Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

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Aug 6, 2015
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LaFlorecita said:
portugal11 said:
LaFlorecita said:
Looks like the team I posted earlier was fake news. Team so far is:
Gogl
Mollema
Irizar
Felline
Degenkolb
Contador

3 tba
Pantano
Kort
Maybe cardoso?
Pantano for sure
Then Cardoso and Brandle/De Kort I think
Or Ninja Zubeldia
I don't want zubeldia, he is too old to help contador in the mountains
 
Jul 6, 2016
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Valv.Piti said:
Jspear said:
Valv.Piti said:
All I see i is heavily laboured climbing, at a pretty high level nevertheless. Still, its pretty much do or die and I very much doubt it.
Nope. As of last week, he now pedal's like Froome. He is ready for July. :cool:
I hope it will look a little less laboured, its not pretty to watch, especially not compared to his smooth and easy pedalling in the past. You were sometimes wondering if you watched bike racing or found yourself in the royal theatre, watching some kind of dancing, you know.

I find Bjarne Riis to be full of **** most of the time and I really don't like the guy, but he said recently that Contador's biggest strength had become a weakness. He said that in the past, he could stay in the leaders group seated, lets say on a climb with a really high tempo, and then accelerate and put even more wattage out but now by standing up. Says he can't do that anymore as he needs to be standing to keep up the tempo and can't raise it. I don't know if its true at all tho
Very interesting theory, I presume he said it somewhere in the Danish press?

Sometimes I'm wondering if it has something to do with the different chainrings of nowadays, let's say the Wiggins-Froome era began where his real advantage seemed to be over. Maybe he hasn't adapted fast enough to that new style of spinning the smaller gear seated. Instead on good days he is still able to do it his old-fashion way, but far from the dominance he showed in the past. Of course De Jongh is working on it, but a 30-year old who was the king of climbing already at 24 doesn't change manners that quickly.
 
He said it in the annual Tour-magazine. It makes sense, somewhat, but yeah.

Decent Trek-team, I assume Kort will help Degenkolb in the sprints along with Irizar and Gogl. Lets hope Pantano is at his usual level, otherwise Contador will have to rely on Mollema and Felline who are pretty big question marks. Even if the support its good, the best thing to do (at least in the start) will just be to latch on to the Sky-train.
 
Mollema should do absolutely nothing in the early parts of the Tour. Save himself completely. He should be in fine form if he doesn't burn himself out. I don't believe he'll harbor any personal ambitions. The Giro should have given him a reality check.
 
Aug 6, 2015
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Contador has a good team for le tour, now he just has to avoid crashes (specially in stage 3). I saw a contador's comment in mollema's instagram so I think they have a nice relationship or is just contador trying to persuade mollema to work for him. Nice move by contador
 
Stage 1 TT will be the first stage in about two years where we will actually see Contador's top (current) form. I only count his top form in the GTs that he targets/prepares good for. So the last would be Giro 2015. Tour 2015 wasn't his best clearly and last year he crashed (twice!!) before we even got to the first test of form. The preparation went fine this year, he won't crash before the TT (although there is a matter of a certain team presentation - he might fall into a ditch or something :eek: ). But in reallity we should actually be able to see his top state. I just don't know if I should be pleased or worried about that... :Neutral:
 
Re:

portugal11 said:
Contador has a good team for le tour, now he just has to avoid crashes (specially in stage 3). I saw a contador's comment in mollema's instagram so I think they have a nice relationship or is just contador trying to persuade mollema to work for him. Nice move by contador
I see lots of likes and comments from Berto on Mollema's posts but none in return, but then again I rarely see likes and comments from Mollema on any post so perhaps he's not that kinda guy.
 
