107th Milano - Sanremo, 19th March 2016, 291 km, WT

[Gigs_98]

This whole discussion about Demare is by far more interesting as the race itself. For the first time in a few years Milan Sanremo provides action for more than just a couple of minutes

 

[rehy90]

I think Tosatto and Capecchi were exagerrating a bit. They probably went up by themselves and Demare overtook them relatively faster drafting behind the car or maybe having a sticky bottle...so of course they were pi*sed off a bit. This is nothing new in road racing after the crash...on the other hand if he was holding onto the car its completely different situation. Anyway, these rumours (if not true) are definitely not good for cycling

 

[Lemonbaloon]

Re:

I think Tosatto and Capecchi were exagerrating a bit. They probably went up by themselves and Demare overtook them relatively faster drafting behind the car or maybe having a sticky bottle...so of course they were pi*sed off a bit. This is nothing new in road racing after the crash...on the other hand if he was holding onto the car its completely different situation. Anyway, these rumours (if not true) are definitely not good for cycling

Holding onto a car is a huge crime, but holding onto a bottle which is connected to the car through somones arm is legit? I really can not see the difference. However I understand that "sticky bottles" is nothing new in cycling.
What I am trying to say, is that they should DQ more people holding onto bottles.

 

[arthurvandelay]

Re: Re:

I think Tosatto and Capecchi were exagerrating a bit. They probably went up by themselves and Demare overtook them relatively faster drafting behind the car or maybe having a sticky bottle...so of course they were pi*sed off a bit. This is nothing new in road racing after the crash...on the other hand if he was holding onto the car its completely different situation. Anyway, these rumours (if not true) are definitely not good for cycling

Holding onto a car is a huge crime, but holding onto a bottle which is connected to the car through somones arm is legit? I really can not see the difference. However I understand that "sticky bottles" is nothing new in cycling.
What I am trying to say, is that they should DQ more people holding onto bottles.

The thing about a "sticky bottle" is you do it for the benefit of the camera: you wave and gesticulate at your derailleur, shoe, etc. It's called "plausible deniability", and one should have a bit of discretion while doing it. When called out you can say "oh my cleat was loose, oh I was dehydrated, etc." If you are hanging directly onto a car it is straight out cheating and indefensible.

 

[rehy90]

Re: Re:

I think Tosatto and Capecchi were exagerrating a bit. They probably went up by themselves and Demare overtook them relatively faster drafting behind the car or maybe having a sticky bottle...so of course they were pi*sed off a bit. This is nothing new in road racing after the crash...on the other hand if he was holding onto the car its completely different situation. Anyway, these rumours (if not true) are definitely not good for cycling

Holding onto a car is a huge crime, but holding onto a bottle which is connected to the car through somones arm is legit? I really can not see the difference. However I understand that "sticky bottles" is nothing new in cycling.
What I am trying to say, is that they should DQ more people holding onto bottles.

I think it depends on how long he was holding onto the bottle and if the car accelarated while he was holding onto it...if it was the usual stuff of a few seconds sticky bottle, then i wouldn't mind really...

 

[Tonton]

Re:

his cadence is somewhat consistent during the climb, but that just means he was spinning the pedals, which he could do while holding to the car. the power profile would be better to take conclusions.

His cadence...and his speed. No 80 km/h or even 60, or 50.

Now spinning the pedals at the same rate (and while going at the same speed) while holding onto a car than before...that seems a bit difficult for me to imagine. The rider would naturally ease the cadence, if pulled by the car, particularly when the road is not straight.

I was slowly getting swayed and increasingly skeptical. Not anymore. Unless something new and drastic comes up, I believe that Demare is the rightful winner f MSR.

 

[PremierAndrew]

Demare denies getting a tow http://www.lequipe.fr/Cyclisme-sur-route/Actualites/Arnaud-demare-face-aux-accusations-de-tricherie-je-n-ai-rien-a-me-reprocher/645166

 

[PremierAndrew]

Sur le secteur, il a grimpé en moyenne à 33,7 km/h, avec une pointe à 52,2 km/h.

Max speed of 52.2km/h on the Cipressa for Demare - I forgot about that intermediate sprint on the Cipressa

 

[rehy90]

Re:

Sur le secteur, il a grimpé en moyenne à 33,7 km/h, avec une pointe à 52,2 km/h.

Max speed of 52.2km/h on the Cipressa for Demare - I forgot about that intermediate sprint on the Cipressa

he could go that fast in the end of the climb where the gradient is not even 1%, but definitely suspicious and i would like to know for how long he went so fast...

 

[Alexandre B.]

"I had 54.2kph max when behind the cars at the top......"
https://twitter.com/SimonYatess/status/711596880598274049

 

[postmanhat]

So much Gallic shrugging going on it's like the jitterbug

 

[Tonton]

We should tar and feather Yates the cheater, then...

Instead of admitting that it was a lot of noise for not much, some will keep on going. Talk about 52 km/h at the (flat) top for Demare but conveniently not compare to Yates or others. Or forget the 80 km/h that doesn't exist, all the rubbish taken at face value. Because it fits an agenda. If Pinot wins a stage ahead of Froome in the TdF, the same people will go on The Clinic, making against Pinot the arguments that others made against Froome, arguments they dismissed...what a pity.

 

[Metabolol]

I believe the accusations, without cheating he would not have been up there sprinting. I also believe Demare can win big races without cheating.

 

[Tonton]

Re:

I believe the accusations, without cheating he would not have been up there sprinting. I also believe Demare can win big races without cheating.

Every bit of the accusations has been rebuffed though. What else do you want?

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

I believe the accusations, without cheating he would not have been up there sprinting. I also believe Demare can win big races without cheating.

Every bit of the accusations has been rebuffed though. What else do you want?

