Froome Vs. Contador

[djpbaltimore]

Good post TMP402. Context matters.

 

[Taxus4a]

Re: Re:

Wow, that wins the Nostradamus Award for most prescient post of all time.

Another one in the same thread:

To answer your question though, I see Chris Froome and Dan Lloyd as being the two Brit riders that may go for overall victory at a Grand Tour if they end up on the Sky team, it would not surprise me to see Dan Fleeman involved in the squad too.

I was looking what an important froum member aid in an spanish forum about maggia bianca favourites in Giro 2009, I cant find it...I hope so, ut I just found this from the opening ITT.

82 SOLER Juan M. BAR 22:44 0:54
83 FROOME Christopher BAR 22:44 0:54
84 HUNTER Robert BAR 22:44 0:54
85 AUGUSTYN John Lee BAR 22:44 0:54
86 CHEULA Giampaolo BAR 22:44 0:54
87 CANCELLARA Fabian SAX 22:45 0:55
88 GOSS Matthew Harley SAX 22:45 0:55
89 BAK Lars Ytting SAX 22:45 0:55
90 HAEDO Juan Jose' SAX 22:45 0:55
91 MCCARTNEY Jason SAX 22:45 0:55

How strong should be Froome to beat Barloworld to that Saxo with Cancellara, becouse his friend Augustyn was really bad in ITT, hunter, hismentor to Sudafrica to europe, well, it is OK, cheulla, it is OK, ok, a climber, but it is OK. no more in ITT.

And Cancellara, Very good, Goss, good one (then)Bak, very good in ITT, Haedo, similar than Hunter, maybe worst, but similar, McCartney, good one...

Edit, I forgot

80 CARDENAS Felix Rafael BAR 22:44 0:54
81 BELLOTTI Francesco BAR 22:44 0:54

Anyway doesnt change too much.

 

[Taxus4a]

I was banned in that forum and all my post deleted, I have my opinion about Froome, but you could say I wrotted later, this way.

But luckily there are some post quoted when I still can read me on the internet:

Subedei
Vicepresidente de la UCF
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·
#248 · 03/May/2009, 16:22
Escrito originalmente por Taxus_1977

Augustín y Froome son gandes escaladores, pero lo normal es que se supediten a Soler, que es un corredor mucho más hecho, uno de los mejores escaladores del mundo,a siq ue creo que en la general no estarán muy alla, pero todo depende de las circunstancias de carrera.

Dario, sin embargo, si va de jefe de filas, aunque la general del Giro le queda grande, podría llevarse el maillot blanco, no se si gente como Lokwist entra ya en ese maillot...

Capecchi debe demostrar lo que vale ya este Giro.

Debería entrar junto a todos los de 1984+, lástima que siempre se pega el tortazo en las tres semanas... la verdad es que mirando la lista de participantes provisional del Giro... poco nivel para el maillot blanco.



What I said there is: Augustyn and Froome and big climbers, but normal is to be supeditated to Soler, That is 2009.




Another forum member, said this in hi analysys of the teams:

aupaavenida
Creyendo en el ciclismo
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Desde: 05/Abr/2007
· ·
#283 · 08/May/2009, 16:23
Previa del Giro 2009

Los equipos
.....


Barloworld. Fueron de los últimos equipos en ser elegidos, pero presentan un buen plantel para la carrera italiana, liderados por Mauricio Soler. El colombiano no tuvo mucha suerte con las lesiones el pasado año, teniendo que retirarse en las dos grandes vueltas que disputó, pero su acercamiento al Giro parece ser bastante bueno. Soler ha corrido varias pruebas en Italia, siendo segundo en la Semana Lombarda y noveno en la Coppi e Bartali. Como ayudante para las etapas de montaña tendrá a Cárdenas, que ya brilló al principio de temporada en el Tour del Mediterráneo (fue séptimo), y que el pasado fin de semana ha demostrado su buen momento de forma (top-10 en las dos pruebas de un día disputadas en Italia). Para los sprints, la baza es la de Robert Hunter, que cuenta con dos triunfos esta temporada (etapas en Trentino y Mediterráneo), además de haber sido tercero en el GP Etruscchi. El resto del equipo lo forman Augustyn (buen escalador y que dejó una de las imágenes del pasado Tour cuando se salió de la carretera en un descenso), Belloti, Caccia, Cheula, Froome (será el encargado de dirigir al equipo en la crono inicial, pues es un gran rodador).

He said: Froome will be the man to guide in the ITT, becouse he is a grand rouleour.

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

Re:

Wow, that wins the Nostradamus Award for most prescient post of all time.

That dude only ever posted 6 times. If he shows up again, I'll want a long chat with him about lottery numbers.