Huge success for the Fundacion Contador team at the U23 Spanish Championships: their riders in 1st and 3rd place (Isaac Canton and Diego Sevilla), with 2nd and 4th going to two riders who raced for the team until last year (Alvaro Cuadros and Fernando Barcelo)

 
Jul 6, 2016
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LaFlorecita said:
http://www.velon.cc/en/news/2017/06/koen-de-kort-rider-diary-tour-de-france-alberto-contador
Our one and only goal at the Tour will be GC, and who knows, maybe we will have our moments in the sprints with John Degenkolb, too
I think all in all De Kort is a very good guy to have on board in this team. He has played a vital role in the several extremely successful Giant Shimano Tours, knows Alberto very well, makes Degenkolb happy, knows how to keep the morale high, is a very loyal and good domestique (which sets also a discrete example for the others), maybe he is somehow supportive to Mollema also (which could be crucial for his support to Alberto). It's about many other things than only good form and a high wattage.
 
Re:

LaFlorecita said:
http://www.velon.cc/en/news/2017/06/koen-de-kort-rider-diary-tour-de-france-alberto-contador
Our one and only goal at the Tour will be GC, and who knows, maybe we will have our moments in the sprints with John Degenkolb, too
Lol did you see the "who will win yellow in the Tour" poll at the end of the article? 44% saying AC. 15% saying Froome. :D
 
Re: Re:

Jspear said:
LaFlorecita said:
http://www.velon.cc/en/news/2017/06/koen-de-kort-rider-diary-tour-de-france-alberto-contador
Our one and only goal at the Tour will be GC, and who knows, maybe we will have our moments in the sprints with John Degenkolb, too
Lol did you see the "who will win yellow in the Tour" poll at the end of the article? 44% saying AC. 15% saying Froome. :D
Contador fans in reading Contador article and responding to Contador poll shocker.
 
Re: Re:

Jspear said:
LaFlorecita said:
http://www.velon.cc/en/news/2017/06/koen-de-kort-rider-diary-tour-de-france-alberto-contador
Our one and only goal at the Tour will be GC, and who knows, maybe we will have our moments in the sprints with John Degenkolb, too
Lol did you see the "who will win yellow in the Tour" poll at the end of the article? 44% saying AC. 15% saying Froome. :D
Surprised that Froome received that many votes!

Even on the forum thread TDF poll, Contador is at about 15% himself. I think that many of us do give him almost a 10% chance to win the Tour. You can get around 20-1 for him to win, so given that that's for a 5% chance, more of us 'should' be betting on him.

But I am guessing that most Contador fans are much smarter than me, and so don't bet at all :D
 
Re: Re:

On a slightly more serious note, I think that Contador is the hardest to predict of the contenders this year. In the sense that I think it is possible for him to be strongly in contention for the yellow jersey with many of us telling you, "I told you so", just as it is possible for him to a minute plus behind on most of the major stages and finish well outside the top five, with many of us telling you, "I told you so".

Is the 'real' Contador post ban closer to the 2012/13 version, or to the 2014 version?

The Contador that we have seen post 2014 has reached levels that are sort of in the middle of those two contrasts. Still, there are many debatable factors within these seasons, and only really Alberto, and perhaps those in his inner sanctum, can truly know what his form was like in those times, and what it is like - or is likely to be like - now.

Most of us seem to put a line through the 2013 Tour. I'm not sure why. Perhaps because it was a long time ago, and perhaps because his form in 2014 was clearly so much better, and that he erased some of the mental fatigue from Froome's battering of him there, with victory over him in the 2014 Vuelta. But none of us knows the true extent of their injuries from the 2014 Tour. We all assumed that Alberto's was far worse, but maybe Chris's injury - despite coming earlier in the race - was worse, and took longer to heal. Or maybe Contador's peak form that year was simply a level above Froome's (backed up by suggestions that he doesn't come as close to a peak at the Dauphne as Froome does)?

But even all of that is three years ago now.

