Teams & Riders Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

[Netserk]

Either you ride away full gas, or you stay but don't whine about it.

 

[scholar]

Either you ride away full gas, or you stay but don't whine about it.

This. Unless your aim is to give the impression that you're by far the strongest rider without actually having to prove it.

 

[Knutsen]

Unless your aim is to give the impression that you're by far the strongest rider without actually having to prove it.

This. 2x

 

[Pricey_sky]

This. Unless your aim is to give the impression that you're by far the strongest rider without actually having to prove it.

That's what I believe too, it worked as that show of strength earned him the Tour leader job and relegated Wiggins plan to the Giro last year.

 

[webvan]

And he was lucky because when he tried to prove it at the Vuelta 2012 he made a fool of himself. Granted he would have been tired from the TDF, but still...I guess 2014 is the year of the final showdown ;-)

 

[CycloAndy]

This. Unless your aim is to give the impression that you're by far the strongest rider without actually having to prove it.

Sums it up for me. Prima Donna Froome sounds like Yaya Toure. Sky had committed to Wiggins for years and he was winning so if Froome felt betrayed, imagine how betrayed Wiggins would feel if they suddenly changed support to Froome.

 

[Pricey_sky]

And he was lucky because when he tried to prove it at the Vuelta 2012 he made a fool of himself. Granted he would have been tired from the TDF, but still...I guess 2014 is the year of the final showdown ;-)

I wouldn't take Vuelta 2012 form into it because of exactly that reason, whilst he didn't push himself 100% at the Tour he still had to pace Wiggins up every mountain and we know how difficult it is to do back to back GT's nowadays, especially trying to win both.

 

[Netserk]

Yet Contador the year before was much better in his 2nd GT. If luck was on his side he could've won it, so I don't agree with the "we know how difficult it is to do back to back GT's nowadays" especially considering how easy the Tour '12 was compared to the Giro '11.

 

[Pricey_sky]

Yet Contador the year before was much better in his 2nd GT. If luck was on his side he could've won it, so I don't agree with the "we know how difficult it is to do back to back GT's nowadays" especially considering how easy the Tour '12 was compared to the Giro '11.

Really? I know he was unlucky with crashes but I remember Contador in the final week of the Tour 2011 saying he was absolutely exhausted. There is no way he'd have beaten Evans or Andy that year with the tough Giro in his legs too.

 

[webvan]

Well the Giro had more climbing but was possibly less tense/stressful as the TDF...anyway my point was more that Froome still managed to get the reigning TDF champ kicked out in 2013 with a weak Vuelta. In the end it worked out ok for Sky but still...Froome really shouldn't be so cocky, at some point it will bite him back, probably faster than he expects.

 

[Pricey_sky]

Well the Giro had more climbing but was possibly less tense/stressful as the TDF...anyway my point was more that Froome still managed to get the reigning TDF champ kicked out in 2013 with a weak Vuelta. In the end it worked out ok for Sky but still...Froome really shouldn't be so cocky, at some point it will bite him back, probably faster than he expects.

Yeah I do agree in part, I still think he proved he deserved his leadership role with his results last season. He started in Oman and then carried on through to the Tour in July.

 

[The Hitch]

Sums it up for me. Prima Donna Froome sounds like Yaya Toure. Sky had committed to Wiggins for years and he was winning so if Froome felt betrayed, imagine how betrayed Wiggins would feel if they suddenly changed support to Froome.

Why would they have to change?

This idea that a team must always have 1 dictatorlike leader which every other rider on the team is dedicated to serve and no one else on the team is allowed to do anything was invented by Wiggins in the run up to the 2012 Tour in order to stop Froome from being a challenger.

Ironically the very next year when he was in Froome's position, he directly contradicted that by saying he wanted a free role on Froome's team (hillariously changing the goal posts year to year as he pleases)


In reality it is perfectly normal for teams to give other riders room to do things on certin stages or even during the race even as the rest of the team continues to support the leader.

Allowing Froome to ride in no way required them to change support to him.

And if Sky weren't 50x better than every other team that year and weren't carrying out an orchestrated 1-2, forcing Froome to hang back that year, may have cost them, as it did in the 2011 Vuelta.

Though of course the aim was never to win the 2012 Tour. It was to win the 2012 Tour with a 3 time olympic champion who already had a profile in the country and would thus become the face of the upcoming olympics.

 

[TANK91]

There's a reason why Wiggins is a knight and the other not, and probably never will.
One is a champ. The other is a highly talented rider. And that's that.

Ah well at least Froome can say i worked for a TDF leader. You all forget the diva'a actions last year, as Wiggins once worked for Froome since that 2012 TDF? Nope even in WCRR before Froome withdrew Wiggins was gone. Froome will have the far better road carear and that is a fact. Win another TDF he would have done it already. At least Froome can win in the mountains he could drop Wiggins anytime he wanted and it is so funny watching the diva panic like he is about to die climbing all laugh at Sir Brad. HAHA.

 

[Walkman]

This leads back to the debate of Wiggins TT vs Froomes mountain ability. Do you jeopardise the yellow jersey for the team for the sake of individual ego?

Jeopardise?!

That's the thing, if Wiggins can't 5km without Froome I'd question his morals. Heck, more often than not, Wiggins was outclimbing Nibali.

