Teams & Riders Froome Talk Only

[Jacques de Molay]

I think this is relevant, but I'll leave it to others to decide. In many ways Froome's transformation occurred around the time he joined forces with Michelle. It's been mentioned that Froome's mother-in-law was/is a masters bike racer, but I hadn't come across anything specific about this until now. I had read that she was a track rider but I haven't found any evidence of that. There has also been some Twitter noise about her having been a competitive bodybuilder at some point, but I hate to further that rumor as I've found zero evidence of that either.

But I did come across this, from 2013, and it seems a bit surprising to me that more hasn't been made of this from the Froome/Cound hysteria machine of self-hype. It's All in The Family.

Amazing Cound Out to Win PMB MTB World Cup

The current UWCT women’s 50-55 year old Road Cycling World Champion Pauline Cound will be looking to her future son-in-law and Tour de France champion Chris Froome for inspiration, as she squares up to the huge challenge ahead of her at the UCI Masters Mountain Bike World Championships that get under way at the Cascades MTB Park on 21 August.

Cound, an international athlete in six different disciplines is eyeing what could be one of the greatest achievements in South African cycling as she attempts to become a world champion in three different cycling disciplines inside three years.

Last year she clinched the UCI Rainbow Stripes by winning her age group at the UCI World Cycling Tour Final road race in Pietermaritzburg, and next week she will aim to add the UCI MTB Mountain Biking Masters World Championship title to her list of achievements and then, hopefully, next year include the UCI World Marathon Championships, also in Pietermaritzburg.

Cound has represented South Africa in a number of different sporting disciplines including cycling, hockey, duathlon and triathlon, and the challenge of taking on an event like this was too enticing for the 54 year old to pass.

I tried to search for some results, but ended up with a few dead links, and I really can't be bothered to search more extensively at the moment. But I do wonder how much influence Team Cound may have had on Christopher's development, as he clearly dismisses his own coaches advice.

Also, for those in-the-know: How much of this side of the family has been shared on the pages of those scholarly treatise devoted to all things Froome?

 

[sniper]

has been discussed here and on twitter.
you heard right, she was (perhaps still is) also an active bodybuilder.
Schwarzenegger and Longo have more cred than this lady.

 

[gillan1969]

Re:

has been discussed here and on twitter.
you heard right, she was (perhaps still is) also an active bodybuilder.
Schwarzenegger and Longo have more cred than this lady.

"eyes on the prize...eyes on the prize"

 

[Dear Wiggo]

But I did come across this, from 2013, and it seems a bit surprising to me that more hasn't been made of this from the Froome/Cound hysteria machine of self-hype. It's All in The Family.

Michelle had a falling out with her Mum. I'm guessing that's why no mention is made of extended family. CLoser scrutiny would lead to wtf thoughts too, at a guess, given how muscular certain 65+ year old women look.

 

[LeindersGains]

I have an question for you guys.

Based on the leaked SRM files, Froome's attack on Puerto de San Lorenzo was a lot harder in terms for power and a couple of seconds longer than the Mont Ventoux attack.

But Contador was dropped like a stone on Mont Ventoux while easily being able to hang on the Puerto de San Lorenzo stage. Harder pace in the Ventoux stage?

 

[StryderHells]

Re:

I have an question for you guys.

Based on the leaked SRM files, Froome's attack on Puerto de San Lorenzo was a lot harder in terms for power and a couple of seconds longer than the Mont Ventoux attack.

But Contador was dropped like a stone on Mont Ventoux while easily being able to hang on the Puerto de San Lorenzo stage. Harder pace in the Ventoux stage?

Harder pace maybe but when Contador was dropped on Ventoux he just didn't have the legs to go with it, that whole Tour he was below his jacked up best

 

[Oufeh]

Re:

I have an question for you guys.

Based on the leaked SRM files, Froome's attack on Puerto de San Lorenzo was a lot harder in terms for power and a couple of seconds longer than the Mont Ventoux attack.

But Contador was dropped like a stone on Mont Ventoux while easily being able to hang on the Puerto de San Lorenzo stage. Harder pace in the Ventoux stage?

Hard to compare, because Ventoux 2013 is a SRM file and San Lorenzo's from a Stage sensor.
But yes, in Vuelta he looks a few watts stronger than Ventoux but Contador beats him easily.
My take is he didn't go all out on Ventoux in 2013, you can see him recovering behind Nairito several times, HR getting down to 149, talking on the radio...

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

I have an question for you guys.

Based on the leaked SRM files, Froome's attack on Puerto de San Lorenzo was a lot harder in terms for power and a couple of seconds longer than the Mont Ventoux attack.

