Teams & Riders Chris Froome Discussion Thread.

[VayaVayaVaya]

Froome traditionally has always relied on brute strength except for a single downhill finish and a single echelon stage where his team got in him on exactly the right wheel. Even on the back foot, his attacks were formulaic.

Hard to see Ineos ditch him if they'd believe he was still a contender.

I somewhat disagree with both points.

In regard to the first, Froome has consistently displayed a willingness to do whatever it takes to win and the intelligence to understand what that is. From crushing competitors' spirits with a single dominant performance, to yoyoing off the back to avoid blowing up, to following Sagan, to attacking out of the peloton on a downhill, IMO, he has very intelligently managed situations. "Formulaic" implies predictability and "brute strength" implies inevitability, but I would not say that is fair to him as a rider. I admittedly was a fan of his when he upstaged Wiggins became very much not a fan when he upstaged my favorite, Contador, and began winning me over as a fan again in 2016 when he began showing the savviness of an elder champion and the grit of a hungry one (running up Ventoux was really amazing; as much as I like Pinot, he would have sat on the side of the road and cried; not sure anyone other than Froome would have literally run for the victory).

In regard to the second, they might still believe he's a contender, just a lesser contender than Bernal and with fewer years of productivity in his future, and thus not worth $5m per annum. This doesn't necessarily serve as a signal that there are behind the scenes indicators he cannot contend.

Having said all that, I do not think he will be a contender this year.

 

[Poursuivant]

Why Ineos would take him to the Tour??
There are plenty os very good gregarios to work for the last 2 winners let alone the chance that he can be, lets say, the 2o best place cyclist and generate a LOT os controversy during the Tour..

I still don’t think they’ll take him the TDF.

 

[Koronin]

You can re-sign with the team you current are with at any point without penalty. I think you aren't supposed to sign an actual contract before that Aug 1 date, but I'd be surprised if you can't sign a letter of intent before that.
5 years for a guy who hasn't proven he's recovered from those injuries yet? That's what I don't understand.

 

[yaco]

I expect his main target in 2020 will be the Vuelta - He needs more race days after his long absence.

 

[Escarabajo]

The story of Froome leaving because Ineos would not pick him to be the sole leader was the perfect excuse for him to leave. Because he knew that Ineos would never do that. So he wanted to leave no matter what. And I don't blame him with that money and being the sole leader of the team.

The question would be what the mechanics of the Tour team would be if they take him.

 

[DNP-Old]

The story of Froome leaving because Ineos would not pick him to be the sole leader was the perfect excuse for him to leave. Because he knew that Ineos would never do that. So he wanted to leave no matter what. And I don't blame him with that money and being the sole leader of the team.

The question would be what the mechanics of the Tour team would be if they take him.

I'm guessing there'll be a lot of defect radio's when he punctures.

 

[TourOfSardinia]

The whole world is turning upside down
I'm readying to cheer for an Ineos/Sky rider!
(Bernal)
against an non-Ineos Team competitor!
(Dawg)
woooaaah I'm feeling giddy.

 

[Ranagazoo]

Makes absolutely no sense now for Ineos to bring him to the Tour, apart from for sentimental reasons. As yaco says it makes far more sense to let him ride the Vuelta as full team leader, one last hurrah.

A shame because I'd love to see Froome go rogue and attack his team leaders, Brailsford screaming at him to stop

 

[Breezy1985]

The whole world is turning upside down
I'm readying to cheer for an Ineos/Sky rider!
(Bernal)
against an non-Ineos Team competitor!
(Dawg)
woooaaah I'm feeling giddy.

I hate Ineos but I find it very hard to not like Bernal he seems like a good kid. I never liked ISN even after signing D.Martin so it won't be hard for me to still not like Froome but if it's Thomas he's up against I'll have no problem shouting for the Dawg

 

[Eyeballs Out]

If they weren't going to take him to the Tour then surely it would make sense for everyone concerned (both teams and the rider) for the transfer to take place on 1st August rather than waiting till next season

 

[jaylew]

Good news. A shame he's not going this year as I would have liked to see him racing against Ineos rather than the drama of the 3 of them racing together. That said, I can't imagine they would take him to the Tour under these circumstances, would they?

Only way I can see him going to the Tour now is if its made clear he's there to support Bernal but even then I don't know how it would work. There would be too much potential for drama and how awkward would it be if he wound up being the strongest?

 

[Bonimenier]

If they weren't going to take him to the Tour then surely it would make sense for everyone concerned (both teams and the rider) for the transfer to take place on 1st August rather than waiting till next season

How does that make sense for Ineos? That would just add 1 more opponent for them in an already stacked peloton.

 

[Red Rick]

I somewhat disagree with both points.

In regard to the first, Froome has consistently displayed a willingness to do whatever it takes to win and the intelligence to understand what that is. From crushing competitors' spirits with a single dominant performance, to yoyoing off the back to avoid blowing up, to following Sagan, to attacking out of the peloton on a downhill, IMO, he has very intelligently managed situations. "Formulaic" implies predictability and "brute strength" implies inevitability, but I would not say that is fair to him as a rider. I admittedly was a fan of his when he upstaged Wiggins became very much not a fan when he upstaged my favorite, Contador, and began winning me over as a fan again in 2016 when he began showing the savviness of an elder champion and the grit of a hungry one (running up Ventoux was really amazing; as much as I like Pinot, he would have sat on the side of the road and cried; not sure anyone other than Froome would have literally run for the victory).

In regard to the second, they might still believe he's a contender, just a lesser contender than Bernal and with fewer years of productivity in his future, and thus not worth $5m per annum. This doesn't necessarily serve as a signal that there are behind the scenes indicators he cannot contend.

