What does the Giro include but Trecime? Some 2-3k 9-10% pieces in the second week. That's it. Wiggins is not an idiot. He will not try to contest against Nibali or Rodriguez in explosiveness. He will lose 10-15 seconds in cold blood..
Eshnar said:Let's say I expect him to lose a bit more but you're right, the Wiggins of last Tour would never lose as much as he gained in the ITT. But we have to see if he will be the same of the Tour, I already said that in the beginning and in the former thread too.
In the next Giro Le Tre Cime is the only one overly steep climb, but there are at least 4-5 climbs that are harder than anything Wiggins saw at the last Tour (except maybe Croix De Fer) plus a dozen of small and explosive climbs in the medium mountain stages, which could be very dangerous if his opponents try to exploit them (not sure if they will ofc). Also you could consider that in the next Giro Wiggins will likely remain without teammates at a certain point, something that last year never happened.