Doping in XC skiing

[Shardi]

More notably, Bjoergen!

 

[figgelura]

Cologna

So Cologna Went home to high altidude for Three Days just Before the World Championship. Hope he just ate cheese.

 

[Nicko.]

Nice BB, Dario Teflon.
He flew home for a couple of days between his sh!t race in Ostersund last weekend and todays race in Falun (4h drive away). Comes back as his 'normal' self. Thanks Tony.

No sign of exhaustion, no emotions about a silver won or a gold lost...
"Of course I am happy..." he said without any happiness in an early interview.

Maxim Vylegzhanin more of the same, but no teflon there...

 

[Tyler'sTwin]

Some have already pointed this out, but Cologna and Maxim both chose to fly home to Switzerland/Russia after the World Cup race in ?stersund, Sweden, just 6 days before the World Championships in Falun, Sweden. Extremely fishy.

 

[python]

... Maxim both chose to fly home to Switzerland/Russia after the World Cup race in ?stersund, Sweden, just 6 days before the World Championships in Falun, Sweden. Extremely fishy.

i don't know about dario, but this is CERTAINLY, not the case for vyleg since he never started, never dnf-ed nor ever was even entered to start the oestersund 15 k last weekend.

http://www.fis-ski.com/cross-country/events-and-places/event=35096/race=24141/

therefore, he could not have flown from sweden home because he was not in sweden that day.

what he did at home and whether he did a duerr whilst at home, i don't know. everything is possible, but the dude did beat cologna in a rybinsk skiathlon a couple of weeks back in an almost EXACTLY THE SAME manner.

that's why i called accurately his victory today in a racing thread. that said, vyleg is almost always peaking perfectly for a major event. whether he dopes to do it is a major question. except for a single 5-day vacation several years back (high hgb) there is no other objective evidence in public records if my memory serves me right.

 

[roundabout]

I think Hattestad still tops the ?stersund -> Falun improvement rankings though

 

[May0maniac]

**** Johaug. This is **** is not even exciting anymore..

To be fair, the conditions were perfect for a lightweight like Johaug, Astrid Jacobsen beating Kalla was a bigger shock for me.

 

[Deadbody]

As a swede who likes the fact that we have a "clean" reputation in xc-skiing Kalla is scaring the **** out of me.

First the 10 k in Ostersund where she just went crazy and destroyed everyone after a season where she, too put it midly has been stuggeling to preform was crazy to see. It?s one of the most dominant preformaces all year.

And then the performance yesterday. In a track that suits Johaug very well Kalla just went bananas in the classic part. Johaug has been doing really well in the classic races this season putting Bjorgen well behind her. Kalla on the other hand has always been a way better skater then a classic skiier but she just followed Johaug without breaking a sweat. She had very good skiis but so did Johaug.

Kalla is really scaring me and I wouldn't be suprised if Falun becomes Lathis 2.0.

 

[frenchfry]

Some have already pointed this out, but Cologna and Maxim both chose to fly home to Switzerland/Russia after the World Cup race in ?stersund, Sweden, just 6 days before the World Championships in Falun, Sweden. Extremely fishy.

Magnificat went home as well to be with his family. Does seem strange to do all that tiring travelling for a few days when the next venu is so close.

 

[markene2]

To be fair, the conditions were perfect for a lightweight like Johaug, Astrid Jacobsen beating Kalla was a bigger shock for me.

That's true. I see the course was perfect for Johaug, but i was simply so angry that she won, it means countless of interviews and praises from the Norwegian media all day long about the how good we are and how everyone else is shady. Especialy ****ing on Kowalczyk constantly..

I am sick and tired of Bj?rgen and Johaug dominating.. But enough about that.

Also to be fair, Kalla blew herself up completly, and Jacobsen rode very smart. But i felt that Kalla deserved the victory. Something was very off about Bj?rgen yesterday..

Cant wait for the 30k and 50k later in the WC

 

[frenchfry]

That's true. I see the course was perfect for Johaug, but i was simply so angry that she won, it means countless of interviews and praises from the Norwegian media all day long about the how good we are and how everyone else is shady. Especialy ****ing on Kowalczyk constantly..

I am sick and tired of Bj?rgen and Johaug dominating.. But enough about that.

Also to be fair, Kalla blew herself up completly, and Jacobsen rode very smart. But i felt that Kalla deserved the victory. Something was very off about Bj?rgen yesterday..

Cant wait for the 30k and 50k later in the WC

50K classic, now that is Xcountry skiing!

 

[Nicko.]

As a swede who likes the fact that we have a "clean" reputation in xc-skiing Kalla is scaring the **** out of me.

