2016 TdF, Stage 2: Saint-Lô → Cherbourg-en-Cotentin (183km)

[Kwibus]

Re: 2016 TdF, Stage 2: Saint-Lô → Cherbourg-en-Cotentin (183

Awesome win by Sagan and I love how he cherishes his rainbow jersey
Happy with yellow, really happy, but it's as if he can't wait to put on his rainbow jersey again.

Contador well I hope he can recover, but I'm afraid he's hurt too much.
Porte just really bad luck, but where the hell was his team? Bloody shame. I hope he has the willpower this time, unlike the Giro where he seemed to be broken mentally after the wheelchange fiasco.

 

[RattaKuningas]

Re: 2016 TdF, Stage 2: Saint-Lô → Cherbourg-en-Cotentin (183

Awesome win by Sagan and I love how he cherishes his rainbow jersey
Happy with yellow, really happy, but it's as if he can't wait to put on his rainbow jersey again.

Contador well I hope he can recover, but I'm afraid he's hurt too much.
Porte just really bad luck, but where the hell was his team? Bloody shame. I hope he has the willpower this time, unlike the Giro where he seemed to be broken mentally after the wheelchange fiasco.

Porte had 1 helper on the climb but that obviously wasn't enough.

 

[pjthom22]

BMC was up front chasing the break. Trying to get GVA the win.

 

[jahn]

Re:

Losing time on purpose Valverde is now 1st among GC guys with 4 seconds ahead of Froome. Nice job to be honest.

I'm glad, seems bad to put all your eggs in one basket just to ensure your second in command doesn't go renegade.

 

[DFA123]

Re: 2016 TdF, Stage 2: Saint-Lô → Cherbourg-en-Cotentin (183

Awesome win by Sagan and I love how he cherishes his rainbow jersey
Happy with yellow, really happy, but it's as if he can't wait to put on his rainbow jersey again.

Contador well I hope he can recover, but I'm afraid he's hurt too much.
Porte just really bad luck, but where the hell was his team? Bloody shame. I hope he has the willpower this time, unlike the Giro where he seemed to be broken mentally after the wheelchange fiasco.

Most of his team were drilling it on the front of the peloton trying to set up a win for GVA. I think it was just one of those unfortunate incidents. Always going to be a problem in a team with three leaders - just not enough domestiques to go around.

 

[DFA123]

Re: Re:

Losing time on purpose Valverde is now 1st among GC guys with 4 seconds ahead of Froome. Nice job to be honest.

I'm glad, seems bad to put all your eggs in one basket just to ensure your second in command doesn't go renegade.

Me too, I still don't really see the point of Valverde deliberately losing time unless he wants to go stage hunting in the last week.

He's more useful for Quintana the higher up he is on GC. If he's threatening the podium then it gives them more cards to play, as sky couldn't ignore him when he attacks.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re: Re:

If you go to PCS and see the results from LBL in 2014, 2015, and today's tour stage, you will see that the only reason that validates the fact that no one "remotely close to Sagan's weight" was in the top 10, was because Sagan itself wasn't there contesting those races, or GVA (he did top 10, didn't he?).

Today's Tour stage is not the same as LBL and is not a good guide to LBL. Today's stage was much easier, which is why there were two sprinters in the top 5, while there have been zero sprinters in the top 5 in LBL since forever.

GVA is lighter than Sagan but still too heavy for LBL. He has precisely once finished in the top 60. On that occasion, which came when he had not yet focused his season and training on the cobbles, he managed 7th but was half a minute down. Today's GVA doesn't even ride LBL. And this remember is the closest there is to someone with anything like Sagan's weight being anything like competitive at LBL.

Even when a relatively large group comes to the bottom of the final climb together, those in it have completed an unbelievable amount of climbing. All but the usual climber/puncheurs are dead. A Sagan who manages to be in such a position is not a Sagan facing a climb after a flat stage or even after a Ronde. It is a Sagan who has hauled 10 or 12 extra kg of bodyweight up every centimeter of those climbs compared to the race favourites. That is very different as the little climber/puncheurs demonstrate every year by being the only riders in serious contention.

Sagan, for all his freakish talent, is carrying around a sprinter's rear end. The only counterargument is that the laws of physics don't apply to him. Which is essentially what "the only reason that validates the fact that no one "remotely close to Sagan's weight" was in the top 10, was because Sagan itself wasn't there" amounts to. By contrast, I think that certain physical limitations do apply to him like everybody else and that while he's incredibly versatile, he would actually have to shed weight and improve his climbing to seriously contend for that race.

Anyway, we aren't likely to find out in the near future and I really couldn't be bothered arguing any further about it.

 

[yaco]

Re: Re:

Sagan is a smarter rider in 2016 - Goes full gas on stages he can win, but doesn't waste energy on unsuitable stages - Was finishing behind the gruppeto in mountain stages at Dauphine - Smart riding.

