Critérium du Dauphiné 2024, June 2 - 9

[Logic-is-your-friend]

It’s been a little bit since I’ve enjoyed Roglic this much.

Since yesterday?

 

[CyclistAbi]

Congratulations to Primož Roglič for winning the queen stage.

Fantastic work by his team today, maybe Vlasov was pushed into fire a bit too soon, still he pulled through. Jorgenson now second and Gee third overall. With good work tomorrow maybe Vlasov can end up on the podium too, as i do imagine Bora to drill it hard. We'll see.

 

[bajbar]

I don't get what people expect Roglič to do. He has never been a rider who attacks 10km out, gets separation and rides to the line alone. This is what Vinge and Pogi do. Roglič plays to his strenghts. Of course, yesterday he could have attacked (and got a decent gap), because he was clearly the best. But yesterday was also the perfect Roglič stage - easy first part, nice and warm with basically a steep unipuerto climb. Today was completely different. Rain and cold all day (which Roglič really dislikes) and a stage where a lot of energy was spent before the final climb. Therefore he looked far more labored in the final sprint. Yes, he is on a good track, he might gain some Watts between here and the Tour, but don't expect him to attack 8km to go from the top of Galibier and solo to Valoire.

And about the dicussion about Roglič contending to win the Tour. He will never become a Pog or Vinge style rider. Him winning relies on Pog being tired from the Giro/Tour double and Jonas not being very good because of the Itzulia crash. I am very aware that with Jonas in last years Tour form and Pogačar in Giro form, Roglič has zero chance unless they crash out. He will never match or beat those alien watts and performances. But he can win a Tour where these two are not at their best. And if he does it will be in his usual style - gaining bonus seconds, gaining time in the TTs, being super consistent over the full three weeks.

 

[CyclistAbi]

And about the dicussion about Roglič contending to win the Tour. He will never become a Pog or Vinge style rider. Him winning relies on Pog being tired from the Giro/Tour double and Jonas not being very good because of the Itzulia crash. I am very aware that with Jonas in last years Tour form and Pogačar in Giro form, Roglič has zero chance unless they crash out. He will never match or beat those alien watts and performances. But he can win a Tour where these two are not at their best. And if he does it will be in his usual style - gaining bonus seconds, gaining time in the TTs, being super consistent over the full three weeks.

It's not like Tour 2024 is the last edition, on where they will face each other. Next year hence Pogi doesn't have to do Giro beforehand and Jonas can do less races, to be healthy at the Tour. I am sure that Rogla will do his best too, hopefully Giro-Tour attempt by Rogla is still in the stars. We'll see.

 

[shadowrider]

Landa crashed a day later than remco in April and had worse injuries, he broke some ribs and a lot of time off the bike. And yet now he is much stronger than remco

I don't actually think Landa should be considered leader for Le tour, as he seems more motivated by his current role where the pressure is of, and will probably hit a better level because of it.

But please consider some context around the performances riders who you jump at the opportunity to criticise, when taking every possible opportunity to jump to the defense of young Belges.

In most teams Landa would be the leader on merit

Landa's injurys weren't as bad as Evenepoel's. Landa could start his training days before Evenepoel could. That's why Landa is actually better uphill than Evenepoel. But there is no doubt Landa has not the shape Roglic, Gee, Rodriguez etc have. I think those rider are at 99 %. Landa is at 98 % and Evenepoel at 97,5 % (and with 1,5 kg overweight). Landa will be ready at the start of the Tour. Evenpoel almost, and that could be an advantage for the third week of the Tour and for the olympic TT.

 

[Jumbo Visma Fan :)]

Since yesterday?

Well, yes, but in general the past couple days.

 

[cen]

Ciccone trying the hair out of helmet tactic, seems to be working for him

 

[shadowrider]

I defend young Belges (and other riders) when they get criticised unfairly for things beyond their control. Not when they act like idiots or lack professionalism.
As for Landa, i see i missed a medical update, initially there was only mention of a broken collarbone. Only in the update, which i missed, they mentioned his ribs. So i'm sorry for laughing at Landa. It's quite possible he would outclimb Gee, Lazkano, Romo and my grandma at the TDF.

Nobody should be laughed at. Not Landa who's a bit lower in shape than Roglic, Rodriguez, Gee etc. Nor Evenepoel who's another % behind Landa. Even without the "logic" explanation of their period of healing and revalidation. I'm sure some people will also laugh at Pogacar, Vingegaard and a few others when they fade during the last week of the Tour. As a result of riding the Giro (Poga), as a result of forcing to improve fitness and shape (Vingegaard), as a result of being in topshape around june the tenth (several riders in the Dauphiné).

