108th Milano - Sanremo, 18th March 2017, 291 km, WT

[movingtarget]

Re:

Sagan should just stop working when Kwiatko is in the group, he no longer has the excuse of being the slower rider.

Yeah although they didn't have much of a gap Sagan should have slowed up and called their bluff but it would have been touch and go to hold off the bunch.

 

[kingjr]

Re:

If Sagan had sat back they would have been caught. Once he committed himself and did the bulk of the work it was Kwia's race to lose.

He could've waited for someone else to start the sprint, he has the best acceleration of the 3, could have maybe caught Ala or Kwiat before they passed him or maybe even make use of slipstream but that's all just theory. Kwiat won and Sagan didn't.

 

[LPP68!]

Most dissapointing thing: Dumoulin timetrialling on the poggio, creating a small gap, and sitting up again. Not once, but 2 or 3 times. It would have been awesome if he would have gone full gas after realising he had a gap.
I got the impression sky was just riding a tempo they decided was so fast that Viviani would be able to stay in the wheel, but giving a hard time to contenders with less climbing abilities. If Tom really would have gone, they would have had to think fast and change their plans on the go.
I am really curious if sky was going for Kwiatkovski or for Viviani, or did they maybe have a hybrid plan?

 

[DNP-Old]

Re: Re:

Classic sour forum. Kwiatkowski is a wheelsucker. We are defining irony.

Well his two wins this year were done by wheelsucking.

Now I've seen it all.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

Kwai is not like Gerrans. He is an attacker.

Matthews is a Gerrans-type of rider.

You mean a bunch sprinter...............

Matthews is a bunch sprinter who can survive hills like Gerrans. Kwiatkowski is an aggressive rider who is willing to attack.

Riders ride to their strengths.

 

[El Pistolero]

Re: Re:

Classic sour forum. Kwiatkowski is a wheelsucker. We are defining irony.

Well his two wins this year were done by wheelsucking.

What? :lol:

Strade Bianche he was cruising behind a motorbike half of the time (not his fault, but still unfair).

Cruising behind a motorbike. :lol: :lol:

Oh god. Trollest of the highest order. Why don't we have an award for that?

That's what actually happened, multiple riders complained about it, some even during the race.

 

[wheresmybrakes]

Some people on here really talk some crap when their favourite rider doesn't win or a rider that they don't want to win, wins.

 

[kingjr]

Re:

Most dissapointing thing: Dumoulin timetrialling on the poggio, creating a small gap, and sitting up again. Not once, but 2 or 3 times. It would have been awesome if he would have gone full gas after realising he had a gap.
I got the impression sky was just riding a tempo they decided was so fast that Viviani would be able to stay in the wheel, but giving a hard time to contenders with less climbing abilities. If Tom really would have gone, they would have had to think fast and change their plans on the go.
I am really curious if sky was going for Kwiatkovski or for Viviani, or did they maybe have a hybrid plan?

Kwiat said he didn't expect Sagan to attack and thought they were heading for a bunch sprint.

 

[movingtarget]

Re: Re:

If Sagan had sat back they would have been caught. Once he committed himself and did the bulk of the work it was Kwia's race to lose.

He could've waited for someone else to start the sprint, he has the best acceleration of the 3, could have maybe caught Ala or Kwiat before they passed him or maybe even make use of slipstream but that's all just theory. Kwiat won and Sagan didn't.

At that point of the race it's 50/50 either a podium or nothing, it's a hard call to make.

 

[dick the quick]

Re: Re:

Classic sour forum. Kwiatkowski is a wheelsucker. We are defining irony.

Well his two wins this year were done by wheelsucking.

Nope. When winning Strade, he was contributing as much as others being on the front of the race. When winning MSR, he was on par with Alaphilippe as regards taking the pulls. It is not his fault that the started the final sprint behind Sagan. Where is wheelsucking?

 

[Forever The Best]

Great attack by Sagan, and he raced great except the last km. He shouldn't have been at the front when the sprint starts. And if he is in the front he should have started the sprint a bit later.

Also Kwiatkowski is definitely a deserving winner. He didn't too that much of a work today but considering that he is a very entertaining rider and he also works in small groups mostly, this win isn't a problem with me.

Alaphilippe should have done a bit better in the sprint considering he was the one who worked the least. Also Gaviria still managed to get a decent result.

 

[deValtos]

Re:

Most dissapointing thing: Dumoulin timetrialling on the poggio, creating a small gap, and sitting up again. Not once, but 2 or 3 times. It would have been awesome if he would have gone full gas after realising he had a gap.
I got the impression sky was just riding a tempo they decided was so fast that Viviani would be able to stay in the wheel, but giving a hard time to contenders with less climbing abilities. If Tom really would have gone, they would have had to think fast and change their plans on the go.
I am really curious if sky was going for Kwiatkovski or for Viviani, or did they maybe have a hybrid plan?

Honestly that was the funniest part of the race watching Dumo going full gas trying to set a really hard pace for his team and Poppel completely ignoring him and riding at his own speed with zero expression on his face.

 

[WheelofGear]

Re: Re:

Kwai is not like Gerrans. He is an attacker.

Matthews is a Gerrans-type of rider.

You mean a bunch sprinter...............

Matthews is a bunch sprinter who can survive hills like Gerrans. Kwiatkowski is an aggressive rider who is willing to attack.

Riders ride to their strengths.

I was just highlighting the absurdity of calling Kwiatkowski a "wheelsucker". Matthews, Kristoff, Bouhanni, those guys are wheelsuckers.