But he didn't ride in Dauphine.

It was the Tour of Suisse - Point still stands.

 

[yaco]

Re: 2016 TdF, Stage 2: Saint-Lô → Cherbourg-en-Cotentin (183

Awesome win by Sagan and I love how he cherishes his rainbow jersey
Happy with yellow, really happy, but it's as if he can't wait to put on his rainbow jersey again.

Contador well I hope he can recover, but I'm afraid he's hurt too much.
Porte just really bad luck, but where the hell was his team? Bloody shame. I hope he has the willpower this time, unlike the Giro where he seemed to be broken mentally after the wheelchange fiasco.

Porte had 1 helper on the climb but that obviously wasn't enough.

BMC could have had eight riders and Porte would still lose time - Punctured at the wrong time.

 

[DFA123]

Re: 2016 TdF, Stage 2: Saint-Lô → Cherbourg-en-Cotentin (183

Awesome win by Sagan and I love how he cherishes his rainbow jersey
Happy with yellow, really happy, but it's as if he can't wait to put on his rainbow jersey again.

Contador well I hope he can recover, but I'm afraid he's hurt too much.
Porte just really bad luck, but where the hell was his team? Bloody shame. I hope he has the willpower this time, unlike the Giro where he seemed to be broken mentally after the wheelchange fiasco.

Porte had 1 helper on the climb but that obviously wasn't enough.

BMC could have had eight riders and Porte would still lose time - Punctured at the wrong time.

Not sure about that. If he had a BMC rider with him and immediately took their wheel, he could have made it on to the back of the peloton for the steepest bit of the climb and maybe only lost 5-10 seconds as he had to work his way up through the field.

That Mavic wheel change was painfully slow.

 

[RattaKuningas]

Re: 2016 TdF, Stage 2: Saint-Lô → Cherbourg-en-Cotentin (183

Awesome win by Sagan and I love how he cherishes his rainbow jersey
Happy with yellow, really happy, but it's as if he can't wait to put on his rainbow jersey again.

Contador well I hope he can recover, but I'm afraid he's hurt too much.
Porte just really bad luck, but where the hell was his team? Bloody shame. I hope he has the willpower this time, unlike the Giro where he seemed to be broken mentally after the wheelchange fiasco.

Porte had 1 helper on the climb but that obviously wasn't enough.

BMC could have had eight riders and Porte would still lose time - Punctured at the wrong time.

He had puncture around 6km before finish so he probably lost most of the time on flat.

 

[Tank Engine]

Contador has had really bad luck so far and so did Little Ritchie today. Before the tour I thought Nairo and Froome would be the main players and Bertie had a chance of spoiling the party. However, that is looking increasingly difficult.

I wouldn't read too much into Pinot losing a handful of seconds, he's a bit of a diesel and often on longer climbs you see him struggling at the bottom, only for him to improve.

I don't care whether Rolland has had any decent results this year, he loves GTs and finishing in the top group on a stage that doesn't really suit him is a good sign. This year's parcours is great for him. I'm not saying he'll win, but Top 5 is not out of the question and Top 10 quite likely.

 

[Jungle Cycle]

Contador crash didn't looked to be at "high speed"...
https://twitter.com/LeTour/status/749654900527624192

 

[DFA123]

Re:

Contador has had really bad luck so far and so did Little Ritchie today. Before the tour I thought Nairo and Froome would be the main players and Bertie had a chance of spoiling the party. However, that is looking increasingly difficult.

I wouldn't read too much into Pinot losing a handful of seconds, he's a bit of a diesel and often on longer climbs you see him struggling at the bottom, only for him to improve.

I don't care whether Rolland has had any decent results this year, he loves GTs and finishing in the top group on a stage that doesn't really suit him is a good sign. This year's parcours is great for him. I'm not saying he'll win, but Top 5 is not out of the question and Top 10 quite likely.

I don't buy that excuse at all. He's lost 11 seconds for nothing, and he can't afford to give away any advantage if he seriously wants to think about challenging Froome and Quintana.

If he's a diesel then do everything possible to make sure he's right at the front going into the climb, so he can drift back a bit and still stay with the front group. Instead, FDJ were ambling about near the back and he lost time. So poor.

 

[RattaKuningas]

Re: Re:

Contador has had really bad luck so far and so did Little Ritchie today. Before the tour I thought Nairo and Froome would be the main players and Bertie had a chance of spoiling the party. However, that is looking increasingly difficult.

I wouldn't read too much into Pinot losing a handful of seconds, he's a bit of a diesel and often on longer climbs you see him struggling at the bottom, only for him to improve.

I don't care whether Rolland has had any decent results this year, he loves GTs and finishing in the top group on a stage that doesn't really suit him is a good sign. This year's parcours is great for him. I'm not saying he'll win, but Top 5 is not out of the question and Top 10 quite likely.

