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Is steel still real?

Page 6 - Get up to date with the latest news, scores & standings from the Cycling News Community.
Jul 15, 2010
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Special message for RDV4Roubaix

Crafty - but of course I took the bait.

Why would I spend 4k on a steel frame that has been cleverly designed to be a bit like the ally frame that I can get for 50 bucks????

But I will conceed that my 853 lemond was pretty good and I would think that 953 with a 1 1/8 head tube would go ok. My old colnago just feels like the tyres are a bit flat, but I know that this is partly down to quill stem, traditional wheels and largish frame.

The chances of getting the nod for anythng from my missus is pretty slim, so I have to go with what no one else wants, and for sprinting and power climbs, an old ally frame suits me sweet.

....I still ride the nag 98% of the time though...cause I'm old and fat...amoungst other things...
 
Mar 19, 2009
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fatsprintking said:
While steel is great for poncing around on and talking about “purity”, “craftsmanship” and “character” while you sip on your merlot...

This is the really simplistic sweeping generalization that most people who don't get it end up reverting to. All I have to say about that is there are many people who are racing modern steel frames to great success all over the place. These antiquated notions that somehow steel is only for those people that you pigeonhole into being some sort of elitist group because of the frame material they choose couldn't be more narrow minded, or just simply not that well thought out, basically saying something like that just to catch the ire of people who choose to ride steel and like it. Not looking to change your mind at all, you've made it clear how much you despise people who enjoy riding really nice steel race bikes, at the same time you also ride pretty nice steel, outdated as it may be. If all you can come up with that people who enjoy steel are snooty or whatever it's utterly clear that you have no idea what's available out there when it comes to steel in this day and age.

I ride steel most of the time, carbon for racing, but not all the time. Don't drink wine, I drink beer. Don't stand around with all my steel loving pals and talk about tradition, character, purity, craftsmanship, or whatever while twirling our mustaches and clinging glasses. That sounds so gay, doesn't it? What did you see recently, or in the past that makes you think people who are into steel bikes makes them so pompous?

FWIW, I rode Lookout Mtn, Genesse, and Morrison today which is about 7000+ft of climbing must have passed up about 30k worth of carbon bikes and 5k worth of aluminum while riding my steel beater. 23lb Surly Cross Check set up as a 2 speed, with 32c cross tires. Some funny responses from people when they saw what I was riding as I went passed. "Dude, your on a SS?!?!?", [me]"no, it's 2X1", "oh, that makes it much better" [shaking his head]. This guy was riding 8k worth of Wilier with Di2, and going nowhere fast slowly. Ferrous Maximus!
 
May 11, 2009
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I am seriously thinking of steel for my next road bike. In my opinion manufacturers are veering away from steel because aluminum and carbon bikes are higher profit for the same seling price. I may buy a Mercian frame on my nest trip to the UK.
 
Mar 19, 2009
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avanti said:
In my opinion manufacturers are veering away from steel because aluminum and carbon bikes are higher profit for the same seling price.

Not true, it's the other way around. Did you notice Raleigh powered back into the game a couple years ago with a whole new line up of steel bikes? Steel basically brought them back from the dead. The Mfg's aren't losing money on their steel bikes, believe me. All the mass mfg's are queuing off what all the small steel frame builders are showing off at NAHBS and EHBE, copying their designs for their own model line-ups.
 
Jun 18, 2009
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RDV4ROUBAIX said:
FWIW, I rode Lookout Mtn, Genesse, and Morrison today which is about 7000+ft of climbing must have passed up about 30k worth of carbon bikes and 5k worth of aluminum while riding my steel beater. 23lb Surly Cross Check set up as a 2 speed, with 32c cross tires. Some funny responses from people when they saw what I was riding as I went passed. "Dude, your on a SS?!?!?", [me]"no, it's 2X1", "oh, that makes it much better" [shaking his head]. This guy was riding 8k worth of Wilier with Di2, and going nowhere fast slowly. Ferrous Maximus!

And I'm guessing Jeff Gordon could drive a family sedan faster around a road race track than your average Joe could in a sports car.

You're sort of making the previous posters point about elitism by saying I can ride my 23lb Cross Check uphill faster than you can on your carbon fiber whatever. Therefore...
 
Mar 19, 2009
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richwagmn said:
And I'm guessing Jeff Gordon could drive a family sedan faster around a road race track than your average Joe could in a sports car.

You're sort of making the previous posters point about elitism by saying I can ride my 23lb Cross Check uphill faster than you can on your carbon fiber whatever. Therefore...