So what about 2015? Was Contador's Giro a grand success, or a slight disappointment (in terms of performance level)? How close was Contador's level in the long ITT and on the Mortirolo, to Froome's on PSM? I would guess that if you took 'peak' Contador from two weeks into the Giro and threw him into that MTF, then he finishers around half a minute behind Froome. But that's just a guess. Maybe he wouldn't even have kept up with Quintana?

Contador's Giro and Froome's Tour are actually fairly similar from that season. They both built substantial GC leads, which came under a slight threat on the final GC relevant stage. Contador's situation briefly looked more threatening, and he looked to have cracked even more, but he didn't have any teammates. It is possible that without Porte, that Froome could have lost that Tour to Quintana.

But he had a strong team then, and he has a strong team now.

But on an overall performance level, Contador's Giro in 2015 is possibly not much lesser to Froome's Tour. I suppose it depends on how you rate the level of Astana vs. Quintana.

Contador has not produced anything as impressive as his two weeks into the Giro 2015 form, since, IMO. However, Froome also has not produced any out of this world climbing performances since the 2015 Tour. He smashed Contador in last years long Vuelta ITT, but there are none of those in this years Tour (and on a lesser note Contador just beat him in this years Dauphne ITT anyway).

And what of that 2016 Vuelta? Much like the 2014 Vuelta, we don't know the full extent of Contador's circumstances from his injury at the Tour. We thought that his 2016 injury was lesser than his 2014 one, but perhaps it wasn't? Or perhaps his recovery from such an injury just isn't as good when two years older? Or perhaps it was just that his 2016 overall form, was that much below his 2014 form?

In 2017 Contador is still showing good form, if not close to what he showed on some stages in 2014. His performances in Paris-Nice showed us that he still has the hunger for real racing, and even that his legs still feel those "sensations" on occasion. If Froome doesn't return to quite his 2013 and 2015 level, and if Contador doesn't fall off his bike (a big IF), then to me, he has an outside chance at winning another Tour. Porte is likely to be stronger uphill and in the ITT's (at his peak level), but he hasn't faced the pressure of holding onto the lead in the third week of a GT yet. Contador won't count himself out if he is within striking distance going into the Alps.

And then we have Quintana who I doubt can win after doing the Giro, and a 37 year old Valverde (plus some other hopefuls such as Bardet and the Astana boys).

Contador is 34. That's old, but these days it's not that old. Evans won the Tour at 34. Armstrong won his last Tour at 33 (and podiumed at 37). Valverde is podiuming GT's beyond his mid 30's. And then there is Chris Horner.

And the course suits Contador. Even that last ITT. It is short, and has a short sharp hill in the middle of it.

I can almost see Alberto snatching yellow right there, right now :D
 
Jul 1, 2013
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Re: Re:

gregrowlerson said:
On a slightly more serious note, I think that Contador is the hardest to predict of the contenders this year. In the sense that I think it is possible for him to be strongly in contention for the yellow jersey with many of us telling you, "I told you so", just as it is possible for him to a minute plus behind on most of the major stages and finish well outside the top five, with many of us telling you, "I told you so".

Is the 'real' Contador post ban closer to the 2012/13 version, or to the 2014 version?

The Contador that we have seen post 2014 has reached levels that are sort of in the middle of those two contrasts. Still, there are many debatable factors within these seasons, and only really Alberto, and perhaps those in his inner sanctum, can truly know what his form was like in those times, and what it is like - or is likely to be like - now.

Most of us seem to put a line through the 2013 Tour. I'm not sure why. Perhaps because it was a long time ago, and perhaps because his form in 2014 was clearly so much better, and that he erased some of the mental fatigue from Froome's battering of him there, with victory over him in the 2014 Vuelta. But none of us knows the true extent of their injuries from the 2014 Tour. We all assumed that Alberto's was far worse, but maybe Chris's injury - despite coming earlier in the race - was worse, and took longer to heal. Or maybe Contador's peak form that year was simply a level above Froome's (backed up by suggestions that he doesn't come as close to a peak at the Dauphne as Froome does)?

