Floyd to be charged with fraud

[Digger]

You have no idea if that is completelytrue or not. You are not the FFF accountant under oath. Hopefully the investigation will take it's course and then we will see.

Considering he didn't have cheque book control of the account....

 

[BotanyBay]

Expland there please...what hasn't he disclosed?

1) Testosterone use during a certain stage race.

2) Being hired by a domestic pro team of dopers specifically for his doping expertise. A consulting gig (of sorts).

He's been willing to admit to being an underworld character, but not willing to accurately describe the underworld itself. He's been willing to throw Lance under the bus, but no one else. Floyd STILL has the opportunity to spill the entire truth (kimmage-style), yet still chooses selective disclosure, and still to this day remains very tight-lipped.

Screw Floyd.

 

[Digger]

1) Testosterone use during a certain stage race.

2) Being hired by a domestic pro team of dopers specifically for his doping expertise. A consulting gig (of sorts).

He's been willing to admit to being an underworld character, but not willing to accurately describe the underworld itself.

(1) So he has to admit to testosterone use in order to placate you? Even if he genuinely doesn't know where it came from.

(2) Serious conjecture on your part - but what about the wearing of the wire? Does volunteering to help the Feds as regards that team not enough?

 

[Digger]

1)
He's been willing to admit to being an underworld character, but not willing to accurately describe the underworld itself. He's been willing to throw Lance under the bus, but no one else. Floyd STILL has the opportunity to spill the entire truth (kimmage-style), yet still chooses selective disclosure, and still to this day remains very tight-lipped.

Screw Floyd.

This is actually funny. Did you even read the NYVelocity interview transcript. Off the top of my head he named PV Petegem, Boogard, all USP team in 2004, Michael Barry, Perreiro. The transript was 60 pages long so i know I've left people out. He went into great detail about how he doped, who supplied him, the conversations he had while on the phonak team, who knew about it on that team, hte amount of money he spent....exactly how much more information do you want?

Note: It's ironic you mention Kimmage, considering Kimmage and himself spoke for seven hours. And Kimmage credits Floyd with helping him understand everything about the situation. Kimmage is a tough task master, and since that say Kimmage has done nothing but praise Floyd.

 

[ChrisE]

Considering he didn't have cheque book control of the account....

Oh that's right, silly me.

Only somebody with a checkbook can get funds. Nobody could perhaps intercept funds before they get into the account and use them at the tiddy bar. Or the person with the checkbook would only use it for its intended use, and not let others associated with FFF use those funds for something other than fighting for fairness. And, of course since all that must be true then why would FL be investigated for possible fraud from a fund with his name on it?

Yes, this is all too silly and I believe you have struck the great epiphany here!

Have you tried emailing the justice dept. and telling them to leave FL alone since he didn't have the checkbook? You are wasting alot of time on this forum arguing with me...it would seem you could put your effort into more noble causes like saving FL from the LA manipulated US government with this new super evidence you have about him not having the checkbook.

 

[BotanyBay]

(1) So he has to admit to testosterone use in order to placate you? Even if he genuinely doesn't know where it came from.

(2) Serious conjecture on your part - but what about the wearing of the wire? Does volunteering to help the Feds as regards that team not enough?

Floyd is no volunteer anything. Floyd is a bitter, burned criminal who is a gansta doing gansta stuff. Using selective memory against selective gangsta former amigos.

And yes, he has to admit to the testosterone (just like JV has to man-up and spill his own beans)

 

[hrotha]

Think I've heard it all now! Couple weeks ago we had those telling us Floyd should have admitted back in 06 but not mention USPS doping even under heavy media questioning to this!!

Stop lying.

 

[ChrisE]

Stop lying.

LOL. That's like telling a goose to stop having bowel movements.

 

[Digger]

Stop lying.

Oh wait sorry - it was a 'limited confession' he should have given.

Yet Botany is saying he still hasn't said enough.

Jesus.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Floyd is no volunteer anything. Floyd is a bitter, burned criminal who is a gansta doing gansta stuff. Using selective memory against selective gangsta former amigos.

