5 monuments - Cancellara or Gilbert?

[la.margna]

Does someone have some info about Cancellara's weight by the way?

He said he needs to lose 3kg down to 79kg to successfully target LBL and GDL.

“TIn the Worlds at Mendrisio, where I finished fifth, I weighed 79 kilos, while in the Classics this April, I was 82 kilos. If you want to win Liege-Bastogne-Liege in April, you should be 79 kilos. "

 

[El Pistolero]

He said he needs to lose 3kg down to 79kg to successfully target LBL and GDL.

Wow, that's a lot. Surprised he can even get over hills with that much weight then

Philippe Gilbert is like 68kg according to his wiki page.

 

[jens_attacks]

yes but cancellara is a god.he could win LBL even he is 140 kg.because gods do such things.

 

[la.margna]

Wow, that's a lot. Surprised he can even get over hills with that much weight then

Philippe Gilbert is like 68kg according to his wiki page.

absolutely incredible. how can this work? wish i had studied physics...

 

[The Hitch]

yes but cancellara is a god.he could win LBL even he is 140 kg.because gods do such things.

What a beautiful commetn. Enjoyed it.

 

[theyoungest]

absolutely incredible. how can this work? wish i had studied physics...

The solution is probably to put out an insane amount of Watts.

 

[royalpig180]

The solution is probably to put out an insane amount of Watts.

Which is obviously Cancellara's speciality. You don't get to be 4 time world TT champ without insane wattage. This power is what allows Canc to climb decently well at a relatively higher weight than most climbers.

 

[la.margna]

imagine, if in addition to that, Spartacus had the lung volume of Miguel Indurain...

 

[Matthijs]

Does anybody have some detailed info on Gilberts Omloop wins? The final is quite flat and maybe more like PR than RvV and he won it two times. But I think he won both from breaks made in the hilly sections about 60km from the finish line?
Last year he was dropped by Flecha on flat cobbles, but he is a top contender in this race. And are their other reasons why he is considered not so good for PR? Performances in other races (GW old style, Tro bon leon, dwars door Vl) perhaps?

 

[The Hitch]

Cancellara also can't sprint and he isn't really the explosive type. Gilbert would drop him easily.

What was that El Pistolero?

Did i just see Cancellara beat Gilbert in the worlds most important sprint.

What was that you were saying

 

[luckyboy]

Cmon, after all the attacks and work he did? He did well to get 3rd.

 

[L'arriviste]

Gilbert looks dangerous in maybe three out of every four "suitable" races he does these days. As a spectator, you get to thinking he could win any of them.

However, today's MSR illustrates that you need an awful lot of threads in your favour to weave the total tapestry.

So if I could draw any general conclusion, I'd say you'd be more likely to see Gilbert cropping up in the last third of a classic, which gives him a good shot.

 

[Moondance]

Cmon, after all the attacks and work he did? He did well to get 3rd.

Well, despite his talk of being stronger, wiser, awesome-r, etc., its still an equaling of his previous best performance in MSR.

I have to agree with the others though. If Gilbert is ever to win MSR, he'll likely never get a better chance than he had today.

 

[luckyboy]

I can see him doing similar things to last year - win something Ardennes week, and take one or two of those uphill finishes in the Tour. Then we'll see about Autumn.

 

[Lanark]

I don't think Gilbert will even win Sanremo. You need to be in great shape, and for a rider of his type, a lot of luck. In 2006-2008 he was in great shape during MSR, but didn't have a lot of luck. With his peak moved to the end of April (Liège), he will probably never be in his best shape during MSR, today was probably the best chance he's ever gonna get, but simply wasn't good enough. At the end of his carreer he will probably have won LBL, Ronde van Vlaanderen and Lombardia, but I can't see him winning the other two.

 

[ultimobici]

What was that El Pistolero?

Did i just see Cancellara beat Gilbert in the worlds most important sprint.

What was that you were saying

FFS!?? Cancellara made ONE move in the last 7km, on the descent of the Poggio. Gilbert, who had no teammates in the group compared to Cancellara's two, attacked repeatedly and still got 3rd. Leopard were better as a team than Lotto and that is why Cancellara was able to edge Gilbert out.

 

[El Pistolero]

What was that El Pistolero?

Did i just see Cancellara beat Gilbert in the worlds most important sprint.

What was that you were saying

You do know Gilbert just made an attack right before right? The attack that the second fastest sprinter of the group, Filippo Pozatto, foolishly closed. Now where did Pozatto end and where did Gilbert end? Gilbert was third after more effort and the on paper faster sprinter(Pozatto) ended fifth because he burned him self chasing Gilbert.

It wasn't the worlds most important sprint because Goss was there and Gilbert was never going to beat him, so that's why he pulled out an attack in the last few kilometers. It was his only chance and almost succeeded.

In the end, I'm more impressed by Gilbert than Cancellara at Milan-San Remo. Of course that says nothing for the upcoming classics.

 

[El Pistolero]

I don't think Gilbert will even win Sanremo. You need to be in great shape, and for a rider of his type, a lot of luck. In 2006-2008 he was in great shape during MSR, but didn't have a lot of luck. With his peak moved to the end of April (Liège), he will probably never be in his best shape during MSR, today was probably the best chance he's ever gonna get, but simply wasn't good enough. At the end of his carreer he will probably have won LBL, Ronde van Vlaanderen and Lombardia, but I can't see him winning the other two.

That's what I think although I wouldn't put Roubaix behind him. But ovbiously he will want to win Luik a couple of times before even thinking about Roubaix. And that's already going to be hard enough.

If Gilbert had a teammate left, just like Bettini had Paolini in 2003, things could have been different at San Remo this year though.

