If you were in their shoes, would you dope? Poll

[ingsve]

Saying that you would dope is completely the wrong mentality. How is that ever going to solve anything?

If I was a pro cyclist I would assume that I was so because I loved the sport and I would do anything in my power to stop anyone from cheating. That's the only viable course of action.

Perhaps that's the problem with cycling. Too many riders only care about their salary and not the love of the sport. I find that type of thing so hard to stomach.

 

[Jonathan]

...Lemond resigned to the fact that he would not dope when the 90's extra terrestrial riders hit it up...

I don't think that's an established fact, or even a reasonable assumption. It's a possibility.

 

[Hugh Januss]

BS. Inner Peace is right on. If you don't like what goes on in the sport, do something else. He happens to know what the word "choice" means and uses it as the basis of his position, unlike you. Just like your buddy rhubarb, always the victim of something you have no control over. Must suck going thru life like that.

Sanctimonious? lol Pot meet kettle.

10-7 round to inner peace.

They both make good points. IP was not completely right until he added this however

2) I never said the choice was between two great options. It is a choice between two very sad ones. Leave the sport you love, or cheat in the sport you love. Not easy, but a choice nonetheless

If we are gonna keep score I'd have to see it at
Inner Peace 6 pts
Buckwheat 5 pts
ChrisE no point at all

 

[buckwheat]

They both make good points. IP was not completely right until he added this however

If we are gonna keep score I'd have to see it at
Inner Peace 6 pts
Buckwheat 5 pts
ChrisE no point at all

Well, I guess I have to live with the decision of the judges, but I will say the proof is in the pudding, why people dope or commit to any behavior.. And this is a much more profound response than anyone gave.

The fact is that anyone has committed their transgressions or tresspasses for very specific reasons. If one thinks they are above temptation, that is more than a little thing called pride, which is the biggest sin of all.

I'll give the self rightous (IP, ChrisE) a clue here. If you can, in your lifetime, figure out the scientific (and yes, I said scientific reasons) why pride is a sin, you'll have figured out the whole BIG picture.

Thank you.

 

[buckwheat]

I don't think that's an established fact, or even a reasonable assumption. It's a possibility.

Jeez, while we're on the subject of defamation.......


There's a thing called evidence, In Amsterdam, is it customary to just take a hit and leave it to your imagination?

 

[buckwheat]

BS. Inner Peace is right on. If you don't like what goes on in the sport, do something else.:

Rationality is not your bailiwick, eh. I should stop riding because the fastest guys are doped up thoroughbreds. Please explain.

He happens to know what the word "choice" means and uses it as the basis of his position, unlike you. Just like your buddy rhubarb, always the victim of something you have no control over. Must suck going thru life like that.

Sanctimonious? lol Pot meet kettle.

10-7 round to inner peace.

Life is a long process. You'll figure it out one day.....once you get past the anger and self righteousness.

 

[Oncearunner8]

You're the only one laughing.

That was a 10-7 round for rhubroma.

That means he knocked the other guy down about 5 or 6 times.

You should throw in the towel.

QQ more for yourself!

You and Romperroom are the same to limp asshats who were in the line at Dunkin Donuts and could not make up your minds between a fatty-biscuit or a shizz-packed pastry.

Simple question yes or no.
Have a take and try not to suck so bad!

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

A staggering 54%, including me btw , has voted, yes I would.

Which shows once again, it's not strange so many top riders, sub top riders and even helpers dope. If you see other guys doing it, you'll do the same. At least, half of them would (if we take this poll serious)

 

[pedaling squares]

I could only answer the question based on my behavior so far in life. I haven't cheated to get my current job, or any previous job so I would have to assume that I wouldn't dope as a pro athlete...

Nor have I. I have never taken any kind of illegal substance, except drinking the odd beer when I was underage I guess. But I think that were I as a young man immersed in this specific culture with nothing else to fall back on, I would follow the path that my team doctor and DS told me was the route to success or at least continued employment. I believe that scenario has been applicable to many fine honest young men, and many chose to take the dope.

Saying that you would dope is completely the wrong mentality. How is that ever going to solve anything?

