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Teams & Riders Alberto Contador Discussion Thread

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Taxus4a

Taxus4a

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ILovecycling said:
The important thing is - this is no 2008 anymore.These are freakin Froome n Quintana.Back then there were only attack-inept Leipheimer and clinic Ricco who couldnt tt.
The thing is win his eight gt,not to be in Top5, he is no vdb2 and we know that.
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The thing is that he didnt finish any GT this year, he is spanish and he can ride La Vuelta in a good condition and it is not a question if he is in the best condition posible, becouse after to ride Le Tour how he pretended, it is not maybe the best way.

As well Nibali told last year he was producing more watios in the Giro than in the Vuelta,.. so, the best way is like Horner last year, fresh, with some races in altitude in USA, but not everybody is going to be in the best condition. If Quintana or Froome, or Horner, or Uran or Talansky, or any other one beat him, maybe they are better.

Contador rode last year TdF, and a lot of riders were stronger, he must ride, not only if he is going to win for sure. He get 3 millions a year to ride if he can ride. If he can train in a normal way for more than a week, that musnt be a problem. Of course, the ideal way would be to ride Vuelta a Burgos, and he is not ready for that, but he has rode almost half a TdF, so that is not so important.

Anyway, he wanst the strong two years ago and he won the race. For me, there isnt any reason to think that Contador is not going to be in the same condition or even better in the hard Ancares (Pan do Zarco)
 
ILovecycling

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Taxus4a said:
The thing is that he didnt finish any GT this year, he is spanish and he can ride La Vuelta in a good condition and it is not a question if he is in the best condition posible, becouse after to ride Le Tour how he pretended, it is not maybe the best way.

As well Nibali told last year he was producing more watios in the Giro than in the Vuelta,.. so, the best way is like Horner last year, fresh, with some races in altitude in USA, but not everybody is going to be in the best condition. If Quintana or Froome, or Horner, or Uran or Talansky, or any other one beat him, maybe they are better.

Contador rode last year TdF, and a lot of riders were stronger, he must ride, not only if he is going to win for sure. He get 3 millions a year to ride if he can ride. If he can train in a normal way for more than a week, that musnt be a problem. Of course, the ideal way would be to ride Vuelta a Burgos, and he is not ready for that, but he has rode almost half a TdF, so that is not so important.

Anyway, he wanst the strong two years ago and he won the race. For me, there isnt any reason to think that Contador is not going to be in the same condition or even better in the hard Ancares (Pan do Zarco)
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Good post.It will be tough cuz stage 6 is early in the race,and there can be differences.
Its also the key to hold Froome and Nairo wheel in the first week,he can gain confidence like this.
 
Walkman

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BlurryVII said:
So first of all, my post was all about the period post Tour 2010 so you don't make any sense.
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You wrote:

BlurryVII said:
..the guy will never have a GT handed to him..
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It implies that he never has, nor never will, have a GT handed to him, hence my response, since in my mind, and probably in most fans mind, he has been gifted a Tour on a silver plate like no other in recent years.

BlurryVII said:
In 2007 Leipheimer never worked for Contador, apart from Aubisque, he was supposed to be the leader at the start in London but Contador just proved he was better throughout the race.
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If Levi was riding on his own he could have done mountain time trials with Evans and thus reduced the loss to Contador and Rasmussen. Then he could probably have gained 10-20 seconds more on stage 16 on Contador.

BlurryVII said:
Same at the Vuelta 2008, Leipheimer only worked for him on the Angliru, and Alberto was much stronger that day anyway.
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From what I remember it was more than just the Angliru. And I still maintain my opinion.

BlurryVII said:
Basso Vino Ullrich didn't have the level to compete anymore, it's not Alberto 's fault. And he has proved to be a better climber.
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Basso didn't have the level to compete in 2007?!

