Jonas Vingegaard: Something is Rotten

[Cookster15]

his interview at Le Lioran was really well done, I think. in a way i was also "happy" to see him break down in tears on Isola - it was really the first time he had lost the Tour (not counting his debut year) and it's nice to see that, discounting any Clinic aspects, that the race still means a great deal to riders.

Yes, I felt similar sympathy. I think him breaking down was symptomatic of the pressure he felt as two time defending champion and also his team getting fully behind him. I am not a Vingegaard fan but he was expected to do the impossible. Not just beat a rampant Pogacar but to reach a higher level just three months after massive injuries.

 

[ElDesordenado]

Yes, I felt similar sympathy. I think him breaking down was symptomatic of the pressure he felt as two time defending champion and also his team getting fully behind him. I am not a Vingegaard fan but he was expected to do the impossible. Not just beat a rampant Pogacar but to reach a higher level just three months after massive injuries.

It was also the first time in several years that things didn't go according to plan for him. He'd just been improving and improving, and his team seemed in control. Suddenly all that planning went out the window

 

[Cookster15]

It was also the first time in several years that things didn't go according to plan for him. He'd just been improving and improving, and his team seemed in control. Suddenly all that planning went out the window

Yes. He and Visma were forced to confront bad luck. Like Pogacar after LBL last year.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

Yes, I felt similar sympathy. I think him breaking down was symptomatic of the pressure he felt as two time defending champion and also his team getting fully behind him. I am not a Vingegaard fan but he was expected to do the impossible. Not just beat a rampant Pogacar but to reach a higher level just three months after massive injuries.

Vingo should definitely become more liked following this Tour, he showed human side. I warmed to him as well - not necessarily after this stage, more like big respect for overcoming difficulties, appearing in the Tour in great shape and making the race more interesting.

 

[ElDesordenado]

Vingo should definitely become more liked following this Tour, he showed human side. I warmed to him as well - not necessarily after this stage, more like big respect for overcoming difficulties, appearing in the Tour in great shape and making the race more interesting.

I understand that, although I suppose from a clinic perspective - now that we're in this part of the forum - this year's Vinge performance should get the alarm bells ringing as loudly as last year's ITT. Coming back from the ICU in the course of a few months and putting out his best numbers ever. In that sense, he's lucky that Pog stole the headlines this year; otherwise Vinge would have looked grotesquely good, even to the most blindly enthusiastic spectators ie the Danish TV2 Tour coverage.

 

[Rechtschreibfehler]

I understand that, although I suppose from a clinic perspective - now that we're in this part of the forum - this year's Vinge performance should get the alarm bells ringing as loudly as last year's ITT. Coming back from the ICU in the course of a few months and putting out his best numbers ever. In that sense, he's lucky that Pog stole the headlines this year; otherwise Vinge would have looked grotesquely good, even to the most blindly enthusiastic spectators ie the Danish TV2 Tour coverage.

The way things seems to stand right now, I am not so sure about this. The sport is clean now, there are almost no doping cases anymore (compared to what used to be), the science has improved soo much (again and again, after at least the last times with Armstrong and Sky) And so it goes.. So it's all for real, the numbers can be celebrated. There seems to be near zero awareness other than some obligatory questions. They may be raised but there are ready made answers to make them go away, to use them as a form of reassurance that everything is in order, rather than to use them as a critical instrument.
So I am really not sure if Vingegaard wouldn't have turned into a miracle story to fuel the myth of cycling. A triumph of the will over the body, a remarkable feat of work, dedication and superior training methods.

 

[Krzysztof_O]

The sport is clean now

 

[Froome]

I understand that, although I suppose from a clinic perspective - now that we're in this part of the forum - this year's Vinge performance should get the alarm bells ringing as loudly as last year's ITT. Coming back from the ICU in the course of a few months and putting out his best numbers ever. In that sense, he's lucky that Pog stole the headlines this year; otherwise Vinge would have looked grotesquely good, even to the most blindly enthusiastic spectators ie the Danish TV2 Tour coverage.

If he didn't had the injuries in April, he would be around 7 w/kg in 40 minutes during the Tour, and i can safely say this when i see guys like Landa improving as much or more than him this year with 34 years and witha inferior doping programm, plus the fact i never said Vingegaard was clean.

In the spring he already did a good jump in terms of level comparing to the previous year.

What i didn't expected was Pogacar doing 6.8 w/kg in 40 minutes, but after seeing the improvement of other guys like Landa and Gee, plus the fact UAE has a lot of money and resources to do a good doping programm, then it makes all the sense in the world the perfomances he did.

 

[SHAD0W93]

If he didn't had the injuries in April, he would be around 7 w/kg in 40 minutes during the Tour, and i can safely say this when i see guys like Landa improving as much or more than him this year with 34 years and witha inferior doping programm, plus the fact i never said Vingegaard was clean.

In the spring he already did a good jump in terms of level comparing to the previous year.

What i didn't expected was Pogacar doing 6.8 w/kg in 40 minutes, but after seeing the improvement of other guys like Landa and Gee, plus the fact UAE has a lot of money and resources to do a good doping programm, then it makes all the sense in the world the perfomances he did.

We were told Pogacar would be better, he was focusing on long climbs, and he has looked better all year. Without the injury Vinge and Pog are most likely similar and if both have zero problems next year they’ll probably be pushing even higher numbers.

 

[velaso montador]

We were told Pogacar would be better, he was focusing on long climbs, and he has looked better all year. Without the injury Vinge and Pog are most likely similar and if both have zero problems next year they’ll probably be pushing even higher numbers.

Thats just wishful thinking and thats okei of course but not much else. There actually isnt much problem to reach top shape in 3months theres plenty of evidence look no further than Crass this year, crashed same time argueable worse and top form in Tour.