If I was a pro cyclist I would assume that I was so because I loved the sport and I would do anything in my power to stop anyone from cheating. That's the only viable course of action.

Perhaps that's the problem with cycling. Too many riders only care about their salary and not the love of the sport. I find that type of thing so hard to stomach.

Not meaning to criticize you, but I think many people are approaching this from the position of where they sit today, not imagining themselves as a young person whose livelihood and dreams depend on this job. It's easy to say walk away, but remember in some countries it has often been the economically disadvantaged who succeed in cycling. We also tend to look at ourselves as the person we wish to be, not always the person we are. Most people get married due to a genuine and intense love, but there's still a whole lot of cheating going on!

 

[buckwheat]

QQ more for yourself!

You and Romperroom are the same to limp asshats who were in the line at Dunkin Donuts and could not make up your minds between a fatty-biscuit or a shizz-packed pastry.

Simple question yes or no.
Have a take and try not to suck so bad!

My answer was that I'd find another job.

 

[biokemguy]

Another analogy

I have friends who took degrees in engineering, but then refused to take high paying jobs building weaponry. (At the time the economy allowed this choice much easier than today)

I have reservations about taking a job in big pharma to develop bigger **** drugs rather than life saving drugs that are overpriced.

Are these choices similar to doping to make money racing bikes?

Granted, those jobs aren't illegal, but their societal benefit is debatable.
Perhaps cyclists look at it like someone fresh out of school looking for a job to make money. Many of their peers will take whatever job they can get to make the most money, but some will play a different game.

 

[broken chain]

Wheres the bag and needle.Show me da money!

 

[pedaling squares]

I have friends who took degrees in engineering, but then refused to take high paying jobs building weaponry. (At the time the economy allowed this choice much easier than today)

I have reservations about taking a job in big pharma to develop bigger **** drugs rather than life saving drugs that are overpriced.

Are these choices similar to doping to make money racing bikes?

Granted, those jobs aren't illegal, but their societal benefit is debatable.
Perhaps cyclists look at it like someone fresh out of school looking for a job to make money. Many of their peers will take whatever job they can get to make the most money, but some will play a different game.

Not really. There are alternate and viable options within engineering and pharmacology. These people can still perform in the professions for which they have trained. Leaving cycling is another matter altogether.

 

[TibetT]

OK, let's have some honesty and truth around here. If you were a rider in the pro peloton faced with riders around you making you suffer (ie dropping you) because they are doping - would you dope in order to maintain your position and your 400,000 euro a year salary? Absolute straight from the gut honest answers please. Let's make this meaningful.

Unless you have been in the shoes of these guys it's pretty hard to make an honest assessment of what your responce would be. Having competed just under the elites in another sport with similar issues I can freely say ideals are all well and good untill pressure to produce results puts the line in the sand. It's all to easy to flirt with crossing the line and then ignore that fact that doping is cheating- cause it's simply a means to an end.

Added my vote to the find another job numbers. For the record after heaps of soul searching and a stuggle to accept that doping was the only way forward I walked away and found another job. My contempries & friends are still in the game doing what needs to be done to take the wins. Sad when those are the options.

I'm an anti- doper, as the positives keep coming I am disapointed. But do I blame the pros for crossing the line - No.

 

[palmerq]

actually on 2nd thoughts of this, I think i would probably run away and paint houses :S, but like the guy above me says it is pretty hard/near impossible to say right now... It's not that I think I would be above doing some dodgy things to gain an advantage or get on an even playing field, I think doping would be really scary with all the blood and whatever some guy would be injecting into you in a hotel room :S and maybe not doping would be even scarier ....... So I think I would just run away from all of it and forget, ride a bicycle for fun and let oher people worry about this.....


of course it is a hypothetical situation :S but if i were to be a pro cyclist maybe I wouldnt have the qualifications I have today(which are not much really:S) so it would be a very hard choice

 

[shawnrohrbach]

I took another job and became a writer knowing my lack of any racing skills would never land me on a pro team even if I doped until it came out my ears. Now, I am on a constant search for a performance enhancing drug that will improve my writing.

 

[JPM London]

I took another job and became a writer knowing my lack of any racing skills would never land me on a pro team even if I doped until it came out my ears. Now, I am on a constant search for a performance enhancing drug that will improve my writing.

