2016 Omloop het Nieuwsblad, Feb 27th, 200.8km, 1.HC

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

It is not first time you speak very negativ about Sagan. Sometimes it just looks like you cannot stand that Slovakia can have the better rider then Czechia. I have never ever spoken and never will about Roman or Styby or Vakoc the way you spoke about Peter last year.

Maybe he doesn't like Sagan, not the first nor the last one, who cares? If he's talking trash, others will recognize, no need to heat it up.
As to Sagan's performance, his lack of sprint power after long races is already a proven fact, nothing new. In fact he looks much much better then last two early springs. Very promissing today.

Not sure about that. Today wasn't a long or especially hard race compared with PR or RVV and he still was way below strength in the sprint. I think he needs to reassess and stop going in long breaks, because he just can't finish them off.

If he would have stayed in the peloton he probably would have won today (obviously that's not really how it works, but surely he should play more to his strengths - which is either a late attack or holding fire for a sprint at the end)

 

[Dazed and Confused]

Re: Re:

Let me point out how disgusted I was by Rowe's behaviour with Alexis. He started bullying him into taking turns, even though the young rider had spent most on the day in the breakaway and was almost dropped on the Lange Mute.
French TV commentators had a field day with this, and it led to a 5 min (fully justified, imo) rant against Sky.
They are the richest, most successful team in World Tour, and, once again, they feel to need to boss around other riders, just because they believe they are untitled to something.
I am really sick of this bunch, especially that now they are starting to pollute classic races as well.

Oh grow up. This type of thing happens all the time. If the rider agrees to work then that's his fault and it's not as if Rowe is one of the big classics guys who would make a young rider feel intimidated.

yep, besides Alexis will reflect on the matter tonight perhaps and likely learn from it.

 

[SlickMongoose]

Learn from it? Surely he did the right thing in working, if they'd been caught he wouldn't have got 5th.

 

[TommyGun]

Re: Re:

Let me point out how disgusted I was by Rowe's behaviour with Alexis. He started bullying him into taking turns, even though the young rider had spent most on the day in the breakaway and was almost dropped on the Lange Mute.
French TV commentators had a field day with this, and it led to a 5 min (fully justified, imo) rant against Sky.
They are the richest, most successful team in World Tour, and, once again, they feel to need to boss around other riders, just because they believe they are untitled to something.
I am really sick of this bunch, especially that now they are starting to pollute classic races as well.

Oh grow up. This type of thing happens all the time. If the rider agrees to work then that's his fault and it's not as if Rowe is one of the big classics guys who would make a young rider feel intimidated.

This is why I was so upset. I guess big names like GVA or Sagan have the right to ask for stuff like that because they earned it on the bike. But these guys are so classy that they didnt even care about Gougeard hanging in the back. Only Rowe started to make a circus out of it, as if he was a 3 times Flanders winner bossing around a younger rider. It was very condescending.
I agree that Gougeard should have known better, but its only his 2nd season in the Classics. He's a huge talent.

 

[SlickMongoose]

I'm still confused. Assuming Gougeard values 5th, working was the right thing to do.

 

[Kokoso]

Re: Re:

It is not first time you speak very negativ about Sagan. Sometimes it just looks like you cannot stand that Slovakia can have the better rider then Czechia. I have never ever spoken and never will about Roman or Styby or Vakoc the way you spoke about Peter last year.

Maybe he doesn't like Sagan, not the first nor the last one, who cares? If he's talking trash, others will recognize, no need to heat it up.
As to Sagan's performance, his lack of sprint power after long races is already a proven fact, nothing new. In fact he looks much much better then last two early springs. Very promissing today.

I wasn't talking trash, I was totally serious, believe me. Some recognized that.

 

[Kwibus]

Re: Re:

Let me point out how disgusted I was by Rowe's behaviour with Alexis. He started bullying him into taking turns, even though the young rider had spent most on the day in the breakaway and was almost dropped on the Lange Mute.
French TV commentators had a field day with this, and it led to a 5 min (fully justified, imo) rant against Sky.
They are the richest, most successful team in World Tour, and, once again, they feel to need to boss around other riders, just because they believe they are untitled to something.
I am really sick of this bunch, especially that now they are starting to pollute classic races as well.