There is so many cases that its no problem getting in top shape in that span the problem is time and the super rest in between which time stopped him from which lays the base for the 3 week, thats it nothing else.

Vingegaard will have the same coach he has had in Tim Heemskerk AND the same program he has had so its only a .... hope I would say but who knows but far from certain and most likely not that he can gain that much cause the leap is huge lets not kid ourself -- its even more logical Pogacar would just increase it with only 1 year in with new coach, program and he is younger still only 25.

He is also tapped out in kg to lose semi. Just the bottom line. It is what it is I would look out for Evenpoel more if I was Vingegaard. But ofc course can always dream nothing wrong with that.

 

[ElDesordenado]

Vingegaard will have the same coach he has had in Tim Heemskerk AND the same program he has had so its only a .... hope I would say but who knows but far from certain and most likely not that he can gain that much cause the leap is huge lets not kid ourself -- its even more logical Pogacar would just increase it with only 1 year in with new coach, program and he is younger still only 25.

Pogacar said we'll probably see even higher numbers next year, and more records being broken. So I guess the arms race is full on! Who'll be willing to take it to the most extreme? Who's willing to take the biggest risks? And who responds the best?

He is also tapped out in kg to lose semi. Just the bottom line. It is what it is I would look out for Evenpoel more if I was Vingegaard. But ofc course can always dream nothing wrong with that.

I certainly hope Vingegaard doesn't lose more weight. He already looks almost transparent and weirdly frail.

Evenepoel, I agree, will probably come back even stronger next year. He seemed like a transformed rider compared to the guy who rode the Vuelta last year. It's still quite a step up to match Vingegaard's level this year, but if this is only the beginning of the Evenepoel transformation, he could become a serious TdF contender.

 

[Netserk]

Vingegaard was too lean this year because of the loss of muscle mass due to his hospital stay. He will be heavier and more powerful next year.

 

[Froome]

Vingegaard was too lean this year because of the loss of muscle mass due to his hospital stay. He will be heavier and more powerful next year.

In reality, it doesn't make any sense someone saying he was better this year, when he was rolling worse, descending worse, and lost a lot of explosion due to the loss of muscle mass.

 

[Netserk]

In reality, it doesn't make any sense someone saying he was better this year, when he was rolling worse, descending worse, and lost a lot of explosion due to the loss of muscle mass.

He was better fuelled this year, so he could climb faster despite that.

 

[Froome]

He was better fuelled this year, so he could climb faster despite that.

He was faster only in two climbs. Couillole and Plateau de beille.

In the other ones he was slower than last year. Overall he was clearly worse than last year, in all areas.

 

[James M]

In reality, it doesn't make any sense someone saying he was better this year, when he was rolling worse, descending worse, and lost a lot of explosion due to the loss of muscle mass.

Didnt you say he would win the Tour too? I think you just continue on your bad take imo. Its not someone saying he is better than last year its he himself and numbers never lie

"It's true that I'm climbing at my best level ever. But if someone is better, you have to accept that,"

"I'm climbing at my best level ever... I'm not going to give up without a fight" - Jonas Vingegaard insists Tadej Pogacar isn't much better at 2024 Tour de France

Jonas Vingegaard has silenced a lot of doubters in the opening two weeks of the 2024 Tour de France. After concerns over his health and fitness following a nasty crash at the Itzulia Basque Country ea...

cyclinguptodate.com

 

[Salvarani]

Biggest cheater of all time this guy

Hospital to 2nd in Tour? Crazy

And that is after the most doped performance of all time in Combloux a year earlier

Dude had no results as a junior. NONE

Worked in a factory. Just insane.

 

[AmRacer]

Biggest cheater of all time this guy

Hospital to 2nd in Tour? Crazy

And that is after the most doped performance of all time in Combloux a year earlier

Dude had no results as a junior. NONE

Worked in a factory. Just insane.

Denmark is famous for its high mountains.

 

[Salvarani]

Denmark is famous for its high mountains.

They eat a lot of Riis for breakfast. Must be that which make them so strong to climb out of a hospital bed and climb mountains.

Apparently, fish factories are also great training facilities for a rider.

 

[pastronef]

Denmark is famous for its high mountains.

Netherlands too. a few Dutch riders won Grand Tours

 

[Salvarani]

Netherlands too. a few Dutch riders won Grand Tours

Heinekens give you wings as well

 

[pastronef]

They eat a lot of Riis for breakfast. Must be that which make them so strong to climb out of a hospital bed and climb mountains.

Apparently, fish factories are also great training facilities for a rider.

Salva, I'd say Pogacar and Vingegaard fans should avoid their respective threads because the smearing posts become useless and pathetic at some point

 

[Salvarani]

Salva, I'd say Pogacar and Vingegaard fans should avoid their respective threads because the smearing posts become useless and pathetic at some point

This whole section is pretty pathetic tbf.

But anyway, Vingegaard is the biggest doper I have ever seen. Good that there is place we can discuss that.

 

[ashhutch1997]

Biggest cheater of all time this guy

Hospital to 2nd in Tour? Crazy

And that is after the most doped performance of all time in Combloux a year earlier

Dude had no results as a junior. NONE

Worked in a factory. Just insane.

His miraculous recovery to come 2nd in the Tour was hilarious and completely defied logic, he was just very lucky that Pogacar's mutant performances took all the limelight.
Although I agree, the Combloux performance was an absolute farce, that was one day, Pogacar does performances close to that on almost every race day this year..
Also, riders develop at different speeds, not all riders burst onto the scene as juniors.

 

[snipeheem]

They will be in the lab all fall/winter to up the dosage for this guy. They only brought him to his best level ever straight from the hospital bed this season. All time doper this guy Vinge.

And he came from nowhere, he was nobody couple years ago…