women are right!

[Matthijs]

It's such a moronic discussion really. "I only want to watch men's cycling because men are stronger than women". Who the f.ck cares, as long as there is a level playing field? I'd choose the Giro Donne anytime over 90% of men's races.

I think your right. Women's racing, or any womens sport shouldn't be compared to mens sport. The level of a sport is not significant to me. But the competition can be compared.
If there are 1000 full time men pro racers and 60 parttime pro women racers, for me it's fair if the price is lower. If the women race over distances as long as 17 year old boys do, it's fair too. In the Marathon the women can take more time, but run the same length.
I can imagine there is some difference in length. But the differences are too high. To me, the UCI has to make sure half of the WT races has a womens race. If a country has 4 WT events, there should be 2 lady's Tours/one day events. Every monument and every GT a weeklong race. If that happens, women cycling can grow and become more mature. Then I will consider equel payment.
Besides, sport is entertainment. Nobody is saying Madonna and Michael Jackson should earn the samen.
And yes off course I watch Sporza, if you stick with the NOS you never learn anything about cycling. They just **** about doping, not about racing.

Climbing times after 260 and 130k are not to be compared. Still a great accomplishment of Vos though.

Sporza btw focusses on Belgium guys off course, but also on Dutch cyclist. A lot of interviews (same language) and knowedge about Dutch cyclist. If there are 20 Belgiums who can win and 5 Dutch guys, they ignore the Dutch. But if there are 8 Belgiums and 3 Dutch guys, they will talk a lot about the Dutch riders too. Probably because allmost all Dutch pro's ride from their junior years topraces in Belgium and the Sporza people know them better then most Wallons.

 

[maltiv]

Didn't Marianne Vos ride up the final climb of the Cauberg at the Worlds in the same time as Philippe Gilbert? Good luck with that.

20 seconds slower, actually.

It's a shame the competition in women's cycling is so low, but if the races actually were televised and the payments increased then obviously more girls would come to the sport, resulting in a higher level of competition. At the moment it's a bit ridiculous that Marianne Vos is by far the best sprinter, climber, puncheur, classics-specialist and CX rider (probably track+MTB as well) in the world. She's an amazing athlete, no doubt, but if there were more competition she obviously wouldn't be able to dominate in all those disciplines simultaneously.

 

[El Pistolero]

that's because you don't have my blog bookmarked

http://climbing-records.blogspot.ro/2012/09/caubergs-fastest-times-phil-sets-new.html

vos was/is an amazing athlete though.


there are amazing athletes in women cycling too but overall the level is a joke.

Yeah, I was looking through your posts because I knew you kept track of them.

I bookmarked it now though.

 

[Bavarianrider]

Women belong in the kitchen, not on a bike

 

[The Hitch]

20 seconds slower, actually.

.

Though vos did race the last few laps whereas philbert only showed his face in the last km having sat in.the bunch all.day. With that kind of treatment vos could maybe have gone sun 1.40

 

[El Pistolero]

Though vos did race the last few laps whereas philbert only showed his face in the last km having sat in.the bunch all.day. With that kind of treatment vos could maybe have gone sun 1.40

Men's race was longer and ridden harder all the way.

If Vos was riding the men's race she would've probably struggled to finish within 5 minutes of Gilbert. The men's race was 140km longer lol... The women's race was ridden at an average of 41km/h. The men's race was ridden at an average of 44km/h.

 

[theyoungest]

that's because you don't have my blog bookmarked

http://climbing-records.blogspot.ro/2012/09/caubergs-fastest-times-phil-sets-new.html

vos was/is an amazing athlete though.


there are amazing athletes in women cycling too but overall the level is a joke.

I wonder how you calculated Vos' time? You can't actually see her crossing the Amstel Gold finish line. You can however see her crossing the overpass, in 1:10, which is about the same time as Gilbert.

And then the final part which took Gilbert 10 or 15 seconds would have taken her 35 seconds to complete... a bit hard to believe, that one.

 

[The Hitch]

Men's race was longer and ridden harder all the way.

If Vos was riding the men's race she would've probably struggled to finish within 5 minutes of Gilbert.

Yep she would but im talking about if they tackled the cauberg at equal freshness so to speak. Say if they tackled it without any pre racing. As it was i think vos would have gone into the cauberg more exhausted from her racing than Phil from sucking wheels all.day, even ifhis activity lasted longer.

 

[El Pistolero]

Yep she would but im talking about if they tackled the cauberg at equal freshness so to speak. Say if they tackled it without any pre racing. As it was i think vos would have gone into the cauberg more exhausted from her racing than Phil from sucking wheels all.day, even ifhis activity lasted longer.

She's a great athlete. If she did a more international female endurance sport I'm sure she would also be good at it. But if both were to start fresh at the Cauberg she would just get blown away. It would be interesting to see them match off though. Kinda like happens in tennis from time to time. Perhaps Golazo should organize such an event.

The only way to win the men's race was to ride conservative until the last lap though. Female racing is different, less controlled. Less money involved, so bigger risks are taken. That's my take on it anyway. Vos is also much better than the rest of the girls, male cycling is much closer at the top. Yeah Phil is better than Valverde or EBH on such a finish, but only slightly. Vos is MUCH better than the second best girl on the Cauberg. That's why I don't like comparisons between male and female cycling.

 

[theyoungest]

No, you don't like comparisons between Gilbert and [insert random rider].

Or I guess you do, because every thread turns into this very same comparison.

