Jonas Vingegaard: Something is Rotten

[Froome]

Vingegaard was too lean this year because of the loss of muscle mass due to his hospital stay. He will be heavier and more powerful next year.

In reality, it doesn't make any sense someone saying he was better this year, when he was rolling worse, descending worse, and lost a lot of explosion due to the loss of muscle mass.

 

[Netserk]

In reality, it doesn't make any sense someone saying he was better this year, when he was rolling worse, descending worse, and lost a lot of explosion due to the loss of muscle mass.

He was better fuelled this year, so he could climb faster despite that.

 

[Froome]

He was better fuelled this year, so he could climb faster despite that.

He was faster only in two climbs. Couillole and Plateau de beille.

In the other ones he was slower than last year. Overall he was clearly worse than last year, in all areas.

 

[Salvarani]

Biggest cheater of all time this guy

Hospital to 2nd in Tour? Crazy

And that is after the most doped performance of all time in Combloux a year earlier

Dude had no results as a junior. NONE

Worked in a factory. Just insane.

 

[AmRacer]

Biggest cheater of all time this guy

Hospital to 2nd in Tour? Crazy

And that is after the most doped performance of all time in Combloux a year earlier

Dude had no results as a junior. NONE

Worked in a factory. Just insane.

Denmark is famous for its high mountains.

 

[Salvarani]

Denmark is famous for its high mountains.

They eat a lot of Riis for breakfast. Must be that which make them so strong to climb out of a hospital bed and climb mountains.

Apparently, fish factories are also great training facilities for a rider.

 

[pastronef]

Denmark is famous for its high mountains.

Netherlands too. a few Dutch riders won Grand Tours

 

[Salvarani]

Netherlands too. a few Dutch riders won Grand Tours

Heinekens give you wings as well

 

[pastronef]

They eat a lot of Riis for breakfast. Must be that which make them so strong to climb out of a hospital bed and climb mountains.

Apparently, fish factories are also great training facilities for a rider.

Salva, I'd say Pogacar and Vingegaard fans should avoid their respective threads because the smearing posts become useless and pathetic at some point

 

[Salvarani]

Salva, I'd say Pogacar and Vingegaard fans should avoid their respective threads because the smearing posts become useless and pathetic at some point

This whole section is pretty pathetic tbf.

But anyway, Vingegaard is the biggest doper I have ever seen. Good that there is place we can discuss that.

 

[ashhutch1997]

Biggest cheater of all time this guy

Hospital to 2nd in Tour? Crazy

And that is after the most doped performance of all time in Combloux a year earlier

Dude had no results as a junior. NONE

Worked in a factory. Just insane.

His miraculous recovery to come 2nd in the Tour was hilarious and completely defied logic, he was just very lucky that Pogacar's mutant performances took all the limelight.
Although I agree, the Combloux performance was an absolute farce, that was one day, Pogacar does performances close to that on almost every race day this year..
Also, riders develop at different speeds, not all riders burst onto the scene as juniors.

 

[snipeheem]

They will be in the lab all fall/winter to up the dosage for this guy. They only brought him to his best level ever straight from the hospital bed this season. All time doper this guy Vinge.

And he came from nowhere, he was nobody couple years ago…

 

[TrekCyclist]

Pogacar / UAE are probably extremely grateful, Vingegaard is around. Just imagine, without Vingegaard - Pogacar would have won all TdF since 2020 with absurd margins and countless stages. Would probably put them under much more pressure to justify this kind of performance, and would be extremely difficult....

 

[meat puppet]

Forcats de la fish factory, baby.

 

[Red Rick]

Pogacar / UAE are probably extremely grateful, Vingegaard is around. Just imagine, without Vingegaard - Pogacar would have won all TdF since 2020 with absurd margins and countless stages. Would probably put them under much more pressure to justify this kind of performance, and would be extremely difficult....

The live radio call moment of him dropping on Loze gave so many a fake ass sense of relatability

 

[snipeheem]

Had to be something real strong they must have given him to go from absolutely nowhere. From a fishing factory they just pulled this guy from. Unbelievable.

Then what they must have given him to be able to rise from the hospital to perform like he did in the Tour?! His best level ever?! Like cmon. Cant be healthy at all.

Just insane. Most ridiculous and doped cyclist of all time.

100% truth , no one is even close to him when it comes to doping

 

[snipeheem]

Yup, he is a guy from a fishing factory with zero talent that has been filled up to the brim with stuff we cant even imagine.

His coach said before the tour that he can do 6,7w/kg for 35min. Like wtf he climbs on Pantani lvl or even stronger and he was nobody in junior/pros untill Visma fuel him

 

[E_F_]

Jonas certainly takes stuff he shouldn't give his daughter, and I suspect he wouldn't either. I don't spend too much time thinking about him at the moment. Because he's not racing, and he hasn't dominated a race since Tirreno... I'll pop into this thread once O Gran Camino rolls around, okay?