Yeah, sure. He was freaking RoboBasso back then. Dominated the Giro and won by 10+ minutes in 2006. If anything, he was entering his prime during tis time. Heck, didn't Basso climbed faster in 2010 than Contador did in 2011?

(Can't fin AC's time. Basso did it in 40:42)
http://www.climbing-records.com/2014/05/the-colombians-fastest-on-zoncolan.html

Vino won the Vuelta 2006 and was right in his prime and Ullrich was supposedly "better than ever" in 2006. I don't really know what level Ullrich had in 2006 but either way, a route with 100+ km of TT was in his favor.
 
BlurryVII

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@Walkman

Vino never proved anything during the Tour 2007, even with his crash, he just didn't have the level to compete with Contador on the mountains.
He's never been as good as Contador as a stage racer, that's for sure, even in his prime. Same for Basso.

How can you compare the Zoncolan time with Basso 2010? Contador just followed Nibali's wheel, and wasn't having his greatest day either.
And what's your point? Contador would litterally crush Basso at his 2010 Giro lvl just seeing his Etna and Grossglockner (440 watts ave.) performances .
Just stop the comparisons, Contador wins it hands down against Basso without going into details.

When I say the Tour was handed to Wiggo and Nibali I mean it wasn't fought at ALL. Froome literally gifted Wiggins the Tour 2012, because he lost time 1 min or so in the early flat stages. Nibali won this year against pretty much nobody, all of his main opponents crashed out. It was just meant to be. Nibali was destined to get the triple crown, even Anton abondoned at the Vuelta 10' when he was strongest in the mountains and had the leader's jersey.
 
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Vino attacks everyone

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BlurryVII said:
@Walkman

Vino never proved anything during the Tour 2007, even with his crash, he just didn't have the level to compete with Contador on the mountains.
He's never been as good as Contador as a stage racer, that's for sure, even in his prime. Same for Basso.

How can you compare the Zoncolan time with Basso 2010? Contador just followed Nibali's wheel, and wasn't having his greatest day either.
And what's your point? Contador would litterally crush Basso at his 2010 Giro lvl just seeing his Etna and Grossglockner (440 watts ave.) performances .
Just stop the comparisons, Contador wins it hands down against Basso without going into details.

When I say the Tour was handed to Wiggo and Nibali I mean it wasn't fought at ALL. Froome literally gifted Wiggins the Tour 2012, because he lost time 1 min or so in the early flat stages. Nibali won this year against pretty much nobody, all of his main opponents crashed out. It was just meant to be. Nibali was destined to get the triple crown, even Anton abondoned at the Vuelta 10' when he was strongest in the mountains and had the leader's jersey.
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basso 06 was on par with AC at the very least
 
BlurryVII

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Vino attacks everyone said:
basso 06 was on par with AC at the very least
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What? Certainly not. You think he'd match Contador in his prime (2009 Tour) ? Neither in climbing nor in TT.

Who was 2nd in Giro 06'? Guttierez, and then Simoni.
Casar in the Top 10 :eek: Nothing else to add really :rolleyes:
 
Miburo

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Vino attacks everyone said:
basso 06 was on par with AC at the very least
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RoboBasso was for sure better than Contador and that comes from a contador fan :D

I'm still sure that he could have won that giro with 30 min lol

Blury man, you prob didn't see the giro '06, otherwise you're just blind. Basso was never breathing in the MTF's. Riding at 85% lol
 
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BlurryVII said:
What? Certainly not. You think he'd match Contador in his prime (2009 Tour) ? Neither in climbing nor in TT.