Oh grow up. This type of thing happens all the time. If the rider agrees to work then that's his fault and it's not as if Rowe is one of the big classics guys who would make a young rider feel intimidated.

yep, besides Alexis will reflect on the matter tonight perhaps and likely learn from it.

Alexis finished 5th and if he didnt work he wouldve finished somewere between 20 and 30. If Alexis was a big name it would've been bs to pull, but he had nothing to lose helping the break today. 5th is a great result for him.

Besides he gained a few fans today is my guess.

Next year he'll probably won't pull anymore.

 

[Kwibus]

Re: Re:

It is not first time you speak very negativ about Sagan. Sometimes it just looks like you cannot stand that Slovakia can have the better rider then Czechia. I have never ever spoken and never will about Roman or Styby or Vakoc the way you spoke about Peter last year.

Maybe he doesn't like Sagan, not the first nor the last one, who cares? If he's talking trash, others will recognize, no need to heat it up.
As to Sagan's performance, his lack of sprint power after long races is already a proven fact, nothing new. In fact he looks much much better then last two early springs. Very promissing today.

I wasn't talking trash, I was totally serious, believe me. Some recognized that.

You are right that Sagan works too hard and that he is better off if he just sat in the bunch and let his team pull back breakaways. I think he is awarw of that as well, but he just enjoys racing like this more. Maybe if he gets too upset about podiums instead of wins he'll become more of an smart (*sshole) rider.
So far he just seems like a guy that enjoys racing hard instead of waiting in the bunch.

He has my blessings btw. I love his aggresion. Actually he's becoming quite like GVA in a certain way. Both can do lot and like to attack, but podium (top 10) more then actually win. Yet they are riders that makes races interesting to watch.

 

[Kokoso]

Re: Re:

It is not first time you speak very negativ about Sagan. Sometimes it just looks like you cannot stand that Slovakia can have the better rider then Czechia. I have never ever spoken and never will about Roman or Styby or Vakoc the way you spoke about Peter last year.

Maybe he doesn't like Sagan, not the first nor the last one, who cares? If he's talking trash, others will recognize, no need to heat it up.
As to Sagan's performance, his lack of sprint power after long races is already a proven fact, nothing new. In fact he looks much much better then last two early springs. Very promissing today.

I wasn't talking trash, I was totally serious, believe me. Some recognized that.

You are right that Sagan works too hard and that he is better off if he just sat in the bunch and let his team pull back breakaways. I think he is awarw of that as well, but he just enjoys racing like this more. Maybe if he gets too upset about podiums instead of wins he'll become more of an smart (*sshole) rider.
So far he just seems like a guy that enjoys racing hard instead of waiting in the bunch.

He has my blessings btw. I love his aggresion. Actually he's becoming quite like GVA in a certain way. Both can do lot and like to attack, but podium (top 10) more then actually win. Yet they are riders that makes races interesting to watch.

Kudos for him for agressive racing, that's totally true. But if he sits more on wheel of others he could win more. And still he wouldn't have to be Gerrans-like to win, he'd still be likeable for crowds.

 

[kareeem]

I guess he likes this way of racing more. And he is getting paid in millions for it.

 

[Kokoso]

I guess he likes this way of racing more. And he is getting paid in millions for it.

And money are the most important thing, aren't they?

 

[movingtarget]

Great win fro GVA. So often the bridesmaid. Happy for him.

 

[MatParker117]

Re: Re:

He knew that they everyone to do some work and I don't blame Rowe for if you are going to stay in the group then give us a turn.

Mandatory pulls? Is that how they roll at SKY?

So how many pulls did Stannard take last year before he made his winning move?

... You don't have to answer, we all already know your response ... "It was different situation"

... what a hypocrite ...

That is not what I meant and you know it, don't twist my words.

 

[Bushman]

Nice race. Only just finished watching it.