Having said all that, I do not think he will be a contender this year.

I don't remember any high risk move when the legs were questionable and there was a lot at stake. I will say the Peyresourde downhill was a nice gimmick.

I think Froome's ability to win will drastically drop with a weaker team especailly if he's even a few % off. The GT landscape is much different than a few years ago.

 

[jaylew]

Hmm...

“It has been a phenomenal decade with the Team, we have achieved so much together and I will always treasure the memories. I look forward to exciting new challenges as I move into the next phase of my career but in the meantime my focus is on winning a fifth Tour de France with Team Ineos.”

 

[Rui Machado]

I still don’t think they’ll take him the TDF.

Froome is going to the tour. If he weren t for the tour, dave brailsford would let him go to israel national team in august.

 

[Parker]

Hmm...

“It has been a phenomenal decade with the Team, we have achieved so much together and I will always treasure the memories. I look forward to exciting new challenges as I move into the next phase of my career but in the meantime my focus is on winning a fifth Tour de France with Team Ineos.”

And that's in the statement released by Ineos, not his personal Instagram. They would have taken that bit out if they weren't looking to pick him for the Tour. Only lousy form will stop it.

 

[Oldermanish]

Froome does sometimes get undeserved criticism for the way he races because of the negative race-strangling template employed by his team, but let's not completely flip this around. Froome is a guy who typically is a lot more interesting when he's racing from behind (week 3 of 2011 Vuelta, week 3 of 2016 Vuelta, 2014 Ruta del Sol, 2018 Giro), much like many GC guys, but unfortunately he's largely been racing from in front after a big show of strength at the end of week 1, with a super-strong backup squad, so people have seen much more of that Froome than the interesting one. Just look at how much more people enjoyed Contador after he stopped being the guy that could win things at will. Hopefully as he grows older and he has to win on his smarts and his race tactics rather than brute strength, we see more of the interesting Froome going forward. But "only GC contender of the last 20 years" to go on that kind of move? That's eulogising him well beyond the point of reality.

What about the Pozzato-initiated move in the 2010 Giro that led to Cuddles punching Daniele Righi because he missed the move and people like Basso and Scarponi made it across, on a flat stage? What about Contador attacking into Tropea on a repecho on a stage designated flat? I mean, just this last August we saw Nairo Quintana attacking on the flat in week 3 the day before the final climactic mountains, and winning stages by attacking on the flat run-in. Vincenzo Nibali has won Milano-Sanremo and won the Sheffield stage of the 2014 Tour on the flat section using self-same Sagan as a tactical option rather than on the ramps. "The last 20 years" also includes Robobasso and his exploits in the Danmark Rundt. Was Froome's move a smart and unexpected move that brought a bit of GC excitement to a stage not expected to provide it? Sure. But "only GC rider in the last 20 years" to try it, that's going a bit far.

The ability to ride like a California Crit hunter is one of the things I think is consistent with the Columbian GC hopefuls. Quintana, Bernal, Higuita...they know how to ride a bike in all conditions and physically can make it happen. Pogacar is similar. I don't know how they got that tactically sharp at an early age but they've got skills usually touted as Belgian. Fun to watch.
Froome is a great rider although awkward in style. I agree 100% with your assessment that most of criticism is based on Sky/Ineos "game management" style of racing. Hell, it was the template set by Bruyneel and worked.

 

[RedheadDane]

Froome is going to the tour. If he weren t for the tour, dave brailsford would let him go to israel national team in august.

Unless he respects that he signed a contract to the end of 2020, and is going to honour that, whether they take him to the Tour or not.

BTW, it's not the Israel National Team. Froome, being British, can't ride for the Israel National Team.

 

[Rui Machado]

Unless he respects that he signed a contract to the end of 2020, and is going to honour that, whether they take him to the Tour or not.

BTW, it's not the Israel National Team. Froome, being British, can't ride for the Israel National Team.

Ahah israel start up nation*,sorry.

 

[jaylew]

Froome is going to the tour. If he weren t for the tour, dave brailsford would let him go to israel national team in august.

I don't think it's quite that simple.

 

[Koronin]

Froome is going to the tour. If he weren t for the tour, dave brailsford would let him go to israel national team in august.

He has a contract through the end of 2020. I'm fairly sure I remember reading a few weeks ago that Brailsford said he wouldn't let Froome out of his contract.

 

[Rui Machado]

He has a contract through the end of 2020. I'm fairly sure I remember reading a few weeks ago that Brailsford said he wouldn't let Froome out of his contract.

Froome said today in a statement released by ineos, that he wants is fifth tour de france.

 

[Rui Machado]

Brailsford needs to go with the 8 best men possible to the tour, and froome is in their best 8 men possible. Jumbo visma will go with a strong team, brailsford is not stupid and he knows that he needs their 3 leaders in the tour.

 

[Parker]

Unless he respects that he signed a contract to the end of 2020, and is going to honour that, whether they take him to the Tour or not.

But what is in the contract. It most likely contains clauses about guaranteed Tour selection and protected status. In 2012 when the stuff was going on with him and Wiggins he had a copy of his contract sent to him at the race as it had similar agreements in it. I expect it still does.

If Brailsford wasn't prepared to meet the terms of the contract Froome could have got himself released and moved in August. I expect they will have come to an arrangement.

 

[masking_agent]

Good for Froome but I and most people can't get a gauge on his form as he's had to come back from injury. However, I think it will be the "Tour de Froome" until he gets dropped and goes out of contention. Until then, he'll be surrounded by microphones answering the same questions over and over again. Can't wait for the end of August.