Who was 2nd in Giro 06'? Guttierez, and then Simoni.
Casar in the Top 10 :eek: Nothing else to add really :rolleyes:
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Brilliant logic. His opposition wasn't that great (which Gutierrez and Simoni was btw ;)) therfore I deside that he wasn't that great either. His climbing was on par with AC 09
 
BlurryVII

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Miburo said:
RoboBasso was for sure better than Contador and that comes from a contador fan :D

I'm still sure that he could have won that giro with 30 min lol

Blury man, you prob didn't see the giro '06, otherwise you're just blind. Basso was never breathing in the MTF's. Riding at 85% lol
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Missed the Giro 06'. For sure I'd love to see him ride away from Contador in his prime :eek: And then beat him in TT :rolleyes:

Vino attacks everyone said:
Brilliant logic. His opposition wasn't that great (which Gutierrez and Simoni was btw ;)) therfore I deside that he wasn't that great either. His climbing was on par with AC 09
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I don't know about his power output so I couldn't say. He was never that great in TT, so he doesn't really match Contador
 
BlurryVII

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Vino attacks everyone said:
Not in 06...!!!!
And I am fully aware that AC won the tour tt. But your argument seems to be that he would take lots of time on Basso in the tt prime vs prime and that wouldn't be the case (especially not in the tour 07)
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Yeah, back to the Tour 07. Basso's prime was 06, not 07 though
Nothing indicates he would've been at the same lvl, especially considering the clinic stuff. He was under pressure.
 
BlurryVII

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Miburo said:
Why is this a discussion? The guy didn't see Basso in '06 thus everything he says is invalid.
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You saw him, good for you. Couldn't watch the Giro that year, however I don't have any power data that would indicate he was as good as AC 09'.
You won't be able to judge visually, if he's better or not.

Anyway the point was Basso woud've probably beaten AC in 07' which is utter crap . We talking 07', not 06'. As I said, nothing indicates he would've showed up at the same lvl a year later.
If you don't know where the discussion began, then what you say is quite irrelevant as well.
 
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BlurryVII said:
What? Certainly not. You think he'd match Contador in his prime (2009 Tour) ? Neither in climbing nor in TT.

Who was 2nd in Giro 06'? Guttierez, and then Simoni.
Casar in the Top 10 :eek: Nothing else to add really :rolleyes:
Click to expand...

How could anybody doubt RoboBasso? Prima facie insanity. Casar was top ten in both those races. Case closed.
 
ILovecycling

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Miburo said:
Why is this a discussion? The guy didn't see Basso in '06 thus everything he says is invalid.
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I saw him,he was impressive,but lack of competition and his stone face (menchov,quintana like) makes overhyped expression.
He would have been worse than AC 2011 for sure,maybe not by a big margin,but still.Where are his watt,vam records...
 
Jelantik

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Carols said:
Posted on FB:

20 days after my crash in the Tour, I downloaded the file and could see the exact speed of the fall, 76,8 km/h!!!
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then in hindsidght, he was very very luck to suffer just a cut and fracture tibia. It could have been worst. Like Beloki, the crash ended his carreer. At this point, I'm hoping he can recover well. Don't care if he can take part on vuelta or not. If he can get back to his tour shape or better, that's all matters, expecially after his crash.
 
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roundabout said:
Au contraire. That Monte Bondone climb was one of the greatest performances of the last 15 years.
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The best thing was that he smiled during his effort. Those were incredible performances. Also San Carlo 1820 vm/h he waited for Piepoli.
But 1780 vm/h on an almost 20 km climb with close to 8% average gradient is at least on par with the best Lance Armstrong. Lance would have lost against that Basso in '06. Almost on Ullrich level in TT's and climbing much faster than in '05. It really was Basso entering his prime.
 
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Jelantik said:
then in hindsidght, he was very very luck to suffer just a cut and fracture tibia. It could have been worst. Like Beloki, the crash ended his carreer. At this point, I'm hoping he can recover well. Don't care if he can take part on vuelta or not. If he can get back to his tour shape or better, that's all matters, expecially after his crash.
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If he is fully healed and able to ride 5 hours without problems a week before the Vuelta, he could give it a try. Training under race conditions. I'm sure he still has a decent shape and could podium. He was off the bike for less than 3 weeks.
 
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