But Contador was dropped like a stone on Mont Ventoux while easily being able to hang on the Puerto de San Lorenzo stage. Harder pace in the Ventoux stage?

Maybe Alberto's shape is the key to solving this riddle

 

[GuyIncognito]

Definitely explained by Contador's form.
Contador said earlier this year that the whole reason he stopped training by feel and submitted to De Jongh's training plans is that in 2013 he was doing the same numbers as 2009 and that was no longer good enough.

He claims this is because training methods evolve. Regardless of what we may think of that, even Contador admits his numbers were far far better in 2014.

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re:

Definitely explained by Contador's form.
Contador said earlier this year that the whole reason he stopped training by feel and submitted to De Jongh's training plans is that in 2013 he was doing the same numbers as 2009 and that was no longer good enough.

He claims this is because training methods evolve. Regardless of what we may think of that, even Contador admits his numbers were far far better in 2014.

Same numbers my arse. 2009 Contador was breaking the sound barrier uphill. Climbing times don't lie.

 

[42x16ss]

Re:

I have an question for you guys.

Based on the leaked SRM files, Froome's attack on Puerto de San Lorenzo was a lot harder in terms for power and a couple of seconds longer than the Mont Ventoux attack.

But Contador was dropped like a stone on Mont Ventoux while easily being able to hang on the Puerto de San Lorenzo stage. Harder pace in the Ventoux stage?

That Ventoux stage was raced at an insane pace right up to the foot of the climb and it wasn't short either at 224km.

It was a hot day too IIRC

 

[blackcat]

Re:

I have an question for you guys.

Based on the leaked SRM files, Froome's attack on Puerto de San Lorenzo was a lot harder in terms for power and a couple of seconds longer than the Mont Ventoux attack.

But Contador was dropped like a stone on Mont Ventoux while easily being able to hang on the Puerto de San Lorenzo stage. Harder pace in the Ventoux stage?

but the road and 21 days aint a sports science lab with an ergo. Its the Tour de France, on hot-pour, tarmac and lime, the asphalt. It aint a lab test. It is a sport on the road.

Like I spoke to Martin Vinnicombe over losing the gold medal in the 1km tt on the track sprint at the Olympics by a couple of tenths of a second (coulda been a few hundredths, in reality, this is zero difference, it can all come down, well it does, it does all come down to random variables at this level, and on which side of bed you got out on that morning (ie. your circadian rhythm).

There are variables Froome and Contador cannot control, as much as Brailsford and Contador and Froome would have you believe. ok, maybe less Contador... it wont be decided by your FTP in the lab nor on the powermeter...

It is the circadian rhythm* of variables. *thats a metaphor. The rhythym will have random chance built into an atomic level, and Brailsford would be centuries being able to control those variables on such a level, as much as he likes bring his campers for LRP and others for the marginal gains.

 

[jens_attacks]

Re:

Definitely explained by Contador's form.
Contador said earlier this year that the whole reason he stopped training by feel and submitted to De Jongh's training plans is that in 2013 he was doing the same numbers as 2009 and that was no longer good enough.

He claims this is because training methods evolve. Regardless of what we may think of that, even Contador admits his numbers were far far better in 2014.

2013 tour was the weakest alberto ever in terms of uphill speed

And yes it's true about 2014 vuelta. Alberto back to his best days and froome close or maybe equal as strong as in 2013 tdf

Do not forget that on ventoux they arrived tired at the base, they arrived one hour quicker than the fastest schedule.

 

[ScienceIsCool]

Re: Re:

Definitely explained by Contador's form.
Contador said earlier this year that the whole reason he stopped training by feel and submitted to De Jongh's training plans is that in 2013 he was doing the same numbers as 2009 and that was no longer good enough.

He claims this is because training methods evolve. Regardless of what we may think of that, even Contador admits his numbers were far far better in 2014.

2013 tour was the weakest alberto ever in terms of uphill speed

And yes it's true about 2014 vuelta. Alberto back to his best days and froome close or maybe equal as strong as in 2013 tdf

Do not forget that on ventoux they arrived tired at the base, they arrived one hour quicker than the fastest schedule.

Contador is 33 years old. He SHOULD be declining in performance. He may or may not win another GT, but unless he manipulates his results with pharmaceuticals he shouldn't dominate like he used to.

John Swanson

 

[Benotti69]

It is interesting that Jeroen Swart thinks Froome has suffered 'abuse'. If he doesn't mean PED abuse, which i believe he doesn't, then he has a very warped sense of what consitutes abuse!