And yes, he has to admit to the testosterone (just like JV has to man-up and spill his own beans)

Obviously you did not read the full interview Kimmage did with Landis - amongst other points that you don't seem to know:

I did use testosterone leading-up to the Tour, and I know what the clearance rate is, and I know more now about how the carbon-isotope test works and how long the delta change in the carbon isotope should last and how it should degrade over time and I can’t match it up with a blood transfusion. It just doesn’t make sense to me.

 

[Digger]

Floyd is no volunteer anything. Floyd is a bitter, burned criminal who is a gansta doing gansta stuff. Using selective memory against selective gangsta former amigos.

And yes, he has to admit to the testosterone (just like JV has to man-up and spill his own beans)

Give examples of him not disclosing information or using selective memory. What hasn't he disclosed?

 

[Digger]

Oh that's right, silly me.

Only somebody with a checkbook can get funds. Nobody could perhaps intercept funds before they get into the account and use them at the tiddy bar. Or the person with the checkbook would only use it for its intended use, and not let others associated with FFF use those funds for something other than fighting for fairness. And, of course since all that must be true then why would FL be investigated for possible fraud from a fund with his name on it?

Yes, this is all too silly and I believe you have struck the great epiphany here!

Have you tried emailing the justice dept. and telling them to leave FL alone since he didn't have the checkbook? You are wasting alot of time on this forum arguing with me...it would seem you could put your effort into more noble causes like saving FL from the LA manipulated US government with this new super evidence you have about him not having the checkbook.

Yet another strawman argument....not as good as the rape and murder one though...come on man you must try harder.

It will all come out in good time how our boy Lance was one of the main guys behind setting up this fund and 'suggested' to his rich friends to back it. Even though they knew full well the story....

 

[MarkvW]

I find that hard to believe, your dislike of him runs too deep. There's no way he can do anything right in your eyes.
For argument sake he paid everyone back tomorrow, you'd say he only paid them back due to duress. You would still find fault. The sooner you admit that the better for everyone.
Do you have these strong feelings for Tyler?

I don't even insist that Floyd pay his victims back--just that he actually work hard at it. Even if it means working at McDonald's .

Tyler is a bit different from Floyd. He could have totally Hincapied, but he didn't. And Tyler wasn't hunting for the big score on Lance, like Floyd--he was just telling the truth without strings. And Tyler didn't defraud his fans of hundreds of thousands of dollars. And, to me, Tyler seemed sincere. Tyler has done everything he reasonably could to make it right.

The argument over the meaning of the word 'liar' does not interest me. Floyd still has a debt to pay and I want him to pay it.

 

[ChrisE]

Yet another strawman argument....not as good as the rape and murder one though...come on man you must try harder.

LOL. You are the one saying he didn't have the checkbook so there was no fraud committed by FL. Sheesh man you are so shell shocked you can't even back up what you are saying when I ridicule it or call you on it. I'm sorry I have made you this way today...I really am.

Here's a peace offering...if you stop posting whack takes I will stop attacking them. Deal?

 

[BotanyBay]

Give examples of him not disclosing information or using selective memory. What hasn't he disclosed?

I'll read the kimmage interview again. I'll see if my mind is changed.

My current thoughts are that Floyd has always had the opportunity to be more forthcoming than he has been. He may have given Kimmage 7 hours of his time, but he's given very few hours to anyone since then.

Armstrong's case is dead. Still not a peep. Not good.

 

[hrotha]

Oh wait sorry - it was a 'limited confession' he should have given.

Yet Botany is saying he still hasn't said enough.

Jesus.

Again, no. You're getting the auxiliary verbs confused. "Could", not "should". I said what I think he should have done several times, but you guys ignored it because it didn't fit your LANCELANCELANCE narrative.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I don't even insist that Floyd pay his victims back--just that he actually work hard at it. Even if it means working at McDonald's .

Tyler is a bit different from Floyd. He could have totally Hincapied, but he didn't. And Tyler wasn't hunting for the big score on Lance, like Floyd--he was just telling the truth without strings. And Tyler didn't defraud his fans of hundreds of thousands of dollars. And, to me, Tyler seemed sincere. Tyler has done everything he reasonably could to make it right.