I think they call it LSD...

 

[I Watch Cycling In July]

... I think that were I as a young man immersed in this specific culture with nothing else to fall back on, I would follow the path that my team doctor and DS told me was the route to success or at least continued employment. I believe that scenario has been applicable to many fine honest young men, and many chose to take the dope... I think many people are approaching this from the position of where they sit today, not imagining themselves as a young person whose livelihood and dreams depend on this job.

I voted YES because the question requires imagining you are a pro, immersed in cycling culture, with the belief that all other riders see doping as a normal and accepted part of the competition. I also assume pros usually face this decision when they're quite young, so I tried to remember how I thought and felt as a sport obsessed 20 year old.

Firstly, I'm sure I would never have doped unless I truly believed that everyone else was playing the same game. In which case I simply would not have seen it as cheating. I doubt any health considerations would have crossed my mind; health problems are for old people and anyway I'm not going to go mad like those bodybuilding idiots. As far as forcing others to follow suit and also dope, whose forcing them? If they don't like the heat they should get out of the kitchen. I wouldn't have given a *** about not following the rules. Anti-doping rules are just another of those pointless rules invented by people who don't follow them, because they enjoy imposing their views on others. It's my body, if I want to live a good time not a long time that's my decision; I'm not hurting anyone else. The rules nazis can fcuk off, and take those whinging old geezers on the interwebz with them. Anyway, even the sports governing body doesn't really believe in the rules, so why should I follow them?

With more life experience, the flaws in this kind of thinking are glaring. But a decision based on these thoughts would not have been a rejection of all morality. I simply don't think I would have seen it as cheating.

 

[shawnrohrbach]

I think they call it LSD...

Not brave enough for that. I think I got a thing going with whisky.

 

[JPM London]

Not brave enough for that. I think I got a thing going with whisky.

Sounds quite nice. Can I be a writer too?

 

[Ninety5rpm]

A pro rider would be stupid not to dope. Find another profession if it troubles you. Zulle is doing well with his house painting business.

Are you suggesting Zulle didn't dope and still managed to win the Vuelta, twice, and get second to '99 Pharmstrong in the Tour?

Need I remind you that Zulle was on Festina during the Festina affair, and that he admitted to using EPO?

 

[knewcleardaze]

Wheres the bag and needle.Show me da money!

That's funny! I needed a laugh.

 

[ludwig]

OK, let's have some honesty and truth around here. If you were a rider in the pro peloton faced with riders around you making you suffer (ie dropping you) because they are doping - would you dope in order to maintain your position and your 400,000 euro a year salary? Absolute straight from the gut honest answers please. Let's make this meaningful.

Yes. If I could live the life of a professional cyclist making 300-500K a year, I don't think this sacrifice would require a whole lot of thought.

I'd like to think that if I was busted, I'd man up like Kohl did. But I can't say for sure that I would if there was a ton of money to be made down the road by staying loyal to omerta.

I'd also like to think that if I was an elite cyclist, I would be doing what I could to reform the sport in the interest of healthy lifestyles.

 

[Escarabajo]

Are you suggesting Zulle didn't dope and still managed to win the Vuelta, twice, and get second to '99 Pharmstrong in the Tour?

Need I remind you that Zulle was on Festina during the Festina affair, and that he admitted to using EPO?

It was a metaphor. BikeCentric was being sarcastic. That was what Zulle said when asked about the drug use:

“I’ve been in this business for a long time. I know what goes on. And not just me, everyone knows. The riders, the team leaders, the organizers, the officials, the journalists. As a rider you feel tied into this system. It’s like being on the highway. The law says there’s a speed limit of 65, but everyone is driving 70 or faster. Why should I be the one who obeys the speed limit? So I had two alternatives: either fit in and go along with the others or go back to being a house painter. And who in my situation would have done that?”

 

[Ferdinand Artichoke]

A pro rider would be stupid not to dope. Find another profession if it troubles you. Zulle is doing well with his house painting business.

and here, mister crash alot, you have no morals?
troll you!


I was, I did not, I found another job
still riding a pushie though!