This is pro-cycling. I think Swart needs to educate himself on the history of the sport. Doping is a part of the culture of the sport. When an athlete goes through a gigantic transformation at the same time the 7 time TdF winner admits to doping for those wins, then every winner is going to be questioned about doping. If Froome is not happy about that then he can do a number of things. He can stop. He can refuse to talk to the press. He can do what other winners have done, deny, deny, deny continue to win until caught while racing or after or he can release every scarp of information relating to him and answer every single question related to performance. This try to appease cycling fans with half arsed tests and some information just adds to the doubt. Kimmage told Froome what to do. He ignored it. Still trying to play a PR game. Well that in pro cycling can only mean one thing. Doping.

 

[Archibald]

Re: Re:

Definitely explained by Contador's form.
Contador said earlier this year that the whole reason he stopped training by feel and submitted to De Jongh's training plans is that in 2013 he was doing the same numbers as 2009 and that was no longer good enough.

He claims this is because training methods evolve. Regardless of what we may think of that, even Contador admits his numbers were far far better in 2014.

2013 tour was the weakest alberto ever in terms of uphill speed

And yes it's true about 2014 vuelta. Alberto back to his best days and froome close or maybe equal as strong as in 2013 tdf

Do not forget that on ventoux they arrived tired at the base, they arrived one hour quicker than the fastest schedule.

Contador is 33 years old. He SHOULD be declining in performance. He may or may not win another GT, but unless he manipulates his results with pharmaceuticals he shouldn't dominate like he used to.

John Swanson

sounds like Valverde, only he's 35 and still better and stronger than ever...

 

[42x16ss]

Re: Re:

Definitely explained by Contador's form.
Contador said earlier this year that the whole reason he stopped training by feel and submitted to De Jongh's training plans is that in 2013 he was doing the same numbers as 2009 and that was no longer good enough.

He claims this is because training methods evolve. Regardless of what we may think of that, even Contador admits his numbers were far far better in 2014.

2013 tour was the weakest alberto ever in terms of uphill speed

And yes it's true about 2014 vuelta. Alberto back to his best days and froome close or maybe equal as strong as in 2013 tdf

Do not forget that on ventoux they arrived tired at the base, they arrived one hour quicker than the fastest schedule.

Contador is 33 years old. He SHOULD be declining in performance. He may or may not win another GT, but unless he manipulates his results with pharmaceuticals he shouldn't dominate like he used to.

John Swanson

sounds like Valverde, only he's 35 and still better and stronger than ever...

I honestly think that Valverde is seriously close to the rider he was 05-07. In the classics at least.

 

[sniper]

Re:

If he doesn't mean PED abuse, which i believe he doesn't,

 

[The Carrot]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/othersports/cycling/chris-froome/12054551/BBC-SPOTY-2015-Chris-Froome-rode-through-fire-like-a-true-professional-writes-Geraint-Thomas.html

"This is the Tour de France we are talking about. It took 100 years for a Brit to win it. Just because we have had three wins in four years doesn't mean it is getting easier."

Seeing as Brit's don't dope, they never have, and the rest of the world no longer dope because it's the 'new generation', surely it should be getting a tincy wincy bit easier now Geraint?

 

[The Hitch]

Nope. The number of Froome supporters who post in the Clinic may be a small minority, but in the world at large they aren’t, and I don’t know anyone in the Clinic who thinks they are. If they really were, the Clinic wouldn’t spend so much effort in arguing with them. Elsewhere in CN forums, there are all kinds of crank views expressed, and no one spends much time arguing with them just because they are in such a minority.
.

Sky defenders absolutely are a minority. On English speaking forums it may seem like they are not but cycling fanbase is so much bigger than just England and a few Americans and once you take away the nationalism (the reason for which 99% of people believe Froome to begin with) it becomes very clear that they are a small minority.

If you look at cycling's West European heartland where cycling is actually a major sport not something only a few people with cable can tune into, the skepticism is far greater than it is here, but that won't be reflected so much in the anlgophone press where everyone is a friend of Brailsford and wants to get a book contract, nor on forums like this where English people are heavily overrepresented (telling that pretty much all International posters with the exception of Taxus and gooner (allegedly Irish) doubt Froome)

I know from participation on a major Spanish cycling forum that the believers are nearly non existent, and i've heard its the same in Denmark and Holland and other countries.

The clinic responds to the - sky won by inventing marginal gains view, not because they are a majority but because they have a monopoly of the press meaning that opinion gets spread the loudest.

there are all kinds of crank views expressed, and no one spends much time arguing with them just because they are in such a minority.

Disagree. When jspear denies evolution for example, he is 1 poster but there are usually 3 or 4 who respond.

 

[Ventoux Boar]

Re:

Sky defenders absolutely are a minority. On English speaking forums it may seem like they are not but cycling fanbase is so much bigger than just England and a few Americans and once you take away the nationalism (the reason for which 99% of people believe Froome to begin with) it becomes very clear that they are a small minority.