First the 10 k in Ostersund where she just went crazy and destroyed everyone after a season where she, too put it midly has been stuggeling to preform was crazy to see. It?s one of the most dominant preformaces all year.
...

A:
she finally found form after training hard for Falun all season
-> she crushed the opposition to shift the balance of confidence
-> the found form made her very happy and visibly excited afterwards

or

B:
she doped before the race that's 7-14 days prior the races that matter
-> she crushed the opposition to highlight her doping sucess
-> that the blood bag/EPO shot worked so well made her very happy and visibly excted afterwards

Pick the likely scenario...

 

[Discgear]

The nation of stone grinders, have found a no fatigue formula. Glad to see it is a fair fight behind.

 

[goggalor]

Kalla is really scaring me and I wouldn't be suprised if Falun becomes Lathis 2.0.

There is absolutely no chance of that happening.

 

[neineinei]

http://www.expressen.se/sport/langdskidor/besked-letar-doping---inne-pa-vm-omradet/

FIS says they are searching for xenon gas canisters in Falun.

Hajo Seppelt says there are tests for xenon, a blood test and a brand new urin test.

 

[python]

the rarely observed yesterday's domination in the team sprints should clue fis and wada on where to look...

to smuggle and hide any doping products, not just the xenon, is extremely easy in the huge specialized waxing buses that most national teams use...

as to availability of a test for xenon, i haven't looked specifically into the issue, but i can not see ANY technical difficulties for coming up with the tests. everything about the gas is known, it's behavior in human fluids is known even the best matrix for testing is a common sense - blood.

i reckon, a mass-spectrometer test on whole blood shouldn't be a huge challenge.

 

[Cloxxki]

the rarely observed yesterday's domination in the team sprints should clue fis and wada on where to look...

to smuggle and hide any doping products, not just the xenon, is extremely easy in the huge specialized waxing buses that most national teams use...

as to availability of a test for xenon, i haven't looked specifically into the issue, but i can not see ANY technical difficulties for coming up with the tests. everything about the gas is known, it's behavior in human fluids is known even the best matrix for testing is a common sense - blood.

i reckon, a mass-spectrometer test on whole blood shouldn't be a huge challenge.

The way Northug let all his advantage flow way to 6th position in laziness on his second stint, only to turn it into an 8-second lead, was just pure mockery.
The Norwegian ladies were also way too quick to be comfortable. And it wasn't glide. It was relentless full-on sprinting all through the race with hardly any recovery.

 

[Kokoso]

Bauer said he had doping test on Thursday, while watching sprint finals. He said it's nice that lads remembered him

 

[Discgear]

the rarely observed yesterday's domination in the team sprints should clue fis and wada on where to look....

The Norwegian ladies were also way to quick to be comfortable. And it wasn't glide. It was relentless full-on sprinting all through the race with hardly any recovery.

Yes, the races yesterday left a shady feeling. No signs of fatigue whatsoever for the gold winning teams. Swedes with clearly better skis. Russians, Italians, Finns and Swedes had ups and downs throughout the races as ordinary human top athletes. The Stone Grinders on the other hand, drag the field lap after lap, plowed wind and snow but still had energy left to fly past the other teams on the 2nd and final lap. It's hard to compare the times for skiers who competed as number 2s in their teams since those laps went significally slower.

But if we compare the first runners among the medalists, we can see how huge the difference was. All was even in the first lap for both men and women.

But in the 2nd and 3rd lap Ingvild Flugstad ?stberg skied at a total of 4 min 44 sec. Ingmarsdotter and Kowalczyk 4.52. IF? 8 seconds faster or 3% faster.
And in the 2nd and 3rd lap Finn Haagen Krogh skied at a total of 5 minutes.
Petukhov in 5.10 and Noeckler in 5.11. FHK 10-11 seconds faster or 3,5 % faster

That span of having 3-5% higher capacity sounds way to familiar.

But FIS and WADA of course put focus on Xenon gas and indirectly point fingers to the russians, as usual.

 

[dukoff]

Unfortunately, not just anyone can show up expecting to beat elite athletes.

http://imgur.com/k8ZDl2c

Fortunately, a sport where most wins are still clean.

 

[dirkprovin]

As a swede who likes the fact that we have a "clean" reputation in xc-skiing Kalla is scaring the **** out of me.

First the 10 k in Ostersund where she just went crazy and destroyed everyone after a season where she, too put it midly has been stuggeling to preform was crazy to see. It?s one of the most dominant preformaces all year.

