If you were in their shoes, would you dope? Poll

[ianfra]

OK, let's have some honesty and truth around here. If you were a rider in the pro peloton faced with riders around you making you suffer (ie dropping you) because they are doping - would you dope in order to maintain your position and your 400,000 euro a year salary? Absolute straight from the gut honest answers please. Let's make this meaningful.

 

[BikeCentric]

A pro rider would be stupid not to dope. Find another profession if it troubles you. Zulle is doing well with his house painting business.

 

[pedaling squares]

I answered yes, I would dope. My scenario assumes that I am a young man who has ridden a bike my whole life and I haven't got an education or trade to fall back on. It's easy to sit here in my comfortable life and say that I would be too honourable to dope, but realistically I think I would take my shot at the cash while I could. Question is, would I remain quiet and admit to doping if I was caught, or would I be one of the on-the-dope-but-holier-than-thou cyclists who disgust me?

 

[Hugh Januss]

OK, let's have some honesty and truth around here. If you were a rider in the pro peloton faced with riders around you making you suffer (ie dropping you) because they are doping - would you dope in order to maintain your position and your 400,000 euro a year salary? Absolute straight from the gut honest answers please. Let's make this meaningful.

I don't believe it is a valid question. I honestly think by the time you are a 400K or even 100K a year pro, that decision has long since been made.
As you start to show promise at the upper amateur level you learn more and more about how to "prep" yourself, first not really illegal stuff from the experienced guys in your local team, progressing all the way up to the "tricks of the trade" that you may learn from national team or developmental pro team trainers. It is probably not even a finite line that you are aware of crossing. One day you're a top junior powering down 3 mocha gels and a hit on an inhaler right before a 10 mile TT and the next you are in a hotel in France hooked up to a blood bag. Or something like that.

 

[3rdWheel]

I couldn't do it because I'd be worried about how it would affect my health down the road. It's drugs to help make me a better athelete not to improve (or cure) my general health. I'd switch professions.

 

[ImmaculateKadence]

I couldn't do it because I'd be worried about how it would affect my health down the road.

Likewise. I would stick with it as long as I could, but if me not doping results in lost contracts, so be it. I'm assuming every other circumstance is the same as it is now, I'm just a pro cyclist, so I would be smart with my money and look into graduate schools. If I went pro before completing undergrad, I would go back and finish that up. It was fun while it lasted.

 

[luckyboy]

It'd be so great to be a cyclist that I'd be happy struggling along at the back tbh. I'd probably be too scared incase something went wrong with the doping anyway.

I've always thought that it'd be interesting to see for myself the difference in performance on a climb clean and after blood doping though.

 

[Escarabajo]

My answer is “No”. My scenario is that I would leave the sport if it was that rotten..

 

[BikeCentric]

I've always thought that it'd be interesting to see for myself the difference in performance on a climb clean and after blood doping though.

You can come close to seeing the difference it makes in a natural way. If you haven't done this before get deadly serious about your diet and get yourself down to about 5% body fat such that you have six-pack abs and veins sticking out of your skin everywhere. Then go climb and see how it feels like your floating up the hills.

On 10-15 hours of training you basically have to change your food intake such that you are eating nothing but fruit, vegetables, some lean meat, nuts, yogurt, small amount of whole grains, etc. No alcohol.

 

[pmcg76]

OK, let's have some honesty and truth around here. If you were a rider in the pro peloton faced with riders around you making you suffer (ie dropping you) because they are doping - would you dope in order to maintain your position and your 400,000 euro a year salary? Absolute straight from the gut honest answers please. Let's make this meaningful.

Thats a hard question to answer unless I was actually in such a position. I think I would probably quit as I have never gone with the crowd and dont take jobs just for the money. Other things are more important.

 

[Hugh Januss]

You can come close to seeing the difference it makes in a natural way. If you haven't done this before get deadly serious about your diet and get yourself down to about 5% body fat such that you have six-pack abs and veins sticking out of your skin everywhere. Then go climb and see how it feels like your floating up the hills.

On 10-15 hours of training you basically have to change your food intake such that you are eating nothing but fruit, vegetables, some lean meat, nuts, yogurt, small amount of whole grains, etc. No alcohol.

I'm out.
Seriously though, been there, done that, it works. But even more, try living at about 10,000 feet for 1 month, then come back down to 500-1500 feet and see how you go. That would approximate probably 20-25% of the boost you would get with EPO or blood boosting.

 

[luckyboy]

Fair enough, but I meant that it'd be interesting to see the same person go up the same hill/mountain under the same conditions - one time clean and one time on dope. Just to see the exact difference it'd make.

I don't think I've heard of an experiment like that before - 5%-25% difference is what I've seen quoted, but it'd be interesting to see some real results.

 

[Cerberus]

Fair enough, but I meant that it'd be interesting to see the same person go up the same hill/mountain under the same conditions - one time clean and one time on dope. Just to see the exact difference it'd make.

I don't think I've heard of an experiment like that before - 5%-25% difference is what I've seen quoted, but it'd be interesting to see some real results.

9-17% according to one study, another showed that the same subject could hold the same effort 60% longer IIRC. I can try to dig up some articles abotu the studies if you want.

 

[Winterfold]

I answered yes, based on current 'cant be caught and maybe even improve health' programmes. I am sure I have taken plenty of worse things just for kicks.

When riders were dying in their sleep I would have found another job.

Maybe.

The question is one of moral relativism and it is difficult to put myself in the shoes of a young rider with not much education and nothing else to fall back on.

I would be interested in doing a before and after test though, for scientific purposes of course. I would need to get my act together on my diet and lose 5-7kg first and do some proper work on my threshold power first though. Else it would just be a waste of good drugs.