It's crazy that Froome has to be holding Wiggins hand all the time just so he won't quit the race and leave SKY…

 

[Butterhead]

There's a reason why Wiggins is a knight and the other not, and probably never will.
One is a champ. The other is a highly talented rider. And that's that.

Always said Alberto was a champ, and with the biggest talent.
I don´t give 2 cents for Wiggins title, its pathetic in the first place.

 

[Dazed and Confused]

The Dog vs Knight fight script is old and stale.
Maybe Froome can still sell a few books with the headline but we are quickly moving from the circus into the amateur comedy clubs.

Lets get the gents on the road and see some action.

 

[Walkman]

There's a reason why Wiggins is a knight and the other not, and probably never will.
One is a champ. The other is a highly talented rider. And that's that.

Wiggins is a champ?

Of all the Tour winner since Maurice Garin back in 1903, I don't think there ever has been a winner that never did go to the front. The only time Wiggins got any wind on his nose was in the time trials….

Champion? The guy was dragged around France by him team and won only because Froome was forced to babysit him an all the climbs. Put Froome on any other team and Wiggins would be 5 minutes behind.

 

[spalco]

That's brilliant. I mean, he knew he had one shot at Tour victory, a once in a lifetime opportunity in terms of parcours, opposition and all. The only thing that stood between him and winning was Froome and Wiggins eliminated him perfectly to win the race even though Froome should've won. Wiggins would've been able to do nothing if Froome rode away but the latter was too scared to do it and is still whining about it.

I don't particularly like Wiggins but I have to commend him on his ability to make the most of the situation.

I agree. Froome should be blaming himself for not having the balls to say "**** this" and just go for it.

This is not a Rasmussen situation, no way a team's kicking out the yellow jersey for disobeing team orders to gift victory to another rider.

Wiggins beat Froome fair and square in 2012, not on the road but in team politics.

 

[del1962]

Wiggins is a champ?

Of all the Tour winner since Maurice Garin back in 1903, I don't think there ever has been a winner that never did go to the front. The only time Wiggins got any wind on his nose was in the time trials….

Champion? The guy was dragged around France by him team and won only because Froome was forced to babysit him an all the climbs. Put Froome on any other team and Wiggins would be 5 minutes behind.

Not actually true I remember him leading on a couple of stages that where not the time trial

 

[TomasC]

Not actually true I remember him leading on a couple of stages that where not the time trial

Yeah and even leading the Cav train. Champ!

 

[Walkman]

Not actually true I remember him leading on a couple of stages that where not the time trial

Of course I was not meaning literally "only in the time trials" but save stage 21, give me some videos of him being at the front for more than 1 minute, will you?

 

[Walkman]

Yeah and even leading the Cav train. Champ!

You seem to be an expert in argumenting your opinion. You just calling him "Champ" does not make it so. Look how your 'champ' did at the Giro last year. Put in a solid effort worthy champion, don't you think?

 

[del1962]

Of course I was not meaning literally "only in the time trials" but save stage 21, give me some videos of him being at the front for more than 1 minute, will you?

He lead Ed Bos out on one stage, can't remember the number, but LLS was pretty cheesed of by it as he was attempting late break, less than one minute though I guess,

 

[Winterfold]

Happy to take the help he can from BC. Lives in Monaco. Except when avoiding OOC tests in the Winter.

A complete tool. Worse than Pietersen.

 

[CycloAndy]

Why would they have to change?

This idea that a team must always have 1 dictatorlike leader which every other rider on the team is dedicated to serve and no one else on the team is allowed to do anything was invented by Wiggins in the run up to the 2012 Tour in order to stop Froome from being a challenger.

Ironically the very next year when he was in Froome's position, he directly contradicted that by saying he wanted a free role on Froome's team (hillariously changing the goal posts year to year as he pleases)


In reality it is perfectly normal for teams to give other riders room to do things on certin stages or even during the race even as the rest of the team continues to support the leader.

Allowing Froome to ride in no way required them to change support to him.

And if Sky weren't 50x better than every other team that year and weren't carrying out an orchestrated 1-2, forcing Froome to hang back that year, may have cost them, as it did in the 2011 Vuelta.

Though of course the aim was never to win the 2012 Tour. It was to win the 2012 Tour with a 3 time olympic champion who already had a profile in the country and would thus become the face of the upcoming olympics.

Bolded part highlighted for truth. Froome was the better rider, but Wiggins was the preferred rider and it could be argued was in a better position at the time of Froome's 'challenge'.

I know you're not a fan of Wiggins which I agree with wholeheartedly. Wiggins whining like a baby and threatening to leave over the Froome incident was childish and stupid but now Froome goes and makes me hate him even more by whining like a baby over it too. Wiggins was leader and was going to drop like a fly without help. Froome knew fine well that his job was to protect Wiggins but didn't feel like it because he wanted to be leader.

Froome complains of not being communicated with very well but if he was going for personal glory then he should have communicated it before the stage, not just dashed off when Wiggins needed him most.

The changing of the goalposts works both ways, Wiggins changed the goalposts by asking for a free role in 2013 but Froome did the same by not allowing it, despite expecting Wiggins to do the same for him in 2012. Both selfish egotists!

I would even accept a magical GC transformation from Thomas, Eisel or Stannard without question, if it meant I didn't have to put up with Froome and Wiggins' whining.