I don't buy that excuse at all. He's lost 11 seconds for nothing, and he can't afford to give away any advantage if he seriously wants to think about challenging Froome and Quintana.

If he's a diesel then do everything possible to make sure he's right at the front going into the climb, so he can drift back a bit and still stay with the front group. Instead, FDJ were ambling about near the back and he lost time. So poor.

Exactly. Pinot can't give up seconds on uphill finishes if there are plenty of stages with downhill finishes where he will probably lose even more time.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

Contador crash didn't looked to be at "high speed"...
https://twitter.com/LeTour/status/749654900527624192

We can't see at what speed he crashes but the other riders seem to be going pretty fast.

 

[SeriousSam]

Re: Re:

If you go to PCS and see the results from LBL in 2014, 2015, and today's tour stage, you will see that the only reason that validates the fact that no one "remotely close to Sagan's weight" was in the top 10, was because Sagan itself wasn't there contesting those races, or GVA (he did top 10, didn't he?).

 

[MacBAir]

Re: Re:

If you go to PCS and see the results from LBL in 2014, 2015, and today's tour stage, you will see that the only reason that validates the fact that no one "remotely close to Sagan's weight" was in the top 10, was because Sagan itself wasn't there contesting those races, or GVA (he did top 10, didn't he?).

Holly *** there's GIFs to every situation, now. I agree that the fanboyism makes me optimistic. No point in discussing this until he gives it a serious go.

 

[Jungle Cycle]

Re: Re:

Contador crash didn't looked to be at "high speed"...
https://twitter.com/LeTour/status/749654900527624192

We can't see at what speed he crashes but the other riders seem to be going pretty fast.

Like you, I'm reaaallllyyy hopping to be "just" another scratched handlebar kind of fall...

 

[Põhja Konn]

Re: Re:

Contador has had really bad luck so far and so did Little Ritchie today. Before the tour I thought Nairo and Froome would be the main players and Bertie had a chance of spoiling the party. However, that is looking increasingly difficult.

I wouldn't read too much into Pinot losing a handful of seconds, he's a bit of a diesel and often on longer climbs you see him struggling at the bottom, only for him to improve.

I don't care whether Rolland has had any decent results this year, he loves GTs and finishing in the top group on a stage that doesn't really suit him is a good sign. This year's parcours is great for him. I'm not saying he'll win, but Top 5 is not out of the question and Top 10 quite likely.

I don't buy that excuse at all. He's lost 11 seconds for nothing, and he can't afford to give away any advantage if he seriously wants to think about challenging Froome and Quintana.

If he's a diesel then do everything possible to make sure he's right at the front going into the climb, so he can drift back a bit and still stay with the front group. Instead, FDJ were ambling about near the back and he lost time. So poor.

Important thing is if he lets this setback get in his head and take away his confidence. If he doesn't, then those 11 seconds are insignificant. If he does, he's screwed.

 

[SeriousSam]

Nah it's significant anyway. 11 seconds is nothing to laugh at and plenty of riders weren't dropped there, not all of which are explosive. If he was a debtor Moody would be changing his outlook to negative now, but hold of lowering his credit rating until we know more.

 

[DFA123]

Re:

Nah it's significant anyway. 11 seconds is nothing to laugh at and plenty of riders weren't dropped there, not all of which are explosive. If he was a debtor Moody would be changing his outlook to negative now, but hold of lowering his credit rating until we know more.

The most concerning thing, along with the 11 seconds, is just how inept FDJ are. Pinot is their TdF - they should have had eight men in front of him making sure he was perfectly positioned before the climb. And, even after messing that up, Vichot managed to finish in the lead group; why wasn't he waiting for Pinot and pacing him?

If I were Moody's I'd be lowering his rating now, purely because his team is so useless.

 

[Captain Serious]

Re: Re:

WTF?! He didn't know all the escapees were caught?! Was his radio busted? What the fark is the radio for if he doesn't get basic info like that?

Peter Sagan doesn't listen to his radio.

His radio listens to Peter Sagan.

Ha ha! New meme? Peter Sagan doesn't bunny hop his bike, he bounces the Earth underneath it. :lol:

ha, not bad

 

[Kwibus]

Re: Re:

Contador crash didn't looked to be at "high speed"...
https://twitter.com/LeTour/status/749654900527624192

We can't see at what speed he crashes but the other riders seem to be going pretty fast.

It's a nasty crash. Not as nasty as yesterday, but nasty. More riders on top him than yesterday, which certainly won't feel good either.

 

[ILovecycling]

One of the (a bit) positive things abou today is that Froome will have tough times as Quintana looks absolutely in control on the final climb,shape is looking good.OTOH its a question if he can beat Froome without Contador attacks etc