 

[Cookster15]

Another good win by Roglic with too much speed in the finish. On a very hard stage like today with multiple difficult climbs it shows Rogla is riding into form. But unless Giro fatigue shows its hand in the 3rd week, I am not seeing anything that is going to worry Pogacar.

I am more perplexed about Jai Hindley? He should be going stronger than Vlasov?

 

[Taxus4a]

It's not like Tour 2024 is the last edition, on where they will face each other. Next year hence Pogi doesn't have to do Giro beforehand and Jonas can do less races, to be healthy at the Tour. I am sure that Rogla will do his best too, hopefully Giro-Tour attempt by Rogla is still in the stars. We'll see.

Giro is an advantage for Pogacar, a good training.

 

[Lequack]

Great win again, it seems his team also became stronger as well, which is good to see. Go Rogla!

 

[Lequack]

Derek G interview

https://twitter.com/x/status/1799471698976141472

View: https://twitter.com/NBCSCycling/status/1799471698976141472

 

[noob]

No worries, it's barely 8am in my area... and not only did I miss out on today's French Open Ladies' final, but I also missed out on the Dauphine stage.

For those who had watched Dauphine - was the scenery at least halfway respectable?

I watched the last 7 km just now. It was good looking! Not spectacular like yesterday though But of course Roglic is pretty so obviously it was overall pretty

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

Derek G interview

https://twitter.com/x/status/1799471698976141472

View: https://twitter.com/NBCSCycling/status/1799471698976141472

Funny that Gee is as surprised as everybody else by his performance. If he doesn't have a bad day tomorrow I think the podium is realistic. Who would have thought? Also Joergensen on the Podium as well, after all the talk about how he wasn't made for actual mountains.

 

[noob]

Uh, what is there to be confused about? It clearly is....

I'm used to stages ending 2 hours later so I was ultra confused. Tomorrow I'll tune in earlier

 

[Tricycle Rider]

Derek G interview

https://twitter.com/x/status/1799471698976141472

View: https://twitter.com/NBCSCycling/status/1799471698976141472

GEE!

 

[KZD]

The most interesting trend of this Dauphiné is that despite the high gradients in the MTFs, bigger guys like Jorgenson, Lazkano or Gee are climbing surprising well. The rainy weather might be helping them a bit but especially for Lazkano and Gee these are clearly career best performances and it will be interesting to see if they can somewhat replicate them in the Tour.

Roglič looking good but he will likely have to improve a bit for the Tour if Pogačar is in Giro shape or Vingegaard is close to his best.

 

[Unchained]

I just watched the replay, despite the wet roads here and there the scenery was more than magnificent!

Also, chapeau Rogla.

This is one of the most slippery slopes in all of pro sports. In the US it almost is a kill factor in big races. I have commented over and over about seeing jaw dropping beauty as a byproduct from watching bike races, seeing Australian coastline, Italy, France, Norway, just to start!! Always awesome and almost always done with some level of government coordination, cooperation and sometimes outright sponsorship. Bike racing has taken for granted free use of public roadways with a manageable amount of hate from whoever. It's all worked out until now. And if done right there is a bunch of positive trade off, people see a place and gain interest, possibly travel there later, or travel there specifically for the event and the overall effect is positive. I can't get over seeing beautiful scenery and roads I will not experience in person.
I am not encouraged by road events in US, but mixed and off road events look to be bringing a small financial windfall to places who host..I hope that races like these can find a place for years to come and the public doesn't say that bicycle racing is a big pain in the butt w nominal reward..
And if YouTube teaches you anything bike racing without a drone or helicopter view is overall terrible and boring. These helicopter shots of race and landscape are absolutely incredible

 

[ppanther92]

The most interesting trend of this Dauphiné is that despite the high gradients in the MTFs, bigger guys like Jorgenson, Lazkano or Gee are climbing surprising well. The rainy weather might be helping them a bit but especially for Lazkano and Gee these are clearly career best performances and it will be interesting to see if they can somewhat replicate them in the Tour.

Thats actually the biggest part I am wondering about in this race. Is this a trend or an anomaly? And why (for both answers)? Cause even if the argument is that we have no Pogacar, no Vingegaard, no Mas, no Yates, no Carapaz, no Bernal, no Gall - we have Rodriguez, Vlasov, Gaudu, Landa, Hindley - they should drop them rather by minutes on mountains like that normally. Strange.

Also wonder how they will look at the Tour. I expect Gee and Lazkano to be non-factors, Jorgensen as a dark horse but rather also not in the Top 10. But with all I have seen, I can be totally wrong. And in last year's Giro Gee only got stronger actually.

