Teams & Riders Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

[pastronef]

since 2010 with a stated goal of winning the Tour at the beginning of the year
CF 2 wins
AC 1
Nibs 1
Andy1
Cadel 1

Don't talk about form accidents or other goals. the Tour is THE Goal for any GC contender. Anyone of them would lose every other race in the year in exchange for a Tour win. This is what they train for from now until July

agree 100%
the narrative "the Giro is a nicer race, the Giro is more exciting, has better climbs, is less boring" is fine for the fans.
the Tour is THE race for any GT racer who has the strenght to try and win it. full stop.

Not all riders are obsessed with the Bore de France and I thank the lord for that.

Flo, no riders will call it the bore de france. the FANS call it bore de france.
I was talking about riders.

 

[LaFlorecita]

since 2010 with a stated goal of winning the Tour at the beginning of the year
CF 2 wins
AC 1
Nibs 1
Andy1
Cadel 1

Don't talk about form accidents or other goals. the Tour is THE Goal for any GC contender. Anyone of them would lose every other race in the year in exchange for a Tour win. This is what they train for from now until July

agree 100%
the narrative "the Giro is a nicer race, the Giro is more exciting, has better climbs, is less boring" is fine for the fans.
the Tour is THE race for any GT racer who has the strenght to try and win it. full stop.

Not all riders are obsessed with the Bore de France and I thank the lord for that.

Flo, no riders will call it the bore de france. the FANS call it bore de france.
I was talking about riders.

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

 

[pastronef]

since 2010 with a stated goal of winning the Tour at the beginning of the year
CF 2 wins
AC 1
Nibs 1
Andy1
Cadel 1

Don't talk about form accidents or other goals. the Tour is THE Goal for any GC contender. Anyone of them would lose every other race in the year in exchange for a Tour win. This is what they train for from now until July

agree 100%
the narrative "the Giro is a nicer race, the Giro is more exciting, has better climbs, is less boring" is fine for the fans.
the Tour is THE race for any GT racer who has the strenght to try and win it. full stop.

Not all riders are obsessed with the Bore de France and I thank the lord for that.

Flo, no riders will call it the bore de france. the FANS call it bore de france.
I was talking about riders.

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

call it as you want.
you call it obsession, I call it prestige, career goal.

 

[Red Rick]

What if I told you, that when you try the double, its not your first priority to reach the Tour in top shape.

 

[rick james]

Re:

What if I told you, that when you try the double, its not your first priority to reach the Tour in top shape.

well, if you don't his the tour in top shape then you are going to struggle to get top 5, the double was never on

 

[LaFlorecita]

Yes I agree, his top 5 just shows what a legend he is, and he did not manage it just once, he managed a top 5 3 times when not in top shape

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

What if I told you, that when you try the double, its not your first priority to reach the Tour in top shape.

well, if you don't his the tour in top shape then you are going to struggle to get top 5, the double was never on

You basically do a very light spring schedule, go into the Giro a little undercooked, hope to get better during the Giro and win it, then pray to Ctulhu that you recover well and get some supercompensation and reach top shape in the tour without breaking down completely. It doesn't matter that he intended to be great in the Tour. Fact is that he wasn't

 

[cantpedal]

since 2010 with a stated goal of winning the Tour at the beginning of the year
CF 2 wins
AC 1
Nibs 1
Andy1
Cadel 1

Don't talk about form accidents or other goals. the Tour is THE Goal for any GC contender. Anyone of them would lose every other race in the year in exchange for a Tour win. This is what they train for from now until July

Why can't we compare them starting at 2007?

Edit: Also your numbers don't make sense. Have Andy and AC both won a Tour since 2010?

Clearly this guy is clueless. Maybe he already counted the 2016 edition as a win for Alberto
Also this "since 2010 with a stated goal of winning the Tour at the beginning of the year" doesn't make any sense either, I don't see that stated anywhere, I only see how many times each of them won since 2010.

forgot about Wiggo and was hoping to avoid Clinic arguments from being dragged in to the discussion. That would have led to Froome should have won instead of Wiggo - then chaingate. Precisely what I was trying to leave out of the disccussion

 

[cantpedal]

Re:

Yes I agree, his top 5 just shows what a legend he is, and he did not manage it just once, he managed a top 5 3 times when not in top shape

Well we all know how He and his fans feel about second place so why are we talking about top 5?

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Yes I agree, his top 5 just shows what a legend he is, and he did not manage it just once, he managed a top 5 3 times when not in top shape

Well we all know how He and his fans feel about second place so why are we talking about top 5?

Cause rick james mentioned top 5

 

[djpbaltimore]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

 

[Singer01]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

or even the podium.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

My opinion on the Tour has been obvious for years, not my fault you only joined the forum in 2014.

 

[dacooley]

the tour can be artificially downplayed in millions ways by fans, but it still remains indisputably the hardest grand tour to win

 

[rick james]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

My opinion on the Tour has been obvious for years, not my fault you only joined the forum in 2014.

 

[rick james]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

My opinion on the Tour has been obvious for years, not my fault you only joined the forum in 2014.

.................

 

[djpbaltimore]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

My opinion on the Tour has been obvious for years, not my fault you only joined the forum in 2014.

FYI, I lurked on this forum long before you joined it.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

My opinion on the Tour has been obvious for years, not my fault you only joined the forum in 2014.

.................

Many fans like the Giro way better than the Tour, it's hardly a strange opinion. And I've always preferred the Giro. So don't even think about trying to put it down to my favorite rider, I know it's what you obsessive Sky fans love to do (boo hoo everyone hates Sky because they beat their favorite riders - no) but don't even try. Don't turn this into BikeRetard forums 2.0.