Not only that all of his other posts are in some win a jersey competition thread. He made precisely one post with so much as a full sentence in it and it was that one! Carl Singleton, hero.

 

[Maxiton]

Re: Re:

Wow, that wins the Nostradamus Award for most prescient post of all time.

That dude only ever posted 6 times. If he shows up again, I'll want a long chat with him about lottery numbers.

Not only that all of his other posts are in some win a jersey competition thread. He made precisely one post with so much as a full sentence in it and it was that one! Carl Singleton, hero.

Yep, that was a seriously amazing post. Traveler from the future?

 

[Rollthedice]

Froome showing signs of greatness before August 2011 is fan fiction. I'll pick a random rider who doesn't suck at climbing and can do a top 10 ITT in a decent field like Mattia Cattaneo, will he win Tour de France someday?

 

[Zinoviev Letter]

I don't blame the legendary Carl Singleton for not coming back. If my only proper post was one from 2009 suggesting that Chris Froome was a future Tour winner, I would retire permanently to protect my perfect record as the seer of seers and prognosticator of prognosticators.

 

[Taxus4a]

Re:

Froome showing signs of greatness before August 2011 is fan fiction. I'll pick a random rider who doesn't suck at climbing and can do a top 10 ITT in a decent field like Mattia Cattaneo, will he win Tour de France someday?

If he has the engine for that and work hard, who knows

Has he been 14 in the last ITT in his first TdF?

 

[Taxus4a]

Anyway I am looking his results and he is an european rider who started quite soon in cycling, so he has leanrt a lot about cycling already and he is 26.

He showed some potential 2 year ago in the Giro, but not as good as Froome did in 2008, and Giro is not le Tour, and he didnt have the horrible situation of the team Froome faced in 2008.

An very important, at the time Froome starting pro cycling BP just started, there was still a big level of doping, although less than previous years, so Mattia wont improve his results for the fall of doping level.

I dont know all his circuntances, but as far as I know,I would say no, there is nothing to say the contrary.

You cant say that tatement if you read: Un unpolished diamond, the story of Chris Froome, becouse there is enough proofs he showed that greatness you say no,

Cheers.

 

[Maxiton]

Re:

I don't blame the legendary Carl Singleton for not coming back. If my only proper post was one from 2009 suggesting that Chris Froome was a future Tour winner, I would retire permanently to protect my perfect record as the seer of seers and prognosticator of prognosticators.

Agreed. He can't come back. Right now he's like the John Titor of pro cycling.

 

[Taxus4a]

Re: Re:

Amazingly he did Not come 4th in the SPANISH National Road Race.

2009
1st Stage 2 Giro del Capo
1st Anatomic Jock Race
4th National Road Race Championships --- BRITISH 2009--- Kristian House Daniel Lloyd Peter Kennaugh All thse other GT winners (NOT) in front of him.....
9th Gran Premio Nobili Rubinetterie

So future GT winners can never be beaten by non-GT winners? Got it. Can we check if Fabio Aru ever finished lower than 1st in a race?

Coming off the top of the climb of the Tumble, Bradley Wiggins and Chris Froome had finally broken clear in what was to be the significant move of the race. They had some two minutes plus on the chase group.

However, Wiggins eventually came back to the chasers as the race moved onto the finishing circuit for the first time. Froome continued to lead lap after lap, with a fragmented chase group behind him. When he was finally caught, it was by a quality trio, namely Peter Kennaugh, Daniel Lloyd and Kristian House, who had themselves broken free of what remained of the main field. Froome looked around, took a quick breather and then went again. Initially, no-one wanted to chase him and even on the final lap with the other the playing cat and mouse he continued to attack in the hope of stealing the win.

However, he was finally reeled in one last time and dropped back leaving the way clear for a thrilling final sprint

I writted about that race, He is not a man for one day races, but he did very well in a few of them before 2011.

I can understand people saying: he hadnt that result to put him as a big promise, or he didnt have continuity, he has some bad results. Yes.

But he showed a very good potential in a lot of result looking at the circuntances. Maybe most of cycling fans didnt realized at the moment, it is necesary to follow a rider forr that, but people. peole reme,ber more from that Tour Augustyn first in la Bonnete, the higher climb in France, and crashing after that, but Froome showed more potential that Tour.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lPd4aZQmDuQ

 

[LaFlorecita]

Replying to Taxus post from the Froome thread:

But in this page I have read Froome has never beated Contador. No more to read...

That's a lie. No one claimed that. Some people only said Froome has never beat a top shape Contador, which is of course 100% true.

I dont mind the preferences of cycling fans, I just demand a little of objetivity.

I demand the same from you.

