in my humble view, much of the macrofactors involved are of a social/sociohistorical nature.Mrs John Murphy said:... nor do I see society as to blame.
Before I read your post, I was thinking who is this Basescase and why is he/she clogging the forums with endless new threads/polls that are often useless or redundant.BroDeal said:Who is to blame for all these stupid polls that have infested The Clinic?
Is that not environment/culture/values rather than society? I agree with your point.sniper said:on a microlevel, the numerous fans and journos with whool pulled over their eyes played a significant role. We owe it to these people that USPS wasn't the first and won't be the last big PED-scandal.
in my humble view, much of the macrofactors involved are of a social/sociohistorical nature.
the disproportionate amount of money involved in topsport, in turn a result of the power of capitalism, media, etc.
Sadly your last comment is very true.FitSsikS said:They are like.....dare I say it?....A type of cancer.
Btw, coincidentally cancer is also to blame for the Lance fiasco.
Yeah but most of the fans doing the attacking were the Armstong fans who as shown many times were not the same as real cycling fans. What % of fans are really knowledgeable about the goings on in the sport. I would say a small minority.Mrs John Murphy said:I don't see how the fans can get away without blame.
They were the ones who refused to question their heroes and still do. We only have to look at the Wiggins, Dertie, Frodo fanboys out there who take any questioning of their heroes as a personal offense.
Fans were the ones who were active in disseminating and spreading the attacks on the likes of O'Reilly, Andreau etc, fans were the ones who allowed the media, authorities etc to get away with not asking questions.
The fact that fans refuse to take responsibility is the main reason why although Armstrong is gone, the likes of Riis, Dertie, Brailsford etc are allowed to remain and pollute cycling.
Wait. I thought those were the three guys who had returned samples with EPO like Lance in the AFLD re-tests. Did they also test positive for cortisone.hrotha said:
Nope - these guys were not on corticoids, so they had nothing backdated.hrotha said:
what a load of bull. many riders have confirmed in recent years that the 1998 tour changed a lot and that the 99 tour outside of armstrong was very clean. it was armstrong who restarted the fraud and made it far worse. even ullrich was riding without juice in 2000 and 2001. zulle without epo almost beat lance in 99 if it wasn't for passage du bois.Froome19 said:To be honest I do not see how Lance was to blame. The whole peloton would have been doping regardless of whether Lance came onto the scene or not. If anything Lance attracted attention to the issue in subsequent years.
yes, those 4 where the only ones who had epo in them. 1999 tour was very clean. even lance's teammates didn't use any epo at all except hamilton and livingston in a few mountainstages. but when lance was save in yellow they stopped as well and so did lanceMrs John Murphy said:were the other EPO positives ever named?