Benotti69 said:Geox might not sponsor Gianetti for 2012, probably waiting to see if Cobo gets done or not!
I would guess dealing with Gianetti they should have a clause for events like that.
The Cycling News forum is looking to add some volunteer moderators with Red Rick's recent retirement. If you're interested in helping keep our discussions on track, send a direct message to
In the meanwhile, please use the Report option if you see a post that doesn't fit within the forum rules.
Thanks!
Benotti69 said:Geox might not sponsor Gianetti for 2012, probably waiting to see if Cobo gets done or not!
hrotha said:That doesn't mean anything. Clean riders still prepare for races and can improve their condition over two weeks, and doped riders don't go around dropping hints for the astute cycling fans out there to pick up. You're only seeing what you want to see in that quote.
Quite often people who don't perform too well at the start of the race perform well at the end of it. It's to do with timing your form. Some riders recover naturally better than others (though of course some get assistance with this). Just saying "they weren't very good at the start of the race but were good at the end" isn't really a big deal - most everybody knew that in reality, the penultimate weekend was likely to be decisive, so if Geox took a high-risk strategy of trying to peak for the middle and end of the race and risk not being in ideal form at the start, then that could well have paid off. Also, as a ProContinental team, they didn't have as many options in the form of preparation races, so may have found it harder to arrive in Benidorm in race-sharp state.djerkson said:Geox is not a World Tour team, yet they are the leading team in overall standings. This reminds me of the stunt Di Luca, Pozzovivo and co pulled off in the Giro some years ago with LPR. You have Menchov, Sastré and even Duarte, who are performing quite well during the last hard stages, where they were nowhere in the first week.
Or alternatively, he could just have grown older and completed the growth process?maltiv said:Changes in the facial structures due to doping happens over an extended period of time and not instantaneously. I believe this picture is from when he first joined Saunier Duval, and since then it looks like his jaw has grown massively. Obviously the pictures might be a little deceiving, but there's a change there, I think.
It's a bit too easy to just throw out the Spain=doping thing. We've had a few busts in Spain this year; few big names involved of course, but there have been busts. It seems that those lower down the hierarchy take their doping-fighting quite seriously, but some of those at the top have too many conflicting interests to join them.B_Ugli said:Agreed
You also need to throw into this equation that despite the efforts in France & Italy to crack down, Spain is still "business as usual". You only have to look at the whole way Contador has been handled to see that. The whole Spanish stance simply undermines every effort elsewhere in Europe to promote clean cycling. What powers to the UCI, IOC and WADA have though to get Spain towing the line?
Many a time. Roche on La Plagne, anyone?Fergoose said:As I've said, looking at a man being tired is irrelevant (because of the possibility of acting etc). What is relevant is if they give an exceptional performance and showing no fatigue (like Cobo on the Angliru and the stage preceding it).
On todays stage Cobo cracked after being challenged for the first time by a rider with the same "ability", it wasn't Cobo slowing down to pace himself and limit his losses. Then a minute or two later he is out of the saddle and sprinting back across to Chris "Broom Broom" Froome!*
Has anyone ever witnessed such a recovery?
I'm sure Cobo will have ridden that climb before. Maybe never raced it before at the pro level, but he's from near there. And yes, it is hard to judge on a finish like that that is so inconsistent a climb, and long enough to not be a hill finish, but not long enough to be the big sized MTF.roundabout said:A finish like that is a bit difficult to judge especially for 2 riders who I doubt have ridden it before.
How about the 2009 Vuelta, when he was 10th overall and won the final mountain stage? And how he was one of the top guys to La Pandera and all that, riding on a Fuji-Servetto team that gave him next to no support? That year, the top 6 was Valverde, Sánchez, Evans, Basso, Mosquera and Gesink. None of whom are here. The big names that are here have underperformed. Is it really surprising to see Cobo leapfrog the likes of Tiralongo?roundabout said:My problem with Cobo's so called good performances is that they sometimes come at the same time as good performances from his team mates.
Castilla y Leon 2007 - Cobo 3rd, Koldo Gil 2nd and climbing as well as Contador on the MTF
Pais Vasco same year - Koldo Gil, Marchante and Cobo were among the strongest.
Urkiola - same story
2008 better in that regard but when he was really flying 2 team mates tested positive who had won 3 stages up to that point
And this year there's a general Geox revival with Menchov and de la Fuente around stages 13-15.
