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Joe Papp receives eight-year suspension from USADA

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Jul 14, 2009
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Botany,The last time I saw him was working for an aerospace contractor in San Diego, if I remember right. He was already done when I started. Lots of really talented track guys came from that dusty little ring
 
BotanyBay said:
Someone asked me how I knew what I knew about the '84 doping program. It's quite simple. Rolling Stone magazine did a bombshell of an article, but I think it used anonymous sources, and plenty of folks thought it was all lies. Needless to say, the racing community in the USA was abuzz following that article. Soon after, Dave Grylls showed up at my club's monthly meeting one night and (with at least 50-60 witnesses) told the story from top-to-bottom. He never asked us to keep quiet about it, and never asked us not to mention his name. He just knew that the real story needed to be told. Back then, I never thought my being a witness to this story would ever prove useful, but now I can see that it is. The cycling media tends to forget, and tends to fail to publish information that might prove unflattering to the icons they try and build / worship.

Grylls was called into a meeting of the entire US Olympic track team. Both short and long team members. They were briefed about the process and what they'd need to do. Grylls asked if it was mandatory, and more than a few did not like what they were hearing. Grylls was rather vocal that he was not going to do it. That was when everyone was told that if they wanted to ride, then they needed to be willing to blood-pack. As many of you know, meathead ended up very sick from the process and his (then) wife, Rebecca Twigg is reputed to have shown-up to race with less than stellar health. But since she silvered, no one really took another look at her.

And yes, Grylls also told us about how he pulled his foot out at the start of the final. For the record, he didn't pull his foot out. The strap broke off completely. In their almost insane drive to make everything light and streamlined, they forget to use common sense. Everyone in track racing at the time knows that the only toe-strap you could trust was an Alfredo Binda, and if you're doing track racing, that means a double-dose of Mr. Binda's straps. The USCF mechanics only outfitted the bikes with the most lightweight straps they could find. So lightweight that his broke immediately.

Very interesting back story BB. Thnx.
 
Oct 25, 2010
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I just wanted to help educate those who have the misplaced view that Eddie B somehow came from the pre-doping "Good 'ol Days" generation. The facts are that he and his crew came from the "Win at all cost" generation, and helped to train the current generation. If anything, Eddie and his cohorts instilled the attitude that truly inspired American doping culture.

The fact that he and his team felt that "So long as it wasn't illegal, it wasn't cheating" was the appropriate way to go, is direct proof.

It might not have been Eddie B's idea, but he was certainly in a position to domestically kill it (for a while, at least).
 
Jul 14, 2009
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BotanyBay said:
I just wanted to help educate those who have the misplaced view that Eddie B somehow came from the pre-doping "Good 'ol Days" generation. The facts are that he and his crew came from the "Win at all cost" generation, and helped to train the current generation. If anything, Eddie and his cohorts instilled the attitude that truly inspired American doping culture.

The fact that he and his team felt that "So long as it wasn't illegal, it wasn't cheating" was the appropriate way to go, is direct proof.

It might not have been Eddie B's idea, but he was certainly in a position to domestically kill it (for a while, at least).

wow Bot I agree with lots of stuff you say. So do we agree that Eddie is just a guy that was part of the win at any cost era? I don't see people getting down on Jens for his ex commie affiliations. The east brought us lots of stuff some good and some bad. I put Eddie B and Jens in the good column. Pravda
 
BotanyBay said:
I just wanted to help educate those who have the misplaced view that Eddie B somehow came from the pre-doping "Good 'ol Days" generation.

That's why, when he gave his little eulogy at Meat's memorial service at the San Diego vel back in July, I almost crawled out of my skin wanting to grab him by the throat and ask how he felt about Mark spending the last half of his life with hepatitis.

Eddie B. Biggest hypocrite to ever walk the face of the earth.
 
May 26, 2010
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Alpe d'Huez said:
If Armstrong and those involved in the FAA investigation cooperate the way Papp cooperated, then I agree that Lance, and the others, should not serve any time at all. It's really quite that simple.

But only if they have FULLY co operated in a similar manner to Joe Papp.

But it aint gonna happen. Armstrong is gonna fight to the bitter end.
 
May 9, 2009
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Didn't know where to post this, so it goes here...

Love how Landis gets 1-year suspended sentence for RECEIVING hacked documents...and Papp gets 3-years probation for dealing illegal drugs to 200 people.

Love how the French and US courts swing.

Love the joke, really.
 
A

Anonymous

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Joe and Floyd are both guests on Neil Roads Tour Chats sunday night. Could be very interesting. It will be archived on the website afterwards as well

http://tourchats.com/
 
Oct 25, 2010
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MacRoadie said:
That's why, when he gave his little eulogy at Meat's memorial service at the San Diego vel back in July, I almost crawled out of my skin wanting to grab him by the throat and ask how he felt about Mark spending the last half of his life with hepatitis.

Eddie B. Biggest hypocrite to ever walk the face of the earth.