But even all of that is three years ago now.

So what about 2015? Was Contador's Giro a grand success, or a slight disappointment (in terms of performance level)? How close was Contador's level in the long ITT and on the Mortirolo, to Froome's on PSM? I would guess that if you took 'peak' Contador from two weeks into the Giro and threw him into that MTF, then he finishers around half a minute behind Froome. But that's just a guess. Maybe he wouldn't even have kept up with Quintana?

Contador's Giro and Froome's Tour are actually fairly similar from that season. They both built substantial GC leads, which came under a slight threat on the final GC relevant stage. Contador's situation briefly looked more threatening, and he looked to have cracked even more, but he didn't have any teammates. It is possible that without Porte, that Froome could have lost that Tour to Quintana.

But he had a strong team then, and he has a strong team now.

But on an overall performance level, Contador's Giro in 2015 is possibly not much lesser to Froome's Tour. I suppose it depends on how you rate the level of Astana vs. Quintana.

Contador has not produced anything as impressive as his two weeks into the Giro 2015 form, since, IMO. However, Froome also has not produced any out of this world climbing performances since the 2015 Tour. He smashed Contador in last years long Vuelta ITT, but there are none of those in this years Tour (and on a lesser note Contador just beat him in this years Dauphne ITT anyway).

And what of that 2016 Vuelta? Much like the 2014 Vuelta, we don't know the full extent of Contador's circumstances from his injury at the Tour. We thought that his 2016 injury was lesser than his 2014 one, but perhaps it wasn't? Or perhaps his recovery from such an injury just isn't as good when two years older? Or perhaps it was just that his 2016 overall form, was that much below his 2014 form?

In 2017 Contador is still showing good form, if not close to what he showed on some stages in 2014. His performances in Paris-Nice showed us that he still has the hunger for real racing, and even that his legs still feel those "sensations" on occasion. If Froome doesn't return to quite his 2013 and 2015 level, and if Contador doesn't fall off his bike (a big IF), then to me, he has an outside chance at winning another Tour. Porte is likely to be stronger uphill and in the ITT's (at his peak level), but he hasn't faced the pressure of holding onto the lead in the third week of a GT yet. Contador won't count himself out if he is within striking distance going into the Alps.

And then we have Quintana who I doubt can win after doing the Giro, and a 37 year old Valverde (plus some other hopefuls such as Bardet and the Astana boys).

Contador is 34. That's old, but these days it's not that old. Evans won the Tour at 34. Armstrong won his last Tour at 33 (and podiumed at 37). Valverde is podiuming GT's beyond his mid 30's. And then there is Chris Horner.

And the course suits Contador. Even that last ITT. It is short, and has a short sharp hill in the middle of it.

I can almost see Alberto snatching yellow right there, right now :D
He will win :)
 
Re: Re:

gregrowlerson said:
On a slightly more serious note, I think that Contador is the hardest to predict of the contenders this year. In the sense that I think it is possible for him to be strongly in contention for the yellow jersey with many of us telling you, "I told you so", just as it is possible for him to a minute plus behind on most of the major stages and finish well outside the top five, with many of us telling you, "I told you so".

Is the 'real' Contador post ban closer to the 2012/13 version, or to the 2014 version?

The Contador that we have seen post 2014 has reached levels that are sort of in the middle of those two contrasts. Still, there are many debatable factors within these seasons, and only really Alberto, and perhaps those in his inner sanctum, can truly know what his form was like in those times, and what it is like - or is likely to be like - now.

Most of us seem to put a line through the 2013 Tour. I'm not sure why. Perhaps because it was a long time ago, and perhaps because his form in 2014 was clearly so much better, and that he erased some of the mental fatigue from Froome's battering of him there, with victory over him in the 2014 Vuelta. But none of us knows the true extent of their injuries from the 2014 Tour. We all assumed that Alberto's was far worse, but maybe Chris's injury - despite coming earlier in the race - was worse, and took longer to heal. Or maybe Contador's peak form that year was simply a level above Froome's (backed up by suggestions that he doesn't come as close to a peak at the Dauphne as Froome does)?