....point being love riding steel bikes everyday and I run into some funny sh!t. There's this woman that lives atop Lookout, and bombs the hill down to Golden on a 12 year old steel KHS mtb with her son in tow on a trail-a-bike, I could barely pass them on the way back up. Feel better? Piddy paddering about social groups, or behaviour based on equipment choice means nothing. Ride your bike! Snobby steel, carbon, aluminum bike owners? What?... :confused:
 
Mar 10, 2009
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Nice try in bringing back the spotlight on Steel.

Its now in a niche market and will be from here on out, its also over priced as most niche markets are. You can still get some local bike maker to make a steel frame if you can find them and get them off their duff. Funny thing is in my neck of the woods you only see as many steel frames as you see recumbants and magnesium frames. Yes, they ride different and some like it, much like other fads that have faded away which people still have a token replica from that era, its nice to go back in time and we can.

Not bashing steel as its bashed itself out of a truly custom market which Carbon is part of and can also be designed to ride exactly like steel, minus the weight but it can easily be added on if the extra weight is desired.

I also remember the early carbon days when the real Paris-Roubaix contenders would end up painting a steel frame just like their team sponsored carbon frames for its strength but not any more.

Its also not about being pompous or a snob, how is the average newbie to even find a steel bike or know the difference? Maybe if they dig deep but most will never do that. The ones that have ridden almost every possible frame material, well might know the difference but will still pick what their heart/pocketbook desires or even have multiple options come ride time.

When ever the custom bike show or handmade bike show is in town I see some really nice steel frames but they end up costing way too much to have a niche frame in the garage. I do like seeing them though and as any bike aficionado appreciate them as they ride by.
 
Mar 19, 2009
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ElChingon said:
I also remember the early carbon days when the real Paris-Roubaix contenders would end up painting a steel frame just like their team sponsored carbon frames for its strength but not any more.

A lot of C40's with steel forks too back then. Yeah, steel is "niche" if you're at the very top levels of racing. Any pros here? If steel is a niche so is aluminum, and also carbon. Confusing innit. :rolleyes:
 
Jul 15, 2010
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RDV4ROUBAIX said:
This is the really simplistic sweeping generalization that most people who don't get it end up reverting to. All I have to say about that is there are many people who are racing modern steel frames to great success all over the place. These antiquated notions that somehow steel is only for those people that you pigeonhole into being some sort of elitist group because of the frame material they choose couldn't be more narrow minded, or just simply not that well thought out, basically saying something like that just to catch the ire of people who choose to ride steel and like it. Not looking to change your mind at all, you've made it clear how much you despise people who enjoy riding really nice steel race bikes, at the same time you also ride pretty nice steel, outdated as it may be. If all you can come up with that people who enjoy steel are snooty or whatever it's utterly clear that you have no idea what's available out there when it comes to steel in this day and age.
RDV4ROUBAIX said:
Ok. I have stated and will state again that I actually ride steel almost exclusively . I have owned my Colnago since the mid 90’s and while it is a loyal friend and I love riding it, I see it as just a bike. It is well suited to most of my needs and it keeps on truckin so I keep riding it.

Sometimes I find the “steel is real” crew to be a bit like Alfa Romeo drivers. They talk about character and a whole lot of things which are impossible to quantify while looking past flaws which can be easily measured and understood.

I have no doubt that the best steel frame I can buy is a better bike than I can handle, and perhaps better than any bike I have ever ridden, but I cant afford one and so in a way it does belong to the elite, who will find ways of explaining their purchase by saying that it can be justified because it is better.

My main interest in the subject, both here and in my blog was to champion a material that seems to have few lovers presently, but which is accessible to almost everyone and that is aluminum. Maybe people who ride steel are not pompous (your word), but how many of them don’t look down their nose at an aluminum frame with a sense of smug superiority?

“not getting it” is something that I am getting pretty used to. I dont dispise anyone for having a nice bike.
 
Mar 19, 2009
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fatsprintking said:
Sometimes I find the “steel is real” crew to be a bit like Alfa Romeo drivers. They talk about character and a whole lot of things which are impossible to quantify while looking past flaws which can be easily measured and understood.

Where are you finding these horrible people? Is there some sort of exclusive tweed wearing, wine sipping, snooty, steal is real gentleman's club reserved only for the most dapper men and their finely handcrafted steel machines?

I'm really trying to understand where you picked this perception up that people who are into a frame material rub you so wrong. Your Colnago is nothing to sneeze at btw, that bike holds a lot of prestige amongst this terrible group of people that enjoy steel bikes. It's the most winningest steel frame in modern bike racing history, and only about 10 years removed from the pro ranks. I own one too, circa 98, but I got a threadless fork for it, and is currently waiting for a new paint job.
 
Jul 15, 2010
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RDV4ROUBAIX said:
Where are you finding these horrible people? Is there some sort of exclusive tweed wearing, wine sipping, snooty, steal is real gentleman's club reserved only for the most dapper men and their finely handcrafted steel machines?