Apparently I must have spent this summer under a rock. I just now learned of Mark's passing via this post.

He did a great interview on competitor radio several years ago, and I respect him for being a completely humble human being. He knew his strengths, weaknesses and shortcomings, and was always accountable for them. Few people are. Meat recognized (most importantly) that he was a human being, not a deity. If he were sitting there in the chair next to Albert Brooks and Rip Torn "Defending his life", I think it would be a short review and he'd quickly move onward.

One thing's for certain. No one ever forgot an experience with Mark Whitehead. RIP.
 
MarkvW said:
He started from a pretty low economic baseline as a lower tier pro rider. His doping, paradoxically, gave him that career, then took it away. Then he started his career as a drug dealer. That didn't make him much. Then he was busted and had to deal with the aftermath.

I don't think that he was brought down financially by the consequences of his crime. He started pretty low to begin with.

I expect Papp to try to financially profit from his notoriety. I earnestly hope he fails in that endeavor.


Mmmkay. If you say so.
 
Do some of you have any perspective in life? By many hate filled posts, apparently not. So, some grown adults taking some drugs that enhance athletic performance is somehow equated with the level of much more dangerous and heinous crimes committed in this life on Earth?

Interesting. Sad to read how many feel that some EPO or HGH is somehow the root of all evil and should be placed on the same level and consequences of "real" crime.
 
zigmeister said:
Do some of you have any perspective in life? By many hate filled posts, apparently not. So, some grown adults taking some drugs that enhance athletic performance is somehow equated with the level of much more dangerous and heinous crimes committed in this life on Earth?

Interesting. Sad to read how many feel that some EPO or HGH is somehow the root of all evil and should be placed on the same level and consequences of "real" crime.

Papp almost died from EPO use. Then he sells the stuff that almost killed him to others. That's real crime to me. No sympathy for sludgebutt here.
 
zigmeister said:
Do some of you have any perspective in life? By many hate filled posts, apparently not. So, some grown adults taking some drugs that enhance athletic performance is somehow equated with the level of much more dangerous and heinous crimes committed in this life on Earth?

Interesting. Sad to read how many feel that some EPO or HGH is somehow the root of all evil and should be placed on the same level and consequences of "real" crime.

So, EPO related death isn't a real crime?

Giving kids a lifetime of medical complications because the team motto is 'dope or leave' isn't a real crime?

Selling controlled substances is not a real crime?

Get that evil government off my back so everyone (really just me) can be Free!!! What a glorious society. Kids dying of EPO induced heart attacks. Millions of dollars in medical procedures trying to keep your one doped-up body working right. Maybe a little rage-fueled family violence from the hormones. All of those things really happened to people using PED's. All of them. Oh, but we're Free... Right?

This freedom ends up costing the rest of us quite a bit more than what you paid for a couple of PED fueled racing years and maybe a few years of looking younger from anti-aging treatments.
 
May 26, 2010
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DirtyWorks said:
So, EPO related death isn't a real crime?

Giving kids a lifetime of medical complications because the team motto is 'dope or leave' isn't a real crime?

Selling controlled substances is not a real crime?

Get that evil government off my back so everyone (really just me) can be Free!!! What a glorious society. Kids dying of EPO induced heart attacks. Millions of dollars in medical procedures trying to keep your one doped-up body working right. Maybe a little rage-fueled family violence from the hormones. All of those things really happened to people using PED's. All of them. Oh, but we're Free... Right?

This freedom ends up costing the rest of us quite a bit more than what you paid for a couple of PED fueled racing years and maybe a few years of looking younger from anti-aging treatments.

Agree with all of the above and Papp should be giving anti doping lecturers to sports colleges and sporting clubs as part of his punishment, he'd doing it anyway if he wanted to really make a difference.

One of things Bassons has done was to become a teacher and teach. He now works for the ministry of youth and sport at Bordeaux, in charge of drug tests Maybe Papp should consider something similar?
 
DirtyWorks said:
So, EPO related death isn't a real crime?

Giving kids a lifetime of medical complications because the team motto is 'dope or leave' isn't a real crime?

Selling controlled substances is not a real crime?

Get that evil government off my back so everyone (really just me) can be Free!!! What a glorious society. Kids dying of EPO induced heart attacks. Millions of dollars in medical procedures trying to keep your one doped-up body working right. Maybe a little rage-fueled family violence from the hormones. All of those things really happened to people using PED's. All of them. Oh, but we're Free... Right?

This freedom ends up costing the rest of us quite a bit more than what you paid for a couple of PED fueled racing years and maybe a few years of looking younger from anti-aging treatments.

As much as your sentiment might be right, you sound like a 30's propaganda film.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reefer_Madness
 
thehog said:

saddles has always taken a weird stance on doping.

i tried to watch these interviews the other day but couldn't. i had to start skipping ahead b/c it was excruciatingly dull. neither landis or papp have much to add anymore. i hope the both of them find some success outside of cycling but i think they've said everything there is to say and their shtick is totally worn out.