Where they have been rebuffed?

As I see it, sprinter Demare rode the fastest time up the Cipressa - peaking at over 50km/h. Then bridged to the peloton who were really shifting at this point. Then managed to hang onto the peloton when attacks were going off on the Poggio. Then bridged to the front on the flat after the Poggio, and then still had the energy left to be by far the fastest guy in the sprint.

It would be one of the greatest 30 minutes of riding of all time, if he achieved all of that without assistance.

Then there is the issue that several riders accused him of getting a tow. And he deleted his ride from Strava - before re-uploading it without power data (possibly after some careful editing).

Hugely suspicious.

 

[maltiv]

Re:

Sur le secteur, il a grimpé en moyenne à 33,7 km/h, avec une pointe à 52,2 km/h.

Max speed of 52.2km/h on the Cipressa for Demare - I forgot about that intermediate sprint on the Cipressa

If you look a bit closer you'll see that's after a short section at -2% and then 0%...

Visconti was doing 49 km/h on the same section and we know he wasn't being towed.

 

[Metabolol]

Re: Re:

I believe the accusations, without cheating he would not have been up there sprinting. I also believe Demare can win big races without cheating.

Every bit of the accusations has been rebuffed though. What else do you want?

They wouldn't have complained like that if there wasn't something going on, I don't believe in the 'they are just jealous' or 'they are shady so they are lying' arguments. Even if he didn't go 80 km/h it doesn't mean that he didn't benefit greatly from a sticky bottle or holding on to the car.

Of course, this only what I believe. And unless there is footage he will not be DQed.

 

[del1962]

The plot thickens . No weapons of mass destruction it seems. Maybe it was a whole lot of noise for a little drafting and a sticky bottle. Now I'm waiting for the Skybots to accuse FDj of cooking the data overnight . Or maybe the Camora had a bet on Nacer .

Ha ha


You have advanced paranoia with the Skybots stuff, if others (not sky) accuse a French rider of somthng you lash out at Sky, are you an FDJBot or just a troll?

 

[Tonton]

Re: Re:

I believe the accusations, without cheating he would not have been up there sprinting. I also believe Demare can win big races without cheating.

Every bit of the accusations has been rebuffed though. What else do you want?

Where they have been rebuffed?

As I see it, sprinter Demare rode the fastest time up the Cipressa - peaking at over 50km/h. Then bridged to the peloton who were really shifting at this point. Then managed to hang onto the peloton when attacks were going off on the Poggio. Then bridged to the front on the flat after the Poggio, and then still had the energy left to be by far the fastest guy in the sprint.

It would be one of the greatest 30 minutes of riding of all time, if he achieved all of that without assistance.

Then there is the issue that several riders accused him of getting a tow. And he deleted his ride from Strava - before re-uploading it without power data (possibly after some careful editing).

Hugely suspicious.

Well, read the posts for starters. It started with hanging onto cars at 80 km/h. Data says nope. Peaking at over 50km/h? Yates was 2 km/h faster. Cadence and speed don't show gaps or peaks. Since when does one get pulled by a car while keeping cadence and speed consistent? Could it be that chasing the peloton, with cars in between, made drafting necessary and provided a big advantage? That makes more sense.

The deletion bothers me. Did Demare freak out or was there evil intent? You mention tampering Strava data. Is it possible? I don't know.

 

[Alexandre B.]

Clear pictures of Demare holding to his (Ori)car.

 

[Flamin]

Re: Re:

I believe the accusations, without cheating he would not have been up there sprinting. I also believe Demare can win big races without cheating.

Every bit of the accusations has been rebuffed though. What else do you want?

Where they have been rebuffed?

As I see it, sprinter Demare rode the fastest time up the Cipressa - peaking at over 50km/h. Then bridged to the peloton who were really shifting at this point. Then managed to hang onto the peloton when attacks were going off on the Poggio. Then bridged to the front on the flat after the Poggio, and then still had the energy left to be by far the fastest guy in the sprint.

It would be one of the greatest 30 minutes of riding of all time, if he achieved all of that without assistance.

Then there is the issue that several riders accused him of getting a tow. And he deleted his ride from Strava - before re-uploading it without power data (possibly after some careful editing).

Hugely suspicious.

Demare was top 10 or 15 on the Poggio ascent.

 

[Tonton]

The plot thickens . No weapons of mass destruction it seems. Maybe it was a whole lot of noise for a little drafting and a sticky bottle. Now I'm waiting for the Skybots to accuse FDj of cooking the data overnight . Or maybe the Camora had a bet on Nacer .

Ha ha


You have advanced paranoia with the Skybots stuff, if others (not sky) accuse a French rider of somthng you lash out at Sky, are you an FDJBot or just a troll?

I'm being mostly sarcastic. For a while, I had doubts today. The Strava deletion is at best stupid, at worst a smoking gun. I also stated unequivocally that if he hung onto cars, Demare should be DQed. I also look at facts as they come with an open mind. And the more info comes, the least guilt I see.

 

[jaylew]

Damn, just found out about all of this. Well, my dislike for Démare has actually grown. Why did you have to crash, Fernando?

 

[CheckMyPecs]

Re: Re:

They wouldn't have complained like that if there wasn't something going on, I don't believe in the 'they are just jealous' or 'they are shady so they are lying' arguments. Even if he didn't go 80 km/h it doesn't mean that he didn't benefit greatly from a sticky bottle or holding on to the car.

Yeah, I'm sure that argument will really sway race commissaires.

 

[May0maniac]

There's a pic of him and the teamcar on tuttobici.com:

It's just this one pic and you can't say if it was just a normal sticky bottle that allowed him to hang on the teamcar for a few second.
Source: http://www.tuttobiciweb.it/index.php?page=news&cod=88389&tp=n