If you look at cycling's West European heartland where cycling is actually a major sport not something only a few people with cable can tune into, the skepticism is far greater than it is here, but that won't be reflected so much in the anlgophone press where everyone is a friend of Brailsford and wants to get a book contract, nor on forums like this where English people are heavily overrepresented (telling that pretty much all International posters with the exception of Taxus and gooner (allegedly Irish) doubt Froome)

I know from participation on a major Spanish cycling forum that the believers are nearly non existent, and i've heard its the same in Denmark and Holland and other countries.

The clinic responds to the - sky won by inventing marginal gains view, not because they are a majority but because they have a monopoly of the press meaning that opinion gets spread the loudest.

Blind nationalism, eh? Since it applies to the 99% you'll have no trouble backing-up that nasty insult with some examples?

You might want to reflect on your personal objectivity in the light of recent events. Ross Tucker - seemingly the sceptics house scientist - says that Froome is 'at the upper end of what is plausible with known physiology', and based on the 2007 lab tests we 'know' that the upper end is plausible for Froome. If he always had the engine, it seems to me your case has been shredded. Thoughts?

 

[King Boonen]

Honestly, nationalism is a fair assumption by Hitch in my opinion.

 

[The Hitch]

Re: Re:

Sky defenders absolutely are a minority. On English speaking forums it may seem like they are not but cycling fanbase is so much bigger than just England and a few Americans and once you take away the nationalism (the reason for which 99% of people believe Froome to begin with) it becomes very clear that they are a small minority.

If you look at cycling's West European heartland where cycling is actually a major sport not something only a few people with cable can tune into, the skepticism is far greater than it is here, but that won't be reflected so much in the anlgophone press where everyone is a friend of Brailsford and wants to get a book contract, nor on forums like this where English people are heavily overrepresented (telling that pretty much all International posters with the exception of Taxus and gooner (allegedly Irish) doubt Froome)

I know from participation on a major Spanish cycling forum that the believers are nearly non existent, and i've heard its the same in Denmark and Holland and other countries.

The clinic responds to the - sky won by inventing marginal gains view, not because they are a majority but because they have a monopoly of the press meaning that opinion gets spread the loudest.

Blind nationalism, eh? Since it applies to the 99% you'll have no trouble backing-up that nasty insult with some examples?

You might want to reflect on your personal objectivity in the light of recent events. Ross Tucker - seemingly the sceptics house scientist - says that Froome is 'at the upper end of what is plausible with known physiology', and based on the 2007 lab tests we 'know' that the upper end is plausible for Froome. If he always had the engine, it seems to me your case has been shredded. Thoughts?

What is my case?

 

[Fearless Greg Lemond]

Re:

Honestly, nationalism is a fair assumption by Hitch in my opinion.

For the win, or should we include Ventoux bear for selective quoting?

Dont think so.

Lets move on.

 

[bigcog]

Re: Re:

Sky defenders absolutely are a minority. On English speaking forums it may seem like they are not but cycling fanbase is so much bigger than just England and a few Americans and once you take away the nationalism (the reason for which 99% of people believe Froome to begin with) it becomes very clear that they are a small minority.

If you look at cycling's West European heartland where cycling is actually a major sport not something only a few people with cable can tune into, the skepticism is far greater than it is here, but that won't be reflected so much in the anlgophone press where everyone is a friend of Brailsford and wants to get a book contract, nor on forums like this where English people are heavily overrepresented (telling that pretty much all International posters with the exception of Taxus and gooner (allegedly Irish) doubt Froome)

I know from participation on a major Spanish cycling forum that the believers are nearly non existent, and i've heard its the same in Denmark and Holland and other countries.

The clinic responds to the - sky won by inventing marginal gains view, not because they are a majority but because they have a monopoly of the press meaning that opinion gets spread the loudest.

Blind nationalism, eh? Since it applies to the 99% you'll have no trouble backing-up that nasty insult with some examples?

You might want to reflect on your personal objectivity in the light of recent events. Ross Tucker - seemingly the sceptics house scientist - says that Froome is 'at the upper end of what is plausible with known physiology', and based on the 2007 lab tests we 'know' that the upper end is plausible for Froome. If he always had the engine, it seems to me your case has been shredded. Thoughts?

Out of interest where did Ross Tucker say that given he said that if Froome is an innocent victim of increased scepticism so be it? I imagine he'd be squealing like a stuffed pig if someone accused him of being pseudo-scientist on a daily basis. According to him it's all pattern matching as that's what humans do, so is he now a neuroscience/AI expert ? haha