21 HC climbs the Tour should (re)visit

[Netserk]

No Allos, as the Tour went through in 2000. And it's a 1st Category so not in the list in anyway. Even if it's one of the highest climbs in France.

They took the south side in 2000 AFAIK. The north side is 17km @6.5% topping at 2247m. That is surely worthy of HC.

 

[Linkinito]

They took the south side in 2000 AFAIK. The north side is 17km @6.5% topping at 2247m. That is surely worthy of HC.

Hmmm, I didn't think of that. And if we except 2000, Allos was took for the last time in 1975. That's interesting, as I didn't plan to include it.

 

[Netserk]

Here's the stage profile from 2000:

 

[rghysens]

They took the south side in 2000 AFAIK. The north side is 17km @6.5% topping at 2247m. That is surely worthy of HC.

Hmmm... now you're stretching it a bit. That side of the Col d'Allos is comparable (both in length and gradient) with climbs like the Cormet de Roselend, Courchevel or La Toussuire and those are all cat.1 climbs (but at a lower altitude). I think a climb shouldn't be a HC climb if there aren't long sections of 8% or more.

 

[BigMac]

Is the Col de la Bonette amongst them? I don't know i'ts steepness nor lenght tho, so i can't really recall if it is a nice ride up the mountain.

 

[Netserk]

Hmmm... now you're stretching it a bit. That side of the Col d'Allos is comparable (both in length and gradient) with climbs like the Cormet de Roselend, Courchevel or La Toussuire and those are all cat.1 climbs (but at a lower altitude). I think a climb shouldn't be a HC climb if there aren't long sections of 8% or more.

One of the climbs listed here have only 1 km of more than 8% (8.4). And yes the altitude is an important factor IMO.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

The altitude factor might be why the Rettenbachferner is one of the most underrated climbs in Europe, out of ones that have been used in racing in recent memory (i.e. not the likes of Nebelhorn or Scanuppia which will likely never see racing unless they get somebody organising races who makes Zomegnan look like Pescheux). It's the Mortirolo but 1000m higher!

 

[valentius borealis]

Cayolle to follow Couillole then, and Col d'Allos?

On my fantasy Tour route I had a stage down there because that area is totally underused, and I'm also a fan of the Alpes-Maritîmes; I think the stage I had was Braus/Ablé -> Turini via Baisse de la Cabanette -> Col Saint Martin -> Couillole -> Cayolle -> descent finish in Barcelonnette.

I guess the Col de la Sinne ought to warrant a mention as well, at least from Val Tinée.

If I ever get around to planning my fantasy Tour for the race design thread, one of the stages would be going the other way (Couillole -> Col de la Sinne -> Col Saint Martin -> Turini), with the preceding stage finishing in Barcelonnette after descending the Cayolle.

 

[nick101]

The altitude factor might be why the Rettenbachferner is one of the most underrated climbs in Europe, out of ones that have been used in racing in recent memory (i.e. not the likes of Nebelhorn or Scanuppia which will likely never see racing unless they get somebody organising races who makes Zomegnan look like Pescheux). It's the Mortirolo but 1000m higher!

Just had a look at the rettenbachferner and rombo combo like someone mentioned earlier. That looks like it could be a very impressive stage , especially if another HC climb were to be added. Pity it's unlikely that the tour will use it in the near future.

 

[Eshnar]

Just had a look at the rettenbachferner and rombo combo like someone mentioned earlier. That looks like it could be a very impressive stage , especially if another HC climb were to be added. Pity it's unlikely that the tour will use it in the near future.

it's plain impossible that the Tour will use it in any future.
The Giro is the only GT that can likely do it.

 

[nick101]

its certainly plausible, just it's unlikely with prudholm as director. With a director with an approach like the giro director acquarone, it'd have a high possibility

 

[Eshnar]

its certainly plausible, just it's unlikely with prudholm as director. With a director with an approach like the giro director acquarone, it'd have a high possibility

it's not plausible... the Tour will never have a MTF in Austria. It's just too far. If one day they'll start in Austria they won't certainly do a MTF.

 

[nick101]

Too far? Isn't Ireland further from france

 

[Eshnar]

Too far? Isn't Ireland further from france

Did they have a MTF in Ireland?

No way the Tour would choose to decide the entire race in an early stage, outside France.

 

[Miburo]

I don't like this thread.

Makes me sad if i check out the climbs of this year's tour

 

[Netserk]

In 2007 in the stage from Val d'Isère they climbed the last half of Col de l'Iseran from the north. It was 16km @ 6% (actually a little under) with only 1 km over 8%. That was categorized as HC. Col d'Allos (from the north) is both longer (1km longer) and steeper (0.5% steeper). The only thing in favour of Iseran is the altitude (2770m vs. 2247m).

