GC Power Ranking

[VayaVayaVaya]

I will say that Roglic could rise in the Power Ranking with a display of force in the Vuelta. Such is the nature of Power Rankings.

 

[topcat]

The question, as has been stated approximately 10 thousand times, is who would be the favourite if they met up in a Grand Tour right now. My point that Pogacar would beat Thomas by more than 15 seconds was brilliant.

All your points are brilliant.
1. Vingo (no doubt)
2. Pog (no doubt)
3/4. Rog/Remco (yes Rog won the Giro but I don’t know which one is better until they both complete the same gt)
5. … whatever

 

[bNator]

@bNator

But then again Pogačar was destroyed a couple of times too. If we use this term. While i guess using such analogy Roglič just barely hanging on. Like all the time. So that is i guess that.

Only by Vingegaard. Nobody here argues Vingegaard shouldn’t be ranked first in stage racing power ranking.

 

[tobydawq]

Right now in my opinion Pogi is too empty to even think about a GT yet alone race it.

Yeah, that's really not the point

But nice moving of goalposts.

 

[tobydawq]

Abi in this thread is peak Pistolero/Echoes/Broccolidwarf/Koronin level of infuriating.

 

[Netserk]

Use the ignore feature.

 

[OlavEH]

1. Jonas Vingegaard
2. Tadej Pogacar
3. Primoz Roglic
4. Remco Evenepoel
5. Geraint Thomas
6. Jai Hindley
7. Enric Mas
8. Joao Almeida
9. Adam Yates
10. Carlos Rodriguez

Top 5 IMO

1. Vingegaard
2. Pogacar
3. Evenepoel
4. Roglic
5. Depends on route (Thomas, Hindley, Mas)

Top 4 are easy. 5 is more difficult. Thomas with a route with a larger amount of ITT and not too much or too steep mountains. Hindley if we had a typical brutal Giro route including climbs like Finestre, Mortirolo and Fedaia.

 

[CyclistAbi]

OK guys i give up for now. For the discussion to move on. That is you convinced me, when it comes to stage racing, Pogačar was dominant this season. At PN and first two weeks at the Tour. Whilst Roglič was barely hanging on at TA, Catalunya and Giro. I will hence clean my stage racing glasses, remove bias and will hope for a bit more dominant performance from Roglič in the remainder of the season. When it comes to stage racing. Hopefully a power burst in a form of a stomp will push Roglič a bit forward. We'll see.

 

[Netserk]

1. Vingegaard
2. Pogi
3. Rogla
4. Thomas
5. Evenepoel
6. Hindley
7. Mas
8. Adam
9. Carapaz
10. Almeida

Dark Horse: Hart

 

[Bolder]

IMO there's a big difference between "stage racing" and Grand Tour stage racing. Mostly because rarely do you have more than a few top riders targeting week-long stage races. If they happen to win, great, but it doesn't necessarily prove much to me in an overall ranking. I mean, Porte is famous for cleaning up on weeklong races but in GTs, not so much. I love it when guys like Skjelmose surprise in weeklong races.

As for the intial ranking -- Can't argue with JV/TP 1 and 2, would put Roglic 3 at the moment, with Remco, Thomas and Hindley next, but more or less equal (you do have to consider results as much as potential). Then Mas, A. Yates, Ayuso, with Almeida, Carapaz, S.Yates and C. Rod sort of lumped together. That's about it. Maybe Tao but it would be projection rather than rational analysis.

Interesting what a small list of legitimate stage race contenders there are, and how much difference there is between JV/TP and the next tier (Roglic, Remco, Thomas, Hindley), and then there's still another gap, though smaller, to the next group...

 

[Gigs_98]

I wanted to complain about people having so many riders between Roglic and Thomas despite them being pretty much equal in the Giro, but then I guess if people rank one week stage races that highly they have a point.

Still, as always I think Roglic gets a tad overrated and I do think Remco is a bit underrated with hardly anyone putting him above Primoz. We will see how the Vuelta goes but Remco is probably the best TTer in the world and I'm struggling to find many climbing performances by Roglic which I think were better than Remcos best performances in last years Vuelta.

 

[gregrowlerson]

I probably don't understand the 'power ranking' aspect, but if a grand tour was to start in a few months time, and all riders were forced to fully target that race from now on, then I'd place Remco slightly above Roglic, and possibly Ayuso as high as 5th. Don't see how Ayuso isn't a lock for top 10 if we're talking ceiling more so than results. And he already has a 3rd at the Vuelta, so kind of proven too.