 

[hrotha]

Women belong in the kitchen, not on a bike

Ah yes, "ironic" male chauvinism. How novel.

 

[El Pistolero]

No, you don't like comparisons between Gilbert and [insert random rider].

Or I guess you do, because every thread turns into this very same comparison.

Lol, you're the one stating Vos went as fast as Gilbert on the Cauberg. Sorry if I debunked your statements mate. I like to use facts for my arguments instead of trying to get personal.

Feel free to show me any evidence that Vos could hold her own against Phil.

 

[theyoungest]

This discussion wasn't about Phil, but about whether mr. Ryo Hazuki could be as good as Marianne Vos if he only trained a little. Which is complete nonsense, and that's why I said how fast Vos went up the Cauberg.

The time jens_attacks calculated can't be right, so it's still up in the air whether Gilbert actually went that much faster.

 

[El Pistolero]

This discussion wasn't about Phil, but about whether mr. Ryo Hazuki could be as good as Marianne Vos if he only trained a little. Which is complete nonsense, and that's why I said how fast Vos went up the Cauberg.

The time jens_attacks calculated can't be right, so it's still up in the air whether Gilbert actually went that much faster.

That's not such a strange statement. I do athletics and I'm better at long jump than some female pro's even though I don't train like one.

 

[theyoungest]

That's not such a strange statement. I do athletics and I'm better at long jump than some female pro's even though I don't train like one.

That's one explosive effort. How do you match up against a female pro marathon runner?

 

[El Pistolero]

That's one explosive effort. How do you match up against a female pro marathon runner?

I wouldn't know, I've never run one. Even at my level athletics is specialized. You can only focus on a couple of events if you want to be competitive.

 

[maltiv]

This discussion wasn't about Phil, but about whether mr. Ryo Hazuki could be as good as Marianne Vos if he only trained a little. Which is complete nonsense, and that's why I said how fast Vos went up the Cauberg..

Maybe Ryo Hazuki should take a test on his watt at FTP and see how "close" he is to Vos...

Most continental riders, who obviously train a lot, wouldn't even be close.

 

[jens_attacks]

I wonder how you calculated Vos' time? You can't actually see her crossing the Amstel Gold finish line. You can however see her crossing the overpass, in 1:10, which is about the same time as Gilbert.

And then the final part which took Gilbert 10 or 15 seconds would have taken her 35 seconds to complete... a bit hard to believe, that one.

yes that is the case indeed
but i took another, easier reference point from the other laps






from the finish line to the arrow sign on the road, you make exactly 6 seconds.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oo37KC2s-Qw&feature=plcp

so the climb starts at 2:26:21 and vos crosses at 2:28:06.and makes it televised at the arrow at 2:28:12

time should be legit: 1:45 for marianne

now you owe me a beer

but c'mon....eyes don't lie...did you really think she went as fast as phil???

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Didn't Marianne Vos ride up the final climb of the Cauberg at the Worlds in the same time as Philippe Gilbert? Good luck with that.

It's such a moronic discussion really. "I only want to watch men's cycling because men are stronger than women". Who the f.ck cares, as long as there is a level playing field? I'd choose the Giro Donne anytime over 90% of men's races.

no she didn't and besides, it was after what 140 km? after 270 km she wouldn't even be left in the race

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Oscar sevilla and Felix cardenas are the best climbers in the world?



What is the point of this post? We are trying to compare the times of.vos and Gilbert up the cauberg from the 2012 worlds and you post the time for every other cauberg ascent in history apart.from the relevant ones

no, but others are. or do you think quintana, soler, henao etc were/are from a different countries?

 

[jens_attacks]

no she didn't and besides, it was after what 140 km? after 270 km she wouldn't even be left in the race

i say it again,i think vos is a helluva athlete but there is no doubt in my mind too that she wouldn't have made it to the final lap with the guys.not even close.also average speed....

can't compare them, different sports almost.

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Yes, you commie lesbian.

What the above (interestingly, mostly Dutch) haters of women's cycling don't seem to realize that actually in their own country, viewership for women's cycling is as big as men's cycling. That is, if it is actually broadcasted, like at the Olympics and the Worlds.

the netherlands isn't even a real cycling countrie. shall we compare viewing numbers in real cyclign countries with woman cycling? also those are the only 2 woman races being broadcasted. far more people watch male cycling. tour, giro etc. or are you really thinking that if they would broadcats a female tour or giro the same amounts of people would watch in the netherlands?

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

This discussion wasn't about Phil, but about whether mr. Ryo Hazuki could be as good as Marianne Vos if he only trained a little. Which is complete nonsense, and that's why I said how fast Vos went up the Cauberg.

The time jens_attacks calculated can't be right, so it's still up in the air whether Gilbert actually went that much faster.

lol. I said in general I could ride harder than females in cycling. I didn't say I could ride harder than vos, besides vos is like 50 kg, of course she would outclimb me. that wasn;t even the point of argument. their level of competition is a joke. that's the point and it's true. just look at their massprints and pls come and tell me you didn't fell on the floor laughing your *** off

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

That's one explosive effort. How do you match up against a female pro marathon runner?

how would he know? he's not a marathon runner. however many amateur marathon male runners are faster than pro woman

 

[Ryo Hazuki]

Maybe Ryo Hazuki should take a test on his watt at FTP and see how "close" he is to Vos...

Most continental riders, who obviously train a lot, wouldn't even be close.

then those tests are a joke, since most male ct riders are better than vos