 

[Jspear]

Re:

the bottom line is if you are a big fan of bertie the temptation to consider froome's tour wins flukes caused by nonoptimal shape of contador himself is very very big on emotional level, as nibali and quintana are still admittedly regarded as weaker riders, but froome tends to be assessed like an equal opponent at least over the last years period. any discussions about different riders in top form are absolutely senseless. when talking about bertie's shape, most people just imply the 2014 season when he was destroying the entire field, of course bertie at the peak of the 2014 season form is unbeatable if other riders hit the scene in their 2014 shape under the 2014 circumstances. however it's life, not a cycling simulator game and you will never be able to replay the scripts from the past. they were and they ended. a thing i'm all for in suchlike situations is debate without excuses. :d froome was nobody prior the 2011 vuelta and that's his problem. bertie messed up his 2013 prep - it was entirely up to him, no excuses. froome was remorselessly beaten by contador over the whole 2014 season - fair and square. contador got defeated in the 2015 tour and the giro cannot be ascribed as an excuse as i think the probability to be shelled like on psm after the giro was quite big and bertie realized it like no one else, and so on. if nairiro smashes them both in this year's tour, it will be fair too.

I agree with much of this. AC lost fair and square in 2013 and 2015. He made some obvious training errors in 2013 and decided to ride the Giro in 2015. None of that takes away from the fact that he lost.

Cycling isn't like a game simulator but I think it's okay to hope that a certain rider gets back to good form from a previous year. They've proven that they can do it....it's not like trying to prove Cobo can win a gt again. Even though wins still count regardless, it's always nice when both stay healthy, come in with it as the number one goal, etc. I'm really hoping everything aligns this year for both of them.

 

[cantpedal]

Re: Re:

the bottom line is if you are a big fan of bertie the temptation to consider froome's tour wins flukes caused by nonoptimal shape of contador himself is very very big on emotional level, as nibali and quintana are still admittedly regarded as weaker riders, but froome tends to be assessed like an equal opponent at least over the last years period. any discussions about different riders in top form are absolutely senseless. when talking about bertie's shape, most people just imply the 2014 season when he was destroying the entire field, of course bertie at the peak of the 2014 season form is unbeatable if other riders hit the scene in their 2014 shape under the 2014 circumstances. however it's life, not a cycling simulator game and you will never be able to replay the scripts from the past. they were and they ended. a thing i'm all for in suchlike situations is debate without excuses. :d froome was nobody prior the 2011 vuelta and that's his problem. bertie messed up his 2013 prep - it was entirely up to him, no excuses. froome was remorselessly beaten by contador over the whole 2014 season - fair and square. contador got defeated in the 2015 tour and the giro cannot be ascribed as an excuse as i think the probability to be shelled like on psm after the giro was quite big and bertie realized it like no one else, and so on. if nairiro smashes them both in this year's tour, it will be fair too.

I agree with much of this. AC lost fair and square in 2013 and 2015. He made some obvious training errors in 2013 and decided to ride the Giro in 2015. None of that takes away from the fact that he lost.

Cycling isn't like a game simulator but I think it's okay to hope that a certain rider gets back to good form from a previous year. They've proven that they can do it....it's not like trying to prove Cobo can win a gt again. Even though wins still count regardless, it's always nice when both stay healthy, come in with it as the number one goal, etc. I'm really hoping everything aligns this year for both of them.

My thoughts exactly.

 

[dacooley]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

My opinion on the Tour has been obvious for years, not my fault you only joined the forum in 2014.

.................

Many fans like the Giro way better than the Tour, it's hardly a strange opinion. And I've always preferred the Giro. So don't even think about trying to put it down to my favorite rider, I know it's what you obsessive Sky fans love to do (boo hoo everyone hates Sky because they beat their favorite riders - no) but don't even try. Don't turn this into BikeRetard forums 2.0.

probably, yes but you numerous times said 'froome ruined another gt for me' or 'sky ruins racing at the tour' so it surely have an impact on general impression for the tour you get.

 

[cantpedal]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

My opinion on the Tour has been obvious for years, not my fault you only joined the forum in 2014.

.................

The Team Sponsors are obsessed with it and so by default so are the Teams.

 

[staubsauger]

Yes, and I said thankfully not all riders are obsessed with it. Why don't you address that instead of arguing about how I decided to call the most overrated race on the planet.

I think you would be singing a different tune if your favorite rider had won the bore de france in this decade.

My opinion on the Tour has been obvious for years, not my fault you only joined the forum in 2014.

.................

The Team Sponsors are obsessed with it and so by default so are the Teams.

The Giro nearly always has been the favorite race of most true cycling passionists. On and off the bike.

There ain't nothing wrong with Flo's statement.

There are exceptions of course. Armstrong definitely was a obsessed passionist.

 

[Taxus4a]

Tour is much more important than Giro nowadays... but of coursse Il Giro is a race that most of cycling fans love.

 

[pastronef]

Re:

Tour is much more important than Giro nowadays... but of coursse Il Giro is a race that most of cycling fans love.

much depends of every rider´s goal. Cadel wore the pink jersey once in 2002, and came back in 2010 to perform and get his team a Tour wild card. after that he always rode the Tour. I can´t blame him. The Tour is more.

I am Italian, but I know the crossroads and road panels and names of villages and their location in the Alps and Pyrenees without having been there. not the same for Dolomites and the other Giro mountains. same as Paris-Nice instead of Tirreno.

but maybe this should be moved to the Giro vs Tour thread, if there´s one.