 

[Netserk]

I wanted to complain about people having so many riders between Roglic and Thomas despite them being pretty much equal in the Giro

Rogla was affected more by the stage 11 crash. If not for his chain drop, he would have put 1 minute into Thomas on Lussari.

 

[Gigs_98]

Rogla was affected more by the stage 11 crash. If not for his chain drop, he would have put 1 minute into Thomas on Lussari.

So he would have won the Giro by 30 seconds instead of 14. Really don't think that matters.

 

[Netserk]

You don't think a minute difference on a single climb refutes that they were pretty much equal? As for the final GC difference, my first sentence answered that.

 

[Red Rick]

You don't think a minute difference on a single climb refutes that they were pretty much equal? As for the final GC difference, my first sentence answered that.

But remember that Evenepoel crashed before getting dropped like a brick in the Vuelta.

 

[Elos Anjos]

Abi in this thread is peak Pistolero/Echoes/Broccolidwarf/Koronin level of infuriating.

10000 upvotes for accuracy and 10000 downvotes for reminding me of Koronin.

 

[Red Rick]

Re Roglic vs Evenepoel. I don't see how you can look at Catalunya, particularly Mont Caro, and argue Evenepoel is the better climber, and that's assuming preperation while one of the couldn't train properly over the winter. As for the 2022 Vuelta, Evenepoel was a net loser vs Enric Mas in the mountains.

That's not to say that I don't think putting Thomas or Hindley or whoever inbetween them is a piss take.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

The absence of Ayuso in all these top-10s is a glaring omission that I expect to be swiftly rectified in the first week of the Vuelta.

For me, it goes like this:

Vingegaard
Pogacar
Roglic, Evenepoel (in that order)
Thomas, Ayuso (in that order)
And then a rather amorphous blob containing Hindley, Mas, A Yates, Rodriguez, Carapaz, Hart and Almeida where the order becomes really unclear.

 

[tobydawq]

OK guys i give up for now. For the discussion to move on. That is you convinced me, when it comes to stage racing, Pogačar was dominant this season. At PN and first two weeks at the Tour. Whilst Roglič was barely hanging on at TA, Catalunya and Giro. I will hence clean my stage racing glasses, remove bias and will hope for a bit more dominant performance from Roglič in the remainder of the season. When it comes to stage racing. Hopefully a power burst in a form of a stomp will push Roglič a bit forward. We'll see.

Wow. Fair play!

 

[Netserk]

The absence of Ayuso in all these top-10s is a glaring omission that I expect to be swiftly rectified in the first week of the Vuelta.

At present, he can at best be placed as 9th. I have him behind Simon and Carlito too atm, and he will have to surprise me in the Vuelta to surpass Almeida. Of course, I expect him to enter the top-10 (and likely the top-5 as well), he is just not there yet.

 

[Red Rick]

The absence of Ayuso in all these top-10s is a glaring omission that I expect to be swiftly rectified in the first week of the Vuelta.

Okay. I'm willing to play the heel on this one.

But we're 2 GTs and every Big 7 stage race into the season, and the kid has one good climbing performance. This isn't the Suisse ITT power rankings

 

[Devil's Elbow]

At present, he can at best be placed as 9th. I have him behind Simon and Carlito too atm, and he will have to surprise me in the Vuelta to surpass Almeida. Of course, I expect him to enter the top-10 (and likely the top-5 as well), he is just not there yet.

Ayuso beat Rodriguez on 2 out of 3 MTFs in the first week of the Vuelta last year, before one of them caught Covid and the other got hampered by a crash. Simon Yates should be nowhere near a top-10 best riders if we're talking about GTs.

 

[Red Rick]

Ayuso beat Rodriguez on 2 out of 3 MTFs in the first week of the Vuelta last year, before one of them caught Covid and the other got hampered by a crash. Simon Yates should be nowhere near a top-10 best riders if we're talking about GTs.

You have to be pretty damn dismissive of the most recent Tour de France to not have Simon Yates in there.

 

[Devil's Elbow]

Okay. I'm willing to play the heel on this one.

But we're 2 GTs and every Big 7 stage race into the season, and the kid has one good climbing performance. This isn't the Suisse ITT power rankings

Shame on Ayuso for not performing when he was injured!

Seriously, arguing Ayuso shouldn't be top-10 because of his health issue causing him to not get many results now is the same as arguing Roglic shouldn't be top-5 because of all his injuries causing him not to get many results at the end of last season.