(joke)

 

[Winterfold]

Fair enough, but I meant that it'd be interesting to see the same person go up the same hill/mountain under the same conditions - one time clean and one time on dope. Just to see the exact difference it'd make.

I don't think I've heard of an experiment like that before - 5%-25% difference is what I've seen quoted, but it'd be interesting to see some real results.

I read an interview with Millar about when he was doping where he said you are still suffering but the 5 minutes a well trained pro can do on the rivet before letting go becomes 10.

It's not much in percentage terms on a big climb, but it's a winning margin. Of course if it's the elite group all on a really good programme then gains are neutralised and it comes back to technique, talent, physiology, tactical nous. But you knew that already.

 

[Nicoper]

No.

I presume that this situation is there for some time and I still have a contract, and I signed the contract while everyone is doped around me. I am earning reasonable amounts of money and I am a hero in my country (we don't have a single professional cyclist ).
Furthermore, I am doing something I like and every time there is a mention of discovering new doping affair I would enjoy watching all the known dopers fearing of being caught.

 

[ak-zaaf]

I probably would.
I've never had a problem with taking (loads of) recreational drugs, so I'm guessing that if there was money involved I would go further than most.
In that case fair play would not concern me at all, it's not about the sport anyways.

I don't even really like this, but I know myself and when push comes to shove I even cheat at monopoly. The health aspect doesn't concern me.
I also fully understand the ridiculous Vino/Di Luca/Schumi/Chicken conspiracy reactions when they got caught, because I would probably do something similar. Rather that than rat out friends.

 

[luckyboy]

New answer - I probably would try it as I was approaching retirement age tbh.

 

[Polish]

Dope! Dope! Dope! Dope! Dope!

I would also come up with a snazzy victory salute
to use as I cross the finish line or stand on the podium.

My gesture = Screwing in a Lightbulb pantomime.
My nickname will be the "sprośny żart"

And when I get busted I WILL NAME NAMES.
I know who the Forum Dopers are
Rat you guys out....thats OK, right?.....I can come back to the forum, right?

 

[skidmark]

Dope! Dope! Dope! Dope! Dope!

I would also come up with a snazzy victory salute
to use as I cross the finish line or stand on the podium.

My gesture = Screwing in a Lightbulb pantomime.
My nickname will be the "sprośny żart"

And when I get busted I WILL NAME NAMES.
I know who the Forum Dopers are
Rat you guys out....thats OK, right?.....I can come back to the forum, right?

This is my favourite post that you've ever written.

 

[theswordsman]

I said no, and based on other choices I've made in life even when they cost me, I'm sure of it. But the responses are interesting to me. Last June I was still going by BloggingLance on twitter. I interacted with hundreds of other cycling fans. There was some typical doping announcement made before the Tour, and I was fed up, so I tweeted that if (either 3 or 5, I don't recall) riders were busted for doping during the Tour, I'd never watch pro cycling again. That drew some reactions, including an exchange with someone who said they dope in MMA and everywhere else. I told him my number 2 spectator sport at the time was women's tennis (did you know you can actually hear people sigh over twitter?), so I didn't really have a double standard about tolerance. But I got him to admit that half the riders in the race could test positive, and he'd still watch.

I remember talking about Bill Clinton's affair, and the lying about it, with a co-worker whose personal life I knew nothing about. He was on his second marriage, and when he told me that Clinton's behavior was normal, I knew not to press. I've only had a Telecourse in Psychology, but I remember hearing some place once that people don't like to give credit to other people for being more honest or whatever than they are. So if someone was willing to lie about fifty thousand dollars income on their taxes, or steal things from work, they would expect everyone to be capable of the same.

Do those of you who said you would dope have a higher tolerance for riders who do, and would people who said no, or you'd change careers, do you have a strong stance against riders caught doping?

 

[180mmCrank]

No

I don't like needles, doctors or even funny food supplements. You'd never get me taking any of that stuff.

I have trained at altitude a number of times and to be honest while I get the theory I was never convinced that it had any significant impact on my performance.

For context and for those that don't know I competed at two Olympics (rowing not cycling) - I was good enough to make the final (top six) at World level but only medalled once. I competed against nations that had systematic doping programs (USSR, DDR, ROM, BUL etc) and was competitive against them most but not all the time.

I would never have taken PED - it just wasn't part of my thinking.

 

[fatandfast]

I would only dope 10 months out of the year so that I could spend time with somebody other than my drug dealer.Maybe vacation in Croatia with his sister

 

[3rdWheel]

Do those of you who said you would dope have a higher tolerance for riders who do, and would people who said no, or you'd change careers, do you have a strong stance against riders caught doping?

As one who said I'd change professions rather than dope, when it really comes down to it I don't care all that much if these guys dope. Ultimately it's on them morally to cheat and the potential damage to their bodies. When the Festina thing went down in 98(?), I just shrugged and said I thought most of them did that stuff. I mean most of them in all sports in general, not just cycling. I always thought that was the price of admission into that elite level of competition for most.

 

[180mmCrank]

Do those of you who said you would dope have a higher tolerance for riders who do, and would people who said no, or you'd change careers, do you have a strong stance against riders caught doping?

I am in the would not dope camp. I understand why riders do dope. I also accept that this is and always has been part of the sport. I also believe there is more being done now than ever before to push doping out of the sport. I applaud this. I expect this to be an ongoing struggle for fair few years yet... some significant things have to change in the culture of the sport... and this will take time.

In the meantime I continue to be gutted and disappointed every time another high profile rider gets caught.