 

[Salvarani]

His coach said before the tour that he can do 6,7w/kg for 35min. Like wtf he climbs on Pantani lvl or even stronger and he was nobody in junior/pros untill Visma fuel him

Yup it is insane.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

I have just posted this in the Pogacar clinic thread: same applies here.

people here are discussing the intricacies of human performance, the arms race, and the communicating vessels of cycling's doping industry, rather than flailing their arms around while they shout "oh yeah? well your guy is worse" "no he's not!" "is too!" at the top of their lungs

AS MODERATOR
Thankfully, there is some of what you describe first. There is also a desperate amount of the other, meaning that attempts at sensible discussion are in danger of being drowned out.

A reminder of a selection from forum rules, stickied at the top of this section:

Please do...

• Keep criticism constructive! If you disagree with an opinion, explain why, but never attack the person.
• Search the site and/or forum before posting. Someone else may have already answered your question or discussed the topic. Checking for duplicates can help save you time.

Please don't...

• Be rude or impolite. Civility is compulsory here, and remember that behind each user is a real person. Personal attacks are not allowed against other members, staff, or moderators.
• Post empty threads, throwaway comments, or responses that contain no content. Don't bump posts, claim "First!" or give single-word replies.

Specific Rules

The following activity is expressly disallowed within our community:

• Harassment, threatening, embarrassing or insulting other users,
• Trolling, defined as knowingly soliciting strong negative responses simply for shock value, and disruption of the natural flow of discussion through vulgarity, spamming, flooding or other means.

We thank you for your cooperation and support in this, and if you have any questions, suggestions or feedback regarding the Rules of Conduct, please contact a Moderator or Community Staff.

And, in full, the clinic specific supplement to the rules

Amendment to Forum Rules for Discussions in The Clinic

• Discussion or speculation of professional cyclist use of performance enhancers or banned substances should include supporting evidence.
• Users are required to provide evidence when challenged, as well as engaging with arguments counter to the assertion with substantive facts and references.
• Remember that the subject of speculation and discussion on this matter are human beings deserving of respect and dignity.
• We ask that you keep discourse within expectations of these guidelines to ensure a healthy community for this topic.

Thank you for your understanding and compliance!

And back to the general rules for this one:

• Report violators of the Rules of Conduct to the Moderation Team by clicking the "Report" button or “Flag as inappropriate” option on the comment.

which I take as do not make accusations against each other here.


I would like to see what Hrotha descries as discussion of "the intricacies of human performance, the arms race, and the communicating vessels of cycling's doping industry", I'm sure most would. To enable and declutter that, I shall be taking a no-nonsense application of the rules above in regard to those who, again to quote Hrotha, prefer "flailing their arms around while they shout "oh yeah? well your guy is worse" "no he's not!" "is too!""

If you believe that you could be thought to be in that latter group, consider yourselves warned.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

In view of the third bullet point in the clinic specific rules, I have changed the title of this thread.

 

[E_F_]

In view of the third bullet point in the clinic specific rules, I have changed the title of this thread.

Perhaps - for maximum even handedness - it should be called "Jonas Vingegaard and Rabobank"

 

[Nick2413]

I have just posted this in the Pogacar clinic thread: same applies here.


AS MODERATOR
Thankfully, there is some of what you describe first. There is also a desperate amount of the other, meaning that attempts at sensible discussion are in danger of being drowned out.

A reminder of a selection from forum rules, stickied at the top of this section:

And, in full, the clinic specific supplement to the rules

• Discussion or speculation of professional cyclist use of performance enhancers or banned substances should include supporting evidence.
• Users are required to provide evidence when challenged, as well as engaging with arguments counter to the assertion with substantive facts and references.

Technically isn’t it impossible to speculate at all without breaking these 2, since there is no proven evidence?

 

[Netserk]

In view of the third bullet point in the clinic specific rules, I have changed the title of this thread.

What is disrespectful about calling him Godzilla (who is the king of monsters) in the clinic? Talk of mutants is common parlance here (and has been for over a decade: https://www.chronoswatts.com/img/mag/notnormal.pdf), and if anything comparing him to the most badass and strongest manga creature was respectfully meant as praise. Godzilla is awesome.

In any case, I hate the dull clutter of appending "clinic thread" to the title.

 

[Armchair Cyclist]

What is disrespectful about calling him Godzilla (who is the king of monsters) in the clinic? Talk of mutants is common parlance here (and has been for over a decade: https://www.chronoswatts.com/img/mag/notnormal.pdf), and if anything comparing him to the most badass and strongest manga creature was respectfully meant as praise. Godzilla is awesome.

In any case, I hate the dull clutter of appending "clinic thread" to the title.

Per the rule I quoted, that is not treating someone as deserving of respect and dignity. But I 'm happy to go with what you have put in since.