Happy for GVA, he was clearly the strongest in the end. This could be the year for him. Benoot is just a world class talent, he could really be the heir to the Belgian classics throne. Incredibly strong and very, very versatile. He is a rider who could win Flandrian and Ardennes races in the future.

Regarding Sagan, I would say this race was a huge success. Yeah, he was beaten (again) in the end, but he just came back from a training camp with no race miles in his legs, whereas GVA has been racing strongly in Qatar and Oman and Benoot in Algarve. He showed great shape nonetheless. I would also like to comment on the "Sagan can't sprint at the end of a tough race" opinion. Well, it's partly true, Sagan doesn't have the ability like Kristoff and Degenkolb to sprint even stronger after a tough race, but that is only one side of the case IMO. Sagan is one of the strongest riders in the world in this terrain and also one of the best sprinters so somehow he "should" win more of these races. But it's really not that simple. The thing is, there are so many classics riders on just about the same level now; Sagan, GVA, Kristoff, Degenkolb, Stybar, Terpstra, Vanmarcke and maybe Benoot (Cancellara, Boonen), so you can't really stand out unless you are a level above the rest. When Cancellara and Boonen was on top of their career they were clearly above everyone else so it was always their races to lose. Sagan gets the most attention and often he is labelled as top favourite and it's "his race to lose" but with so many riders almost equally strong the races are mostly decided on the daily form and chances are that there is just one rider who has better legs than Sagan and can drop him on the last ascent of the Paterberg or beat him in the sprint.

Look at the top classics riders of this generation (excluding Cancellara and Boonen); none of them are really standing out. Degenkolb did stand out a bit last year when he won MSR and Roubaix while Kristoff was unstoppable in Flandres. Then come the Worlds it was Sagan who had that extra 2% in his legs to ride away from everyone; today it was GVA who was able to finish it off. Currently the top classics riders are taking turns to come out on top. It really does take something extraordinary to make the difference (Kristoff Flanders, Degenkolb Roubaix) or else the race will be decided by just a few watts.

 

[Kokoso]

Re:

I would also like to comment on the "Sagan can't sprint at the end of a tough race" opinion. Well, it's partly true, Sagan doesn't have the ability like Kristoff and Degenkolb to sprint even stronger after a tough race, but that is only one side of the case IMO. Sagan is one of the strongest riders in the world in this terrain and also one of the best sprinters so somehow he "should" win more of these races.

I agree (partly ) My opinion is that it's at least partly a matter of how you manage powers during a race. Degenkolb or Kristoff will lose sprint too when they ride like Sagan. Also it's matter of if you have some Paolinis or De Backers working for you, that saves powers too.

 

[Kwibus]

I guess he likes this way of racing more. And he is getting paid in millions for it.

And money are the most important thing, aren't they?

So you only take the money part while he first said that Sagan just likes to race like that.

What he meant is that Sagan enjoys racing aggresive which might not be the most efficient way of racing for him, but despite doing what he likes most he still gets the millions so he is allowed to race the way he wants instead of what is most efficient and maybe not so much fun for him.

 

[Kokoso]

I guess he likes this way of racing more. And he is getting paid in millions for it.

And money are the most important thing, aren't they?

So you only take the money part while he first said that Sagan just likes to race like that.

What he meant is that Sagan enjoys racing aggresive which might not be the most efficient way of racing for him, but despite doing what he likes most he still gets the millions so he is allowed to race the way he wants instead of what is most efficient and maybe not so much fun for him.

I didn't mean it that way. My point is - why to even mention money? Does that changes something, or what? Also it doesn't make much sense to me, because he's paid that money for winning a lot before he signed that contract, not because he hasn't won a lot. Also is really about fun necesarilly? I don't know, maybe it would be more fun for him if he actually won that races.

 

[Maaaaaaaarten]

Unfortunately I wasn't able to see it yesterday, but I'm always happy to see GVA win!

Also, I've definitively become a Gougeard fan. Great rider. We need more guys like him in the peloton.