And there is an objetve fact, Tour is by far the most important race in cycling today. And Contador has bever even be close to Froome in le Tour.

But the Tour is not the only race in the world. There are other races in which Contador annihilated Froome and there are also circumstances that can explain why Contador was never close to Froome in the Tour (well actually in the 2 times they both raced)

According what we see in Dauohine 2014 and the second stage of le Tour, Froome was stroger, no much estronger, but a little stronger.

In your subjective opinion maybe.

We can just speculate, this year will be important, but to read some things is hard for amy objetive person. But that is the time contador was close to him in the main objetive of the season for them.we can talk about other year as well,

We know their build-ups were completely different, Contador had had a much longer break yet Froome couldn't drop him and when Contador got some miles in his legs he again completely crushed Froome, not even funny it was so easy, like taking candy from a child.

I dont like too much Sagan, but I am not going to say he is not an excepcional rider able to win all the monuments (difficult anyway)

But if you believe that, put your money to Contador, he is best payed than Froome instead he didnt beated him ever...

Yeah, many people have put their money on him, and his odds have shortened drastically. In the off-season most bookies had him at 6/1 or 7/1, now most have him at 3/1 or 7/2. Whereas Froome's odds are drifting ......

There is another fact, Froome started season in January and he is nws competing. Contador started in February and he stopped 10 days ago. Contador will finish his season in the olimpic and Froome has at least Vuelta in his mind. It is not the same planification!

Froome started in February with a training race that was basically him and Kennaugh beating up on Aussie Conti riders and then had a 2 month break. he's racing now but has had a super light schedule. It's been 12 weeks since his first race day, and spread over those 12 weeks he's had 14 days of racing. Contador started in February, raced pretty much non-stop till Pais Vasco. In 7 weeks of competition he had 26 race days (and he RACED.. every last one of them). And Contador is also planning to do the Vuelta, the European Championships and maybe even the Italian fall classics.

Bottom line: don't try to twist the truth to make it seem like Contador's season is not as long or hard. State the facts.

 

[rick james]

Lol.... Someone say something wrong about saint Bertie the compulsive liar??

 

[dlwssonic]

Re:

Lol.... Someone say something wrong about saint Bertie the compulsive liar??

Froome on the other hand has the honesty of Ricco

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Lol.... Someone say something wrong about saint Bertie the compulsive liar??

Froome on the other hand has the honesty of Ricco

He was quite honest about the bunnies though

 

[LaFlorecita]

Re: Re:

Lol.... Someone say something wrong about saint Bertie the compulsive liar??

Froome on the other hand has the honesty of Ricco

He was quite honest about the bunnies though

TMI

 

[PremierAndrew]

Re:

Replying to Taxus post from the Froome thread:

And there is an objetve fact, Tour is by far the most important race in cycling today. And Contador has bever even be close to Froome in le Tour.

But the Tour is not the only race in the world. There are other races in which Contador annihilated Froome and there are also circumstances that can explain why Contador was never close to Froome in the Tour (well actually in the 2 times they both raced)

According what we see in Dauohine 2014 and the second stage of le Tour, Froome was stroger, no much estronger, but a little stronger.

In your subjective opinion maybe.

We can just speculate, this year will be important, but to read some things is hard for amy objetive person. But that is the time contador was close to him in the main objetive of the season for them.we can talk about other year as well,

We know their build-ups were completely different, Contador had had a much longer break yet Froome couldn't drop him and when Contador got some miles in his legs he again completely crushed Froome, not even funny it was so easy, like taking candy from a child.

Bottom line: don't try to twist the truth to make it seem like Contador's season is not as long or hard. State the facts.

Froome was stronger than Contador on stages 1 and 2 of the Dauphine, before Contador smashed a crash affected Froome. Yes, Froome's performance was pathetic after the crash, but no denying that Contador wasn't stronger before Froome's little fall.

Also, what ever the reasons, the fact remains that the GTs are what matter, and CF dominated AC in the 2013 and 2015 Tours, and AC dominated CF in 2012 and 2014 Vueltas. Period.

Don't speculate on the 2014 Tour, because as good as AC was, CF was also closer to his 2013 form than he was last year

 

[Jspear]

Re: Re:

Replying to Taxus post from the Froome thread:

And there is an objetve fact, Tour is by far the most important race in cycling today. And Contador has bever even be close to Froome in le Tour.

But the Tour is not the only race in the world. There are other races in which Contador annihilated Froome and there are also circumstances that can explain why Contador was never close to Froome in the Tour (well actually in the 2 times they both raced)

According what we see in Dauohine 2014 and the second stage of le Tour, Froome was stroger, no much estronger, but a little stronger.

In your subjective opinion maybe.

