Does every bloody TdF thread has to feature endlessly long and mostly pointless Contador vs. Evans/ some similar bloke discussions?
Can't someone make a thread for that?
Can't someone make a thread for that?
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Rechtschreibfehler said:Does every bloody TdF thread has to feature endlessly long and mostly pointless Contador vs. Evans/ some similar bloke discussions?
Can't someone make a thread for that?
The Hitch said:Your repeated use of but doesnt mock or degrade the reasoning behind it as much as you think.
The reasoning is sound, Contador went for the Giro and was off form for the Tour. Its something we see a lot of in cycling.
You might also want to factor in that Evans had more motivation as he was going for gc.
When Evans did the Giro and was beat up he also performed a lot worse in the tt.
He lost 5 minutes.
Evans is only better than Contador when he is far fresher and bases his season around a race that Contador doesnt. Or when he was 29 and on peak and Contador was still young and learning.
When they both are on form Contador wins - see 2009 and when the rolles are reversed and Contador is on form and Evans isnt, Contador takes far more time out of Evans than Evans does out of Contador in the first scenario.
As you can see if you add up their tt times from 2010 and 2011.
Rechtschreibfehler said:Does every bloody TdF thread has to feature endlessly long and mostly pointless Contador vs. Evans/ some similar bloke discussions?
Can't someone make a thread for that?
Midnightfright said:Am I right in saying there talk of 20k of hilly TT and 60km of flat. If that is/ was the case what do people think total time references between the GC contenders would be?
cineteq said:Evans is the best TTer of the 2 hands down. Proven in this year's TdF. Cased closed.
Francois the Postman said:That is one school of thought. The other is the one where context matters......The science of cycling involves so many variables, it is mind-boggling, and those who talk most sense in the long run are probably those who are -on the whole- better at judging (or remembering) what the result actually meant on the day. Not what it appeared to be at face value.
I am glad no-one has figured out how to normalise the bewildering set of variables to get a true like-for-like data set. It would make these forums kinda dull, and it is always nice to hear other ways of seeing the same things.
Zoncolan said:On absolutely top form, I'd say Evans=Contador on flat long stuff.
On hilly stuff - Contador>Evans. The steeper it gets, the bigger the margin.
Overall, ITT wise, I'd say they're pretty evenly matched.
Of course a lot depends on the day, weather, etc.
If Contador is at his best, regardless of the lame parcours, it's his race to lose.
roundabout said:In 5 previous long time trials in the Tour it's 3-2 for Evans over Contador
Havetts said:Contador fanboys vs Evans fanboys, watch this reach 200 pages..
Also, loving how everyone is all Evans won the tour thus he is the best. When Schlecks did jack all that tour and the rest who couldve won crashed out, lost time or did the Giro..
Havetts said:Contador fanboys vs Evans fanboys, watch this reach 200 pages..
Also, loving how everyone is all Evans won the tour thus he is the best. When Schlecks did jack all that tour and the rest who couldve won crashed out, lost time or did the Giro..
Zam_Olyas said:the men from down under will be up soon.![]()
User Guide said:Most of the major ITT results for Contador were 2008/9,when Contador crushed everybody in mountains and TT'd like spartacus.Those days in the tour are gone.Nobody is doing the performances of even 2009 now(clinic obviously).I still think Contador would be a heavy favourite for the Tour as his climbing is superior to anyone elses.He just wont be beating Wiggins/Evans with ease in TT's anymore.
Francois the Postman said:That is one school of thought. The other is the one where context matters.
Even when people are in the same race, they will hardly ever be there at the same point on their career curve. It is also not a given that they are both there at the exact same level of fitness, ideally their peak. Or had the same level of support. Were equally rested. Or had the same material. Flat tire. Tummy bug. Weather. In-race motivational tweets by ACF to your GPS.
The science of cycling involves so many variables, it is mind-boggling, and those who talk most sense in the long run are probably those who are -on the whole- better at judging (or remembering) what the result actually meant on the day. Not what it appeared to be at face value.
I am glad no-one has figured out how to normalise the bewildering set of variables to get a true like-for-like data set. It would make these forums kinda dull, and it is always nice to hear other ways of seeing the same things.
Angliru said:Shouldn't that be "In-race stalking-as-motivational tweets to your GPS"?
Seriously though I agree that there is always a bigger picture than just the results of the day or even the entire grand tour. So many variables come into play and its odd to me that such similar circumstances as Contador 2011 and Evans 2010 are often not taken into consideration by the some of the fans from both sides.
I did say those days in the Tour are gone.El Pistolero said:Did you watch the Giro this year? Regardless of what you think of the competition the w/kg he pulled off there speak for them self.
User Guide said:I did say those days in the Tour are gone.
just some guy said:2009 the year Evans was mentally a basket case. And we all know how important the mental side is for Evans so I say you can't use that. Plus Contador gets a lot of drafting from the camera bike
I still say they are much more even than people will admit