I am not saying that it means he is dirty but it's a bit curious that he usually comes out of depression when the team is doing well.
Originally Posted by djerkson View Post
Geox is not a World Tour team, yet they are the leading team in overall standings. This reminds me of the stunt Di Luca, Pozzovivo and co pulled off in the Giro some years ago with LPR. You have Menchov, Sastré and even Duarte, who are performing quite well during the last hard stages, where they were nowhere in the first week.
I'm sure Cobo will have ridden that climb before. Maybe never raced it before at the pro level, but he's from near there.
“He won’t make a comeback this year but he doesn’t feel he’s an ex-rider,” Alessi said, adding maliciously. “Considering who else is out there, why should he consider himself an ex-rider?”
Indeed. There are no other riders he could be talking about. None at all.webvan said:From http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/ricco-denies-blood-doping-during-questioning
Looks like Ricco knows a thing or two about his little friend from the 2008 TDF...
Fergoose said:I hate to villify the guy, but I reckon one post after 9 months doesn't hurt. Reigning Vuelta champion Juan Jose Cobo currently lies in 148th place in the TdF @11’43” despite suffering no injury through crashing. He lies behind sprinters Mark Renshaw and Haedo in the GC. Posted for information purposes. Explanations welcomed both in terms of Cobo's condition and in terms of Movistar's team tactics.
Libertine Seguros said:Basically, there's more difference between Cobo: 2011 Vuelta and Cobo: 2012 Tour than just "clean Cobo" and "dirty Cobo" just as 2008 Cobo was almost certainly doping and 2010 Cobo was probably clean, but the difference was even greater because of his psychological issues in 2010.
zlev11 said:http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cobo-wiggins-and-froome-stronger-than-in-last-years-vuelta-a-espana
read towards the 2nd half of the article
says he's using the Tour to help Valverde and get on form to defend his Vuelta title. i think we'll see him in a few breaks once they get to the real mountains. i think he'll still be a GC threat at the Vuelta.
Zam_Olyas said:Fergoose what is it you want to say? that cobo is a doper? ...i think we will all agree with you on that.
Fergoose said:Yes. I think such things bear repeating from time to time in the face of new evidence (such as this TdF performance) incase anyone get the impression that doping in 2012 is a purely anglophone thing. There was tumble weed rolling through this thread on a reigning GT champion.
Libertine Seguros said:Where were you when Juan José Cobo needed you?
the sceptic said:http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/cobo-signs-with-torku-konya-sekerspor
I cant wait for the 2014 tour of turkey
hrotha said:Better top this I guess.
This is pretty weird. If they had retested his samples and found something, then OK, but it's a biological passport infraction. What new data could they possibly have? Didn't they look into it back in the day? I know it can take a few years but come on.
They should have waited till the week the Tour startsForever The Best said:Am I the only one who thinks that timing is so weird?
Only thing I can think of is that maybe they weren't sure they had a slum dunk case so they put it off as much as possible (as per the SOL), either hoping for a breakthrough/new test or for a confession. But that'd be bizarre, there's literally nothing to support this theory, and there was any merit to it then it'd be the standard procedure, which it clearly isn't. So wut.spalco said:hrotha said:Better top this I guess.
This is pretty weird. If they had retested his samples and found something, then OK, but it's a biological passport infraction. What new data could they possibly have? Didn't they look into it back in the day? I know it can take a few years but come on.
That's hilarious. 8 **** years for a passport infraction? Has somebody in Aigle literally been inspecting his numbers for that long to come with this conclusion? Does Cobo even care about this win anymore?
What the ****?
hrotha said:Only thing I can think of is that maybe they weren't sure they had a slum dunk case so they put it off as much as possible (as per the SOL), either hoping for a breakthrough/new test or for a confession. But that'd be bizarre, there's literally nothing to support this theory, and there was any merit to it then it'd be the standard procedure, which it clearly isn't. So wut.spalco said:hrotha said:Better top this I guess.
This is pretty weird. If they had retested his samples and found something, then OK, but it's a biological passport infraction. What new data could they possibly have? Didn't they look into it back in the day? I know it can take a few years but come on.
That's hilarious. 8 **** years for a passport infraction? Has somebody in Aigle literally been inspecting his numbers for that long to come with this conclusion? Does Cobo even care about this win anymore?
What the ****?