 

[Echoes]

So you prefer they interview in a language some people can understand then one a majority have a minor grasp of or did I get this wrong

In Belgium, the majority speaks Dutch. If you interview Greg in a foreign language, then why English and not French, Italian or Swahili?

 

[Arnout]

So you prefer they interview in a language some people can understand then one a majority have a minor grasp of or did I get this wrong

In Belgium, the majority speaks Dutch. If you interview Greg in a foreign language, then why English and not French, Italian or Swahili?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_speakers

 

[rhubroma]

So you prefer they interview in a language some people can understand then one a majority have a minor grasp of or did I get this wrong

In Belgium, the majority speaks Dutch. If you interview Greg in a foreign language, then why English and not French, Italian or Swahili?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_speakers

There shouldn't be interviews in Belgium except Dutch interviews, otherwise the Belgians sacrifice national integrity to the Anglo-dominant kultur regime. It is of course a gross affront to Belgian dignity and hence appallingly unpatriotic to give interviews in English, which naturally should be condemned as repugnant acts of treason against the Belgian nation. They are undoubtedly the work of a Judaic organized conspiracy against Belgian identity, through its media channels with the backing of Mossad, the IMF and a host of other Zionist organizations to destroy the millennial traditions of the Belgians, in an initial bid to first gain control of the EU, before forcing planet Earth into total submission.

 

[samhocking]

I think Rowe's logic was correct. Just because you're in an earlier breakaway doesn't mean you get pulled to the finish line for free and guarantee yourself 5th or even better. Rowe instigated the winning move that formed that group of 5. Without the group Alexis was finishing nowhere anyway, so he had an obligation to keep himself the 5th place by contributing. No doubt Alexis was hurting, but that's cycling.

 

[wayahead]

Re: Re:

I would also like to comment on the "Sagan can't sprint at the end of a tough race" opinion. Well, it's partly true, Sagan doesn't have the ability like Kristoff and Degenkolb to sprint even stronger after a tough race, but that is only one side of the case IMO. Sagan is one of the strongest riders in the world in this terrain and also one of the best sprinters so somehow he "should" win more of these races.

I agree (partly ) My opinion is that it's at least partly a matter of how you manage powers during a race. Degenkolb or Kristoff will lose sprint too when they ride like Sagan. Also it's matter of if you have some Paolinis or De Backers working for you, that saves powers too.

Sagan without teammates or unable to use them - right. Sagan likely to waste energy - right. But despite it I believe he is not on par with Kristoff and Degenkolb in ability to sprint strongly after tough/long race. What did he win this way? E3, Brabantse Pijl? You could add sprints for minor places - MSR'12, SB'13. But he lost so many times... MSR'13/14/15, P-R'14/15(?), RvV'15... IMO that's the main reason he tries to avoid the sprints with late attacks or through creation of selective groups. Sometimes it pays off. So he is more in the group of GVA, Cancellara, Styby than Degenkolg and Kristoff.

 

[cantpedal]

So you prefer they interview in a language some people can understand then one a majority have a minor grasp of or did I get this wrong

In Belgium, the majority speaks Dutch. If you interview Greg in a foreign language, then why English and not French, Italian or Swahili?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_languages_by_total_number_of_speakers

There shouldn't be interviews in Belgium except Dutch interviews, otherwise the Belgians sacrifice national integrity to the Anglo-dominant kultur regime. It is of course a gross affront to Belgian dignity and hence appallingly unpatriotic to give interviews in English, which naturally should be condemned as repugnant acts of treason against the Belgian nation. They are undoubtedly the work of a Judaic organized conspiracy against Belgian identity, through its media channels with the backing of Mossad, the IMF and a host of other Zionist organizations to destroy the millennial traditions of the Belgians, in an initial bid to first gain control of the EU, before forcing planet Earth into total submission.

100 x

 

[Kwibus]

So you prefer they interview in a language some people can understand then one a majority have a minor grasp of or did I get this wrong

In Belgium, the majority speaks Dutch. If you interview Greg in a foreign language, then why English and not French, Italian or Swahili?

oh come on.... In every internatiol race there are always a few questions in english so other nations can show them on tele. Happens everywhere.....