 

[nick101]

I know it's true. But that comes down to the director's decision. Ireland could actually have a mtf btw. With the giro they proved it was plausible to do what I am suggesting. With the tour it could have an alpine stage then have a mtf in Switzerland, then another in Austria, then a rest day to transfer back to france. That's completely plausible, however prudholme wouldn't make a route like that as has been said

 

[Eshnar]

I know it's true. But that comes down to the director's decision. Ireland could actually have a mtf btw. With the giro they proved it was plausible to do what I am suggesting. With the tour it could have an alpine stage then have a mtf in Switzerland, then another in Austria, then a rest day to transfer back to france. That's completely plausible, however prudholme wouldn't make a route like that as has been said

No one would, not just Proudhomme... Any GT wants to have the deciding stages in its home territory.

 

[nick101]

The giro tried it, created one of the pivotal and more exciting stages of the race, the only stage more decisive was etna

 

[Eshnar]

The giro tried it, created one of the pivotal and more exciting stages of the race, the only stage more decisive was etna

What stage are you talking about?

 

[rghysens]

What stage are you talking about?

probably grossglockner in 2011

 

[nick101]

2011 giro - stage to Grossglockner. Contador gained over a minute on his rivals. The rest of the race he toyed with them.
The vuelta has done it also. They had several stages in the Netherlands in 2009 if I remember correctly. The wind and rain destroyed numerous gc hopes.
2010 giro went to the Netherlands also. Again the wind and rain caused several gc riders to lose time

 

[Eshnar]

You mean the Grossglockner (easiest side) stage was a pivotal stage, in a race that featured Zoncolan, Crostis (RIP), Finestre, Fedaia, Giau, Gardeccia, Etna, Piancavallo... ?
There were no less than 4 stages more important than that one. About it being decisive - it wasn't, but just for argument's sake - we're talking about planning. That stage certainly wasn't meant to be any decisive.

Anyway, I did say there's a chance the Giro might do it. After all Soelden is just a few kms away from the border. They did the Galibier this year too.

But saying the Tour could do it is like saying the Giro could do a MTF up the Col de Portet.

 

[nick101]

the Grossglockner was the second most decisive stage. It may not have meant to be, but it was. The ridiculous stage ending on the val di fasa (included giau, fedaia etc) was more about surviving and not losing time rather than gaining time for the gc riders. Zoncolan contador soft pedalled a lot and toyed with nibali rather than actually trying to gain time. Sestriere stage was at the 19th stage? so not much action happened there as it was late race. Most riders were again trying not to lose time so their gc placings were solidified

 

[Linkinito]

#11: Col de la Cayolle (Alpes-Maritimes)
The one between two legends

There are climbs that are simply outshadowed by bigger, harder difficulties around them, or simply because the legend didn't establish itself on their slopes. At its west, the quite known col d'Allos, taken in every Tour de France between 1911 and 1949, then to be only included five times since, the latest one being the 2000 edition. At its east, the cime de la Bonette. Simply the highest road in France, but surprisingly, only took 4 times by the Tour since 1962, and being passes by the last time by the peloton five years ago. That simply proves how much the Tour doesn't love going into the roads going from Barcelonnette to Nice, and doing the Savoie passes again and again so they can climb them twice in a Tour.

Let's talk about the pass that is located between Allos and Bonette: the col de la Cayolle. It's kind of a twin to Allos, but except that its harder side is the southern one, and it goes a little bit higher, topping at 2326 meters. It links the Var valley to the Ubaye valley. The latter being the point in common between the three climbs: they all start or end up in Ubaye. The Tour de France visited Cayolle only three times, in 1950, 1955 and 1973. Only the first time climbed the hardest side, as the stage went from Nice to Gap, so in other words, from south to north.

Being opened mere days before the start of the first World War, the col de la Cayolle is one of the few climbs that go above the 2000 meters bar. If its north side, starting from Barcelonnette, is the easiest, with many nearly-flat kilometers in the ascent, the final part being the steepest. The south side however, starting from Saint-Martin-d'Entraunes, is a real challenge that goes for over 20 kilometers.

Top: 2326 m
Length: 20.5 km
Ascent: 1291 m
Average gradient: 6.3 %
Climbbybike Difficulty rating: 128

Starting from Saint-Martin-d'Entraunes, the climb is rather easy, averaging 4 % on nearly 6 kilometers. But the real deal begins from Entraunes, with goes straight up with an 8 % portion before an easier part until the heights of Estenc. Then the beauty of the altitude and the wilderness offers itself to the rider during 7 kilometers, at 7.5 % average, with some ramps over 10 %, in a stunning scenery which can only be found in such altitudes. Of course, it might not be as spectacular as the backdrop seen from the Cime de la Bonette, but it's still a delight for the eyes while the whole body and the legs burn from the effort of this demanding climb, and the lungs trying to take as much oxygen as they can above 2000 meters.

If ASO had the choice to go into the deep south east of France, they'd probably choose Bonette for the height, or Allos for the legend. But if a stage had to come from the Nice region and going up to the spectacular Serre-Ponçon lake (which will host an individual time trial this year) then Cayolle would be a definitive alternative. It's a climb that is worth riding, both for amateurs and professionals. It might not be as legendary as the Bonette or Allos, but it keeps a part of secrets and has some kind of charm. That's the advantage of being unknown: you never know what you'll face in the next kilometers.