The argument over the meaning of the word 'liar' does not interest me. Floyd still has a debt to pay and I want him to pay it.

Hi Mark,
You see its these kinda posts that starts you spinning out of control.

You want Floyd - who you say is "poor"- to pay back these unfortunate "victims" like Wiesel and others in Tailwind, you say he has a debt to them.

But then you say you don't trust him because he is taking the qui tam case - when in fact you should be supporting this initiative as Floyd may get money by bringing a case against the Tailwind people so he can pay back the Tailwind people who were "victims" of this deceit.

 

[MarkvW]

Hi Mark,
You see its these kinda posts that starts you spinning out of control.

You want Floyd - who you say is "poor"- to pay back these unfortunate "victims" like Wiesel and others in Tailwind, you say he has a debt to them.

But then you say you don't trust him because he is taking the qui tam case - when in fact you should be supporting this initiative as Floyd may get money by bringing a case against the Tailwind people so he can pay back the Tailwind people who were "victims" of this deceit.

Floyd should get off his "thing that you sit on" and work hard to pay back the people he ripped off! Do you have a problem with that?

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Floyd should get off his "thing that you sit on" and work hard to pay back the people he ripped off! Do you have a problem with that?

The "thing that you sit on" - Well he is sitting on all the information he has about USPS doping.
Ya, I hope he works real hard with the authorities and help pay back the USPS who were "victims" of that fraud.

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Floyd won't be indicted. There was no fraud. The money was used for the purpose he specified: his defense. Floyd didn't even control the money. Whether or not he was actually innocent to the underlying charges is irrelevant. Besides it was called the Floyd Fairness Fund, not the Floyd Innocence Fund. Also, given that the website no longer exists and the exact wording on the site are not likely to be resurrected, where's the direct link to any specific wording of fraud...and explain to me how Floyd is responsible for it given he is going to claim he never had anything to do with the website? Floyd is not responsible for whoever wrote what they did on the website. I'm sure the AUSA will realize his case is not what it seems once he looks into all these issues. Seems like a young AUSA who is just trying to make a name for himself since (a) he is a licensed cyclist and (b) how come Floyd wasn't indicted 5 years ago?

Thanx for the explanition.

Nice to get some information in the middle of this bitsh - fight.

 

[MR_Sarcastic]

The difference is Floyd actually had a defense team and the money went towards paying that defense. No fraud here.

I don't understand how that wouldn't be fraud... He collected money from people by saying that he was clean, to defend himself. After collecting that money, he says that he wasn't clean.
If he would have said "I wasn't clean, but I need money to try to get off", there would be no case for fraud.

I don't see how it matters how he spent the money. He could have given it to the homeless and it still would have been fraud.

 

[MarkvW]

I don't understand how that wouldn't be fraud... He collected money from people by saying that he was clean, to defend himself. After collecting that money, he says that he wasn't clean.
If he would have said "I wasn't clean, but I need money to try to get off", there would be no case for fraud.

I don't see how it matters how he spent the money. He could have given it to the homeless and it still would have been fraud.

You get it. If I lie all over my loan application, but use the money exactly as promised, then I'm still guilty of fraud.

And, the people who talk about control of the money are conveniently forgetting about accomplice liability.

 

[ChrisE]

You get it. If I lie all over my loan application, but use the money exactly as promised, then I'm still guilty of fraud.

And, the people who talk about control of the money are conveniently forgetting about accomplice liability.

LOL so what? The new clinic rally cry: HE DIDN'T HAVE THE CHECK BOOK!!! HE DIDN'T HAVE THE CHECKBOOK!

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

You get it. If I lie all over my loan application, but use the money exactly as promised, then I'm still guilty of fraud.

And, the people who talk about control of the money are conveniently forgetting about accomplice liability.

It's time U sued your government then.

It's just about semantics.

When I understood it correctly it is just the question if Landis set up this fund, if so he is in trouble, if not he is scott free, or how do you say this in English?

 

[mewmewmew13]

It's time U sued your government then.

It's just about semantics.

When I understood it correctly it is just the question if Landis set up this fund, if so he is in trouble, if not he is scott free, or how do you say this in English?

scott free