But even all of that is three years ago now.

So what about 2015? Was Contador's Giro a grand success, or a slight disappointment (in terms of performance level)? How close was Contador's level in the long ITT and on the Mortirolo, to Froome's on PSM? I would guess that if you took 'peak' Contador from two weeks into the Giro and threw him into that MTF, then he finishers around half a minute behind Froome. But that's just a guess. Maybe he wouldn't even have kept up with Quintana?

Contador's Giro and Froome's Tour are actually fairly similar from that season. They both built substantial GC leads, which came under a slight threat on the final GC relevant stage. Contador's situation briefly looked more threatening, and he looked to have cracked even more, but he didn't have any teammates. It is possible that without Porte, that Froome could have lost that Tour to Quintana.

But he had a strong team then, and he has a strong team now.

But on an overall performance level, Contador's Giro in 2015 is possibly not much lesser to Froome's Tour. I suppose it depends on how you rate the level of Astana vs. Quintana.

Contador has not produced anything as impressive as his two weeks into the Giro 2015 form, since, IMO. However, Froome also has not produced any out of this world climbing performances since the 2015 Tour. He smashed Contador in last years long Vuelta ITT, but there are none of those in this years Tour (and on a lesser note Contador just beat him in this years Dauphne ITT anyway).

And what of that 2016 Vuelta? Much like the 2014 Vuelta, we don't know the full extent of Contador's circumstances from his injury at the Tour. We thought that his 2016 injury was lesser than his 2014 one, but perhaps it wasn't? Or perhaps his recovery from such an injury just isn't as good when two years older? Or perhaps it was just that his 2016 overall form, was that much below his 2014 form?

In 2017 Contador is still showing good form, if not close to what he showed on some stages in 2014. His performances in Paris-Nice showed us that he still has the hunger for real racing, and even that his legs still feel those "sensations" on occasion. If Froome doesn't return to quite his 2013 and 2015 level, and if Contador doesn't fall off his bike (a big IF), then to me, he has an outside chance at winning another Tour. Porte is likely to be stronger uphill and in the ITT's (at his peak level), but he hasn't faced the pressure of holding onto the lead in the third week of a GT yet. Contador won't count himself out if he is within striking distance going into the Alps.

And then we have Quintana who I doubt can win after doing the Giro, and a 37 year old Valverde (plus some other hopefuls such as Bardet and the Astana boys).

Contador is 34. That's old, but these days it's not that old. Evans won the Tour at 34. Armstrong won his last Tour at 33 (and podiumed at 37). Valverde is podiuming GT's beyond his mid 30's. And then there is Chris Horner.

And the course suits Contador. Even that last ITT. It is short, and has a short sharp hill in the middle of it.

I can almost see Alberto snatching yellow right there, right now :D
Great post.

One thing I'm almost entirely sure about, is that he the circumstances in which he entered the Vuelta are way worse than in 2014. In 2014 he came off injury, and wash fresh. Last year he crashed twice and then continued for more than a week, when his body was trying to recover. That's tiring as ***, and given that he may have overtrained even before the DL, it explains a lot of his bad performance in the Vuelta.
 
Re: Re:

gregrowlerson said:
On a slightly more serious note, I think that Contador is the hardest to predict of the contenders this year. In the sense that I think it is possible for him to be strongly in contention for the yellow jersey with many of us telling you, "I told you so", just as it is possible for him to a minute plus behind on most of the major stages and finish well outside the top five, with many of us telling you, "I told you so".

Is the 'real' Contador post ban closer to the 2012/13 version, or to the 2014 version?

The Contador that we have seen post 2014 has reached levels that are sort of in the middle of those two contrasts. Still, there are many debatable factors within these seasons, and only really Alberto, and perhaps those in his inner sanctum, can truly know what his form was like in those times, and what it is like - or is likely to be like - now.