 

[Red Rick]

K.

Kwiatkowski is usually an attacking rider, yet his whole chance on one other rider. He reacted to that rider, and he got the win because that one rider did 90% of the work and brainfarted his sprint.

Michal Kwiatowski wheelsucked when it was in his interest, and usually he makes the race. Simon Gerrans just wheelsucks. full stop.

It's a sensible tactic, but I don't understand why he gets credit for a tactical mastermind for this when it was obviously his only option to win. It's like asking somebody what 10+10 is and calling them a genius when they give the correct answer.

 

[woodburn]

Re:

https://twitter.com/f_cancellara/status/843135395277799424

@f_cancellara
I think this final today in @Milano_Sanremo was a flashback with @vincenzonibali @simongerrans not always the strongest winning bike races

He still remembers as he should. Just an awful display by Gerrans that day. Wish Spartacus would come back.

 

[movingtarget]

Great attack by Sagan, and he raced great except the last km. He shouldn't have been at the front when the sprint starts. And if he is in the front he should have started the sprint a bit later.

Also Kwiatkowski is definitely a deserving winner. He didn't too that much of a work today but considering that he is a very entertaining rider and he also works in small groups mostly, this win isn't a problem with me.

Alaphilippe should have doe a bit better in the sprint considering he was the one who worked the least. Also Gaviria still managed to get a decent result.

Ala normally doesn't have the sprint on the flat that the other two have but he sprinted very well and wasn't beaten far.

 

[deValtos]

Re: Re:

https://twitter.com/f_cancellara/status/843135395277799424

@f_cancellara
I think this final today in @Milano_Sanremo was a flashback with @vincenzonibali @simongerrans not always the strongest winning bike races

He still remembers as he should. Just an awful display by Gerrans that day. Wish Spartacus would come back.

Why does he mention Nibs? Did nibs get screwed over too or was he also not taking turns?

 

[movingtarget]

Re:

K.

Kwiatkowski is usually an attacking rider, yet his whole chance on one other rider. He reacted to that rider, and he got the win because that one rider did 90% of the work and brainfarted his sprint.

Michal Kwiatowski wheelsucked when it was in his interest, and usually he makes the race. Simon Gerrans just wheelsucks. full stop.

It's a sensible tactic, but I don't understand why he gets credit for a tactical mastermind for this when it was obviously his only option to win. It's like asking somebody what 10+10 is and calling them a genius when they give the correct answer.

I don't see Cavendish or Kittel doing anything different to Gerrans when they win.

 

[kingjr]

Little shoutout to Degenkolb, he tried to go with Sagan, couldn't keep his pace, but props for trying.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

https://twitter.com/f_cancellara/status/843135395277799424

@f_cancellara
I think this final today in @Milano_Sanremo was a flashback with @vincenzonibali @simongerrans not always the strongest winning bike races

He still remembers as he should. Just an awful display by Gerrans that day. Wish Spartacus would come back.

Why does he mention Nibs? Did nibs get screwed over too or was he also not taking turns?

Because they finished in a group of 3?

 

[BigMac]

Re:

For the record, neither Kwiat nor Alaphilippe took any decent pulls. Going on the front for 5 seconds like Alaphilippe did to sabotage the break for Gaviria is not pulling. Not making judgements on whether Kwiatkowski is a deserved winner or not, just clarifying some bits.

I'm still trying to understand this Sagan gift. He had everything to be the sole protagonist, now he's just the guy who made the decisive move. Happens way too often.

Sagan should just stop working when Kwiatko is in the group, he no longer has the excuse of being the slower rider.

I'll have to agree with you for once. It pains me.

 

[deValtos]

I will say for a team without a sprinter BMC did and awful lot of pulling and zero attacking.

 

[Billie]

Re: Re:

https://twitter.com/f_cancellara/status/843135395277799424

@f_cancellara
I think this final today in @Milano_Sanremo was a flashback with @vincenzonibali @simongerrans not always the strongest winning bike races

He still remembers as he should. Just an awful display by Gerrans that day. Wish Spartacus would come back.

Why does he mention Nibs? Did nibs get screwed over too or was he also not taking turns?

ofcourse Nibali didn't work. Had no chance in the sprint anyway and Sagan won the sprint for 4th behind

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

K.

Kwiatkowski is usually an attacking rider, yet his whole chance on one other rider. He reacted to that rider, and he got the win because that one rider did 90% of the work and brainfarted his sprint.

Michal Kwiatowski wheelsucked when it was in his interest, and usually he makes the race. Simon Gerrans just wheelsucks. full stop.

It's a sensible tactic, but I don't understand why he gets credit for a tactical mastermind for this when it was obviously his only option to win. It's like asking somebody what 10+10 is and calling them a genius when they give the correct answer.

I don't see Cavendish or Kittel doing anything different to Gerrans when they win.

They're sprinters. They ruin every chance they have to win by taking any pull themselves. Gerrans rather wins the sprint for 5th than get beaten in the sprint for the win.

 

[deValtos]

Re: Re:

https://twitter.com/f_cancellara/status/843135395277799424

@f_cancellara
I think this final today in @Milano_Sanremo was a flashback with @vincenzonibali @simongerrans not always the strongest winning bike races

He still remembers as he should. Just an awful display by Gerrans that day. Wish Spartacus would come back.

Why does he mention Nibs? Did nibs get screwed over too or was he also not taking turns?

Because they finished in a group of 3?

Yea but I don't remember the race. I know Gerrans did Gerrans things and Cancellara did Cancellara things but I don't know what Nibs did.