 

[Lanark]

That's what I think although I wouldn't put Roubaix behind him. But ovbiously he will want to win Luik a couple of times before even thinking about Roubaix. And that's already going to be hard enough.

If Gilbert had a teammate left, just like Bettini had Paolini in 2003, things could have been different at San Remo this year though.

I really can't see him winning Roubaix, I doubt he will ever participate in that race again. He could possibly reach a top-10 spot, but his characteristics (sprinting on a hill) aren't really well suited to a race like Roubaix, there will always be some heavier, stronger guy who can beat him there.

If Gilbert had a team mate, yeah, that's the problem, there isn't anyone else in his team that could make the final selection on the Poggio. With Greipel, VDBjr and Gilbert they have three great riders, but the quality of the rest of the team has suffered a lot, I wouldn't be surprised of VDB and Gilbert will revisit this 'if only I had a teammate with me' thought more than they would like during this season.

 

[El Pistolero]

I really can't see him winning Roubaix, I doubt he will ever participate in that race again. He could possibly reach a top-10 spot, but his characteristics (sprinting on a hill) aren't really well suited to a race like Roubaix, there will always be some heavier, stronger guy who can beat him there.

If Gilbert had a team mate, yeah, that's the problem, there isn't anyone else in his team that could make the final selection on the Poggio. With Greipel, VDBjr and Gilbert they have three great riders, but the quality of the rest of the team has suffered a lot, I wouldn't be surprised of VDB and Gilbert will revisit this 'if only I had a teammate with me' thought more than they would like during this season.

At least Gilbert can count on VDB2 in the Ardennes classics(he did a great job at AGR last year for example) and Greipel did a decent job helping Gilbert in San Remo considering he didn't rode in Tirreno.

But in Luik and Lombardia, the strongest will win. You can't always say the same in San Remo.

As for Roubaix, who knows what he will do if he'll ever win Flanders and Luik a few times. Perhaps put on some weight and try his chances at Roubaix.

 

[Armchair cyclist]

If Gilbert had a team mate, yeah, that's the problem, there isn't anyone else in his team that could make the final selection ... I wouldn't be surprised of VDB and Gilbert will revisit this 'if only I had a teammate with me' thought more than they would like during this season.

Team leaders on Silence-Lotto (for this is the same team) lacking support: deja-vu? (ACF, where are you?)

 

[LukeSchmid]

Team leaders on Silence-Lotto (for this is the same team) lacking support: deja-vu? (ACF, where are you?)

Yes I had that thought too, they could not do anything for Evans and now Gilbert, what a surprise.

I don't think Gilbert or Cancellara will win all five but Cancellara has got the better of two very small chances.

 

[ScottyMuser]

Team leaders on Silence-Lotto (for this is the same team) lacking support: deja-vu? (ACF, where are you?)

Sorry, but he *did* have some support - right up until the Poggia he had both Roelandts and Greipel with him (and Canc had O'Grady and Bennati - so same number and type). The difference was both Jurgen and Andre had done work on the front helping to keep the group away in the preceeding 50kms - whereas as *none* of the leopard trek guys did a single metre on the front, and where therefore considerably more fresh (thus O Grady getting in the mini break). If they had done less work, who would have known what they were capable of, maybe making Goss drop off on the Poggia climb before dropping off themselves?

The one thing I can say with confidence is Lotto have improved considerably as a supporting force without Evans moaning about his teammates continuously over the past 18 months - they got JVDB a 5th place in one of the most mountainous parcours of the last decade! And in the same year helped Gilbert to win AGR, Piemonte & Lombardia, as well as 3rds in LBL, RVV AND G-W!! Hardly "no support"

 

[The Hitch]

You do know Gilbert just made an attack right before right? The attack that the second fastest sprinter of the group, Filippo Pozatto, foolishly closed. Now where did Pozatto end and where did Gilbert end? Gilbert was third after more effort and the on paper faster sprinter(Pozatto) ended fifth because he burned him self chasing Gilbert.

It wasn't the worlds most important sprint because Goss was there and Gilbert was never going to beat him, so that's why he pulled out an attack in the last few kilometers. It was his only chance and almost succeeded.

In the end, I'm more impressed by Gilbert than Cancellara at Milan-San Remo. Of course that says nothing for the upcoming classics.

Even if he had done more work (slightly). You have time and time again made comments that Cancellara cant sprint whereas Gilbert is one of the worlds best sprinters who if he wasnt tearing it up on hills would presumably be facing the likes of Cav in bunch sprints.

But we saw your theory put to the test yesterday and it didnt quite work out that way, did it

Oh and what a surprise, your more impressed by Gilbert. Wow, theres a shock.

Im more impressed by the guy getting ready to peak big time for cobbled races missing a second MSR victory by a wheel, than the guy whose rapidly running out of chances to win the first monument.

But in Luik and Lombardia, the strongest will win. You can't always say the same in San Remo.

So you admit Gilbert wasnt the strongest in 2010 LBL?

 

[El Pistolero]

Cancellara did nothing except in the descend. Gilbert attacked a few times up the Poggio and then on the flat. Of course Cancellara sprinted faster after all that. What does a second place get you? He should've attacked more, but didn't.

Gilbert is just as much peaking towards the bigger classics as Cancellara is. There's simply no excuse there.

And yes, Vino won, so Vino was the strongest/smartest. But this year Vino hasn't left a good impression so far and Valverde is out as well. And Kolobnev is Kolobnev.

Gilbert is still and always will be the faster sprinter of the two.

Ps: Cancellara was almost the same age as Gilbert when he won his first San Remo.