Most of us seem to put a line through the 2013 Tour. I'm not sure why. Perhaps because it was a long time ago, and perhaps because his form in 2014 was clearly so much better, and that he erased some of the mental fatigue from Froome's battering of him there, with victory over him in the 2014 Vuelta. But none of us knows the true extent of their injuries from the 2014 Tour. We all assumed that Alberto's was far worse, but maybe Chris's injury - despite coming earlier in the race - was worse, and took longer to heal. Or maybe Contador's peak form that year was simply a level above Froome's (backed up by suggestions that he doesn't come as close to a peak at the Dauphne as Froome does)?

But even all of that is three years ago now.

So what about 2015? Was Contador's Giro a grand success, or a slight disappointment (in terms of performance level)? How close was Contador's level in the long ITT and on the Mortirolo, to Froome's on PSM? I would guess that if you took 'peak' Contador from two weeks into the Giro and threw him into that MTF, then he finishers around half a minute behind Froome. But that's just a guess. Maybe he wouldn't even have kept up with Quintana?

Contador's Giro and Froome's Tour are actually fairly similar from that season. They both built substantial GC leads, which came under a slight threat on the final GC relevant stage. Contador's situation briefly looked more threatening, and he looked to have cracked even more, but he didn't have any teammates. It is possible that without Porte, that Froome could have lost that Tour to Quintana.

But he had a strong team then, and he has a strong team now.

But on an overall performance level, Contador's Giro in 2015 is possibly not much lesser to Froome's Tour. I suppose it depends on how you rate the level of Astana vs. Quintana.

Contador has not produced anything as impressive as his two weeks into the Giro 2015 form, since, IMO. However, Froome also has not produced any out of this world climbing performances since the 2015 Tour. He smashed Contador in last years long Vuelta ITT, but there are none of those in this years Tour (and on a lesser note Contador just beat him in this years Dauphne ITT anyway).

And what of that 2016 Vuelta? Much like the 2014 Vuelta, we don't know the full extent of Contador's circumstances from his injury at the Tour. We thought that his 2016 injury was lesser than his 2014 one, but perhaps it wasn't? Or perhaps his recovery from such an injury just isn't as good when two years older? Or perhaps it was just that his 2016 overall form, was that much below his 2014 form?

In 2017 Contador is still showing good form, if not close to what he showed on some stages in 2014. His performances in Paris-Nice showed us that he still has the hunger for real racing, and even that his legs still feel those "sensations" on occasion. If Froome doesn't return to quite his 2013 and 2015 level, and if Contador doesn't fall off his bike (a big IF), then to me, he has an outside chance at winning another Tour. Porte is likely to be stronger uphill and in the ITT's (at his peak level), but he hasn't faced the pressure of holding onto the lead in the third week of a GT yet. Contador won't count himself out if he is within striking distance going into the Alps.

And then we have Quintana who I doubt can win after doing the Giro, and a 37 year old Valverde (plus some other hopefuls such as Bardet and the Astana boys).

Contador is 34. That's old, but these days it's not that old. Evans won the Tour at 34. Armstrong won his last Tour at 33 (and podiumed at 37). Valverde is podiuming GT's beyond his mid 30's. And then there is Chris Horner.

And the course suits Contador. Even that last ITT. It is short, and has a short sharp hill in the middle of it.

I can almost see Alberto snatching yellow right there, right now :D
i don't think you can compare Contador's career trajectory to Evans. They were very different riders so the age isn't going to mean much. One thing this race will do win or lose, it should clarify Contador's chances of winning future GTs. The last thing you want in a GT is to see the best riders crashing out or getting sick and retiring. I think this course suits Contador at this stage of his career. I just want to see a good battle with the top five riders. Next year with maybe Nibali and Dumoulin it could be even better.
 

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