E: one other consideration. Its not unusual to see surprising performances at Dauphine only to be a non factor at the Tour. You peal early, while the big guys still are in prep mode. Moreau, Brajkovic, Talansky from the top of my head come to my mind. But in the mass of it, and for the reason its similar type of riders - still astounding this year.

 

[titan31]

Vlasov hasn’t? Or are you not calling him a dom?

I was saying that before Vlasov took it up so was just referring to those who had already done their work on today's stage

 

[Oldermanish]

Funny that Gee is as surprised as everybody else by his performance. If he doesn't have a bad day tomorrow I think the podium is realistic. Who would have thought? Also Joergensen on the Podium as well, after all the talk about how he wasn't made for actual mountains.

Good for Gee. As for Jorgenson I hadn't seen much suggestion he wasn't made for mountains. His performances in the Tour and Paris Nice should have made his skills well known. He's also locally known for huge rides that go over the Galena Summit at 8,700', down to Stanley, Idaho and then back over Galena to his start. Now that he lives in Nice I don't think there are any flat areas to train but he does well at altitude.

 

[Oldermanish]

Thats actually the biggest part I am wondering about in this race. Is this a trend or an anomaly? And why (for both answers)? Cause even if the argument is that we have no Pogacar, no Vingegaard, no Mas, no Yates, no Carapaz, no Bernal, no Gall - we have Rodriguez, Vlasov, Gaudu, Landa, Hindley - they should drop them rather by minutes on mountains like that normally. Strange.

Also wonder how they will look at the Tour. I expect Gee and Lazkano to be non-factors, Jorgensen as a dark horse but rather also not in the Top 10. But with all I have seen, I can be totally wrong. And in last year's Giro Gee only got stronger actually.

E: one other consideration. Its not unusual to see surprising performances at Dauphine only to be a non factor at the Tour. You peal early, while the big guys still are in prep mode. Moreau, Brajkovic, Talansky from the top of my head come to my mind. But in the mass of it, and for the reason its similar type of riders - still astounding this year.

Again, Jorgenson has had some serious Tour performances. He's tall but doesn't weigh but around 150 lbs (near to Tadej's weight) @ 6'3" tall. Wout is shorter and 20 lbs heavier. I would expect Gee falls into the similar category as Jorgenson so this is hardly anomalous.

 

[Oldermanish]

This is one of the most slippery slopes in all of pro sports. In the US it almost is a kill factor in big races. I have commented over and over about seeing jaw dropping beauty as a byproduct from watching bike races, seeing Australian coastline, Italy, France, Norway, just to start!! Always awesome and almost always done with some level of government coordination, cooperation and sometimes outright sponsorship. Bike racing has taken for granted free use of public roadways with a manageable amount of hate from whoever. It's all worked out until now. And if done right there is a bunch of positive trade off, people see a place and gain interest, possibly travel there later, or travel there specifically for the event and the overall effect is positive. I can't get over seeing beautiful scenery and roads I will not experience in person.
I am not encouraged by road events in US, but mixed and off road events look to be bringing a small financial windfall to places who host..I hope that races like these can find a place for years to come and the public doesn't say that bicycle racing is a big pain in the butt w nominal reward..
And if YouTube teaches you anything bike racing without a drone or helicopter view is overall terrible and boring. These helicopter shots of race and landscape are absolutely incredible

I'm waiting for a drone fleet to cover breakaways, the pack and even individual riders in descent like they do in alpine ski racing. That POV from above/behind a skilled descender would thrill the most jaded sports fan. No reason they can't signal relay up to a fixed wing plane at a fraction of the cost of helicopters. Simpler still you could launch them from just below serious climbs and track groups to the summits and then retrieve the drone for the next sector. It'd be great.

 

[Unterlenkerfahrend]

1. Memes about postman celebration are not a claim it was a great stage.

2. I mainly contest the implicit assumption Roglic could have just attacked and won today. I think its much more likely he would have lost the stage.

3. Similarly, Pogacar mainly relies on his uphill sprint against Vingegaard, the only rider who he cant just rofldrop with his eyes closed. I just argue, that if you actually put the riders in the same context where you take away the fact that Pog just had more watts, they are more alike than many would admit

I'd actually agree with the overall point that the "Pogacar so entertaining" thing gets overdone but the last point is still way off. There's no way in hell Roglic attacks Vingegaard on Cauterets, Puy de Dome or Joux Plan if you put him in Pogacars body.

 

[Lequack]

Horner with a controversial take

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTZT6hvl-lQ