I'm really trying to understand where you picked this perception up that people who are into a frame material rub you so wrong. Your Colnago is nothing to sneeze at btw, that bike holds a lot of prestige amongst this terrible group of people that enjoy steel bikes. It's the most winningest steel frame in modern bike racing history, and only about 10 years removed from the pro ranks. I own one too, circa 98, but I got a threadless fork for it, and is currently waiting for a new paint job.

Type "steel is real" into google and have a look.

Do you think you need to lighten up about it just a little????? You are the one that keeps using the harsh words. Myself I dont mind a wine and a little veer into the wistfull at times.

OK - I'll come clean. I have been looking for a wound up fork for my colnago. It has been painted about 5 times - the last time with spray cans - but I went all weepy for a white paintjob, white handlebar tape and san marco regal saddle.

I kind off feel like I am a little missunderstood here. After growing up on steel bikes, having owned more than I can really remember, I sometimes get a little over the stuff.

I am pretty sure I will still be riding my colnago in 15 years time. Oh I have had a lot of alfa romeo's as well.
 
Jul 15, 2010
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You would have loved the daccordi that I had before the colnago. It was a "criterium" model with steeper seat tube. A beter bike than the colnago I think.
 
Mar 19, 2009
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Yeah probably misunderstood a bit. I was gonna get all 'don't hate the player, hate the game' on you.

I did the search and found nothing that would make me think that people who are into steel bikes are in anyway elitist. Most of it's marketing, which is akin to every bike in every material, gotta sell it somehow. Marketing for all current carbon race bikes is all about aero, stiffness, and weight. Love my carbon bikes, both road and cross, but I find the marketing surrounding all the new carbon stuff to be really cheesy, dull, and utterly humorless. It's feels so NASCAR to me now. Ritte Racing being the one exception, and really the only one.
 
Jul 15, 2010
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Maybe for me its just the fact that you used to get a frame made for you as a matter of course when I was starting out as it was cheaper than buying a European freame. I had three frames made for me - I can still remember the numbers 57cm all square, 72.5 headtube and 73.5 seat tube. We worked it out by measuring up my old frame and noticing that I liked to have a slightly forward seat position. In Australia there were heaps of great frame builders who would whip you up a frame in 531c or columbus Slx. They were nice frames to.

I guess you are right it is the marketing that I am questioning. Brazing some tubes to some lugs is a skill, but the "art" part of teh equation grates me. Its perhaps more about me ey!
 
Mar 19, 2009
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fatsprintking said:
You would have loved the daccordi that I had before the colnago. It was a "criterium" model with steeper seat tube. A beter bike than the colnago I think.

Nice, I dig those Daccordis. Currently sitting on a pretty historical frame. 74 Masi GC with a twin plate crown fork, rear dropouts milled out by Mario Confente , and champagne gold repaint by Brian Baylis just a few years ago. This is going to be my "Alpha" when complete. :D
 
Mar 19, 2009
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fatsprintking said:
In Australia there were heaps of great frame builders who would whip you up a frame in 531c or columbus Slx. They were nice frames to.

I'd love to have a Malvern Star!!!
 
Jul 15, 2010
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I bought a nice malvern star a while ago for a mate of mine that is an elite level footballer and wanted something for winter training as his knees are getting close to the end. Found a huge 62 cm (he's 194cm) 80's model for 50bucks. Had a good turbo seat and nice diacompe brakes. I've told him he can stuff the bike but I want the seat back.
 
Mar 19, 2009
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Traitor Ruben f&f $499. Set up as a 1X9or10. I would ride this for sure.

Traitor_Ruben.jpg
 
Jul 4, 2010
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It's real.

I would think there were a few riders on steel bikes at the Paris Roubaix finish today although I didn't see any on the TV. The Lampre team rode steel bikes a couple of years ago and Ballan finished 3rd behind Boonen.

Last year my new road bike was going to be a steel Colnago Master. I was in the shop holding the frame but a Time RXR caught my eye. If that sounds like 2 extremes, it's not. The best italian steel frames ride like the very best carbon bikes.

Very happy with the Time but I would be just as happy on a De Rosa Neo Primato or Colnago Master.
 
Mar 13, 2009
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fatsprintking said:
Actually he would maybe be happier with a Kenevens.
Ah That is almost a Melbourne vs Sydney call LOL

Very Nice bikes, Vinnicombe rode them to his World Champion Kilo IIRC, but Pate (and Niewand) were on Hillman
CW is my default because I had one as my first real racer in 531P back in '90
 
Jul 15, 2010
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Both very nice - I tend to prefer the traditional frame of the toma though, to the sloping cinelli.

How does stainless ride?