We can just speculate, this year will be important, but to read some things is hard for amy objetive person. But that is the time contador was close to him in the main objetive of the season for them.we can talk about other year as well,

We know their build-ups were completely different, Contador had had a much longer break yet Froome couldn't drop him and when Contador got some miles in his legs he again completely crushed Froome, not even funny it was so easy, like taking candy from a child.

Bottom line: don't try to twist the truth to make it seem like Contador's season is not as long or hard. State the facts.

Froome was stronger than Contador on stages 1 and 2 of the Dauphine, before Contador smashed a crash affected Froome. Yes, Froome's performance was pathetic after the crash, but no denying that Contador wasn't stronger before Froome's little fall.

Also, what ever the reasons, the fact remains that the GTs are what matter, and CF dominated AC in the 2013 and 2015 Tours, and AC dominated CF in 2012 and 2014 Vueltas. Period.

Don't speculate on the 2014 Tour, because as good as AC was, CF was also closer to his 2013 form than he was last year

Who cares. We had already seen them compete against each other before the 2014 Tour. It didn't matter what sort of form Froome was showing up with.

 

[dacooley]

Re: Re:

Who cares. We had already seen them compete against each other before the 2014 Tour. It didn't matter what sort of form Froome was showing up with.

If we clinge to the idea that Bertie was ready to improve like in 2009 between the Dauphine and the Tour, then yes, 100%

 

[Publicus]

Based on his form to date, Froome will be lucky to make the podium at the TdF.

 

[Jspear]

Re:

Based on his form to date, Froome will be lucky to make the podium at the TdF.

I want to believe this, but we are talking about team sky.

 

[Publicus]

Re: Re:

Based on his form to date, Froome will be lucky to make the podium at the TdF.

I want to believe this, but we are talking about team sky.

I know, but there's a fair amount of discounting his earlier performance because they weren't important. Romandie is supposed to be the race where we can reliably assess his form (at least that's what his supporters have maintained). Based on his body of work this year, he's trailing Contador and Quintana. We'll see what tomorrow brings, but he looks like a shell of himself. Maybe the badzilla has returned.

 

[Singer01]

interestingly the bookies thought today brought quintana closer to froome, but not contador. still 4.5/1

 

[Jspear]

Re:

interestingly the bookies thought today brought quintana closer to froome, but not contador. still 4.5/1

This means nothing.

 

[buchanan]

Re:

Replying to Taxus post from the Froome thread:

But in this page I have read Froome has never beated Contador. No more to read...

That's a lie. No one claimed that. Some people only said Froome has never beat a top shape Contador, which is of course 100% true.

I dont mind the preferences of cycling fans, I just demand a little of objetivity.

I demand the same from you.

And there is an objetve fact, Tour is by far the most important race in cycling today. And Contador has bever even be close to Froome in le Tour.

But the Tour is not the only race in the world. There are other races in which Contador annihilated Froome and there are also circumstances that can explain why Contador was never close to Froome in the Tour (well actually in the 2 times they both raced)

According what we see in Dauohine 2014 and the second stage of le Tour, Froome was stroger, no much estronger, but a little stronger.

In your subjective opinion maybe.

We can just speculate, this year will be important, but to read some things is hard for amy objetive person. But that is the time contador was close to him in the main objetive of the season for them.we can talk about other year as well,

We know their build-ups were completely different, Contador had had a much longer break yet Froome couldn't drop him and when Contador got some miles in his legs he again completely crushed Froome, not even funny it was so easy, like taking candy from a child.

I dont like too much Sagan, but I am not going to say he is not an excepcional rider able to win all the monuments (difficult anyway)

But if you believe that, put your money to Contador, he is best payed than Froome instead he didnt beated him ever...

Yeah, many people have put their money on him, and his odds have shortened drastically. In the off-season most bookies had him at 6/1 or 7/1, now most have him at 3/1 or 7/2. Whereas Froome's odds are drifting ......

There is another fact, Froome started season in January and he is nws competing. Contador started in February and he stopped 10 days ago. Contador will finish his season in the olimpic and Froome has at least Vuelta in his mind. It is not the same planification!

Froome started in February with a training race that was basically him and Kennaugh beating up on Aussie Conti riders and then had a 2 month break. he's racing now but has had a super light schedule. It's been 12 weeks since his first race day, and spread over those 12 weeks he's had 14 days of racing. Contador started in February, raced pretty much non-stop till Pais Vasco. In 7 weeks of competition he had 26 race days (and he RACED.. every last one of them). And Contador is also planning to do the Vuelta, the European Championships and maybe even the Italian fall classics.

Bottom line: don't try to twist the truth to make it seem like Contador's season is not as long or hard. State the facts.