And then the performance yesterday. In a track that suits Johaug very well Kalla just went bananas in the classic part. Johaug has been doing really well in the classic races this season putting Bjorgen well behind her. Kalla on the other hand has always been a way better skater then a classic skiier but she just followed Johaug without breaking a sweat. She had very good skiis but so did Johaug.

Kalla is really scaring me and I wouldn't be suprised if Falun becomes Lathis 2.0.

Who knows ? I'm not sure I'd agree that she'd been struggling this season prior to Ostersund. If anything she's been "lightly raced" this season and again skipped Tour de Ski. Her performances at Ruka and 2nd Davos meet were respectable enough.

Whilst I fully concur that skating has always been her stronger discipline; there HAS been a clear upward trajectory in her classic over the past 2 seasons ...... silver in 10km classic & silver in skiathlon in Sochi. She's never been "inadequate" per se in classic; moreso a case that her skating has always been in the very top bracket (if not for Bjoergen's presence a good % of her WCup podiums may've been wins) whereas her classic has been the bracket below (ie top 10 finish).

There MAY be something suspicious ... I admit that I'm seeing less footage than you obviously are.

 

[Cloxxki]

Unfortunately, not just anyone can show up expecting to beat elite athletes.

http://imgur.com/k8ZDl2c

Fortunately, a sport where most wins are still clean.

I can tell a curve when I see one, but please put to words what we're looking at there?

 

[python]

....

That span of having 3-5% higher capacity sounds way to familiar.

But FIS and WADA of course put focus on Xenon gas and indirectly point fingers to the russians, as usual.

good observations. below are my additional comments.

ANY team sprints, just like individual sprints are about power and tactics. historically, the ladies, with very few exceptions, neglect the tactics and from the get-go fight out. in men, however, usually btwn 80-90% of all team sprints, both styles, are highly tactical...the 1st man is normally tasked to set up the 2nd second man to save as much energy as possible for a final shoot out.

yesterday, the traditional set up was made a joke of...

let me be direct and to the point. as i noted in the racing thread immediately after the qualifiers of the individual classic sprints (the finals didn't even start when i posted) - kriukov raised both of my eyebrows when he won those qualifiers (which almost never happened even in his golden performances) AFTER he showed zilch all season. i am in no doubt of kriukov's talent but their sprint coach kaminski (in my book) is a shady character. thus, that krikov performance is quite suspect in my book. petuckov is another story....

yesterday, it was about power and only power. petter and his teammate knew VERY WELL of their power advantage. they played with the completion. northug and krogh made a mince meat of the current - and very likely doped - word champions. and everyone else. (i dont think that unfortunate incident of petu breaking petersson's pole made any difference).

here's what a likely doped kriukov said, 'they were in the league of their own'

 

[Cloxxki]

And that the day after a 30k where Northug was decidedly flat. Pretty sure Kriukov saved himself the effort.
Make no sense. The difference was ridiculous.

Also, Bjoergen lost her mojo quickly this tournament. Perhaps she's magically regain it? Or is she out of favor and under too close scrutiny? Or has her back up crew been sent back at the border perhaps? Looking at her average level of past years, she must be gravely ill the way she's skiing.

The Norwegian teams seem to have had one key objective: to not accidentally take a full minute on the team sprint.

 

[BullsFan22]

good observations. below are my additional comments.

ANY team sprints, just like individual sprints are about power and tactics. historically, the ladies, with very few exceptions, neglect the tactics and from the get-go fight out. in men, however, usually btwn 80-90% of all team sprints, both styles, are highly tactical...the 1st man is normally tasked to set up the 2nd second man to save as much energy as possible for a final shoot out.

yesterday, the traditional set up was made a joke of...

let me be direct and to the point. as i noted in the racing thread immediately after the qualifiers of the individual classic sprints (the finals didn't even start when i posted) - kriukov raised both of my eyebrows when he won those qualifiers (which almost never happened even in his golden performances) AFTER he showed zilch all season. i am in no doubt of kriukov's talent but their sprint coach kaminski (in my book) is a shady character. thus, that krikov performance is quite suspect in my book. petuckov is another story....

yesterday, it was about power and only power. petter and his teammate knew VERY WELL of their power advantage. they played with the completion. northug and krogh made a mince meat of the current - and very likely doped - word champions. and everyone else. (i dont think that unfortunate incident of petu breaking petersson's pole made any difference).

here's what a likely doped kriukov said, 'they were in the league of their own'

I think the chances of Northug and Krogh doping systematically is are higher than Kriukov and Petukhov after watching the race yesterday. But that's just me. I am not fooled by "The Russians are the only ones doping..."