Juan Ayuso discussion thread

[Tim Cahill]

Health comes first. Better to abandon, rest and refocus on the next goal of sabotaging pocagar's tour de france

I've been planting some 'Ayuso to the Tour propaganda' around in the hopes that we can cyberbully UAE management into doing so, the 'Roglic to Flanders' campaign is on temporary hiatus.

 

[ice&fire]

Nevermind he's climbed off. Modern riders are too soft! Sean Kelly would win the stage with one eye

Purito won one (Peña Cabarga 2010), but he was stung during that stage

 

[AlfaLum]

Good decision, with the legs he is having he will not be much help to del Toro anyway. At least he tried it.

People are too hard for these Young guys. He has been labeled an extreme talent since he was a teenager, and he has always had to deal with very high expectations.

On such a young age is only normal that you have some lessons to learn, and I think Ayuso has learned a lesson of teamwork over the last year from the way he talks. Too bad that he cannot show it in real life due to such a bad shape and injuries.

 

[Samu Cuenca]

Nevermind he's climbed off. Modern riders are too soft! Sean Kelly would win the stage with one eye

Yes, Marcel Wüst was cycling's first weakling.

 

[QueenStagiaire]

Yes, Marcel Wüst was cycling's first weakling.

It‘s a huge disadvantage, Bini Girmay would have won all five monuments if not for his Champagne incident

 

[jmdirt]

I'm suprised he's been allowed to continue, if I remember correctly Jonathan Vaughters had to abandon the TDF for the same thing.

JV had to abandon because he took banned meds for his sting (or maybe abandoned so that he could take the meds).

 

[Berniece]

Pogacar fanbase probably still feel he should have helped Del Toro

 

[Peyroteo94]

Mayo said everything. If he stays in the race and help Del Toro, he will shut down all the criticism around him.

We have an answer and I was right. Selfish rider.

 

[AmRacer]

Pogacar fanbase probably still feel he should have helped Del Toro

Not only Pog fans, but many others as well would like Ayuso helping Del Toro at earlier stages.

Ayuso fans and Del Toro haters disagree, of course.

 

[Rackham]

Imagine watching modern pro-cycling from a moralist (& very selectively moralist) standpoint? lol

I remember Geraint Thomas still talking about that time Froomey attacked him in the 2018 TdF when he was in yellow.

Now that's a betrayal. Ayuso meanwhile did what? Struggled to do a turn for Pog on the Galibier when Almeida was waving his arms around? It seems pretty weak as a reason to hate the guy.

 

[Salvarani]

Imagine watching modern pro-cycling from a moralist (& very selectively moralist) standpoint? lol

I remember Geraint Thomas still talking about that time Froomey attacked him in the 2018 TdF when he was in yellow.

Now that's a betrayal. Ayuso meanwhile did what? Struggled to do a turn for Pog on the Galibier when Almeida was waving his arms around? It seems pretty weak as a reason to hate the guy.

He refused and did not want to help the team. Of course Almeida was frustrated seeing this.

It is not hateful to point that out. Dont generalise and spread false narratives.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Imagine watching modern pro-cycling from a moralist (& very selectively moralist) standpoint? lol

I remember Geraint Thomas still talking about that time Froomey attacked him in the 2018 TdF when he was in yellow.

Now that's a betrayal. Ayuso meanwhile did what? Struggled to do a turn for Pog on the Galibier when Almeida was waving his arms around? It seems pretty weak as a reason to hate the guy.

He wasn't struggling at all. He finished Galibier in front of Roglic and he didn't want to cooperate when Yates wasn't even working.

 

[greyclouds]

Pogacar fanbase probably still feel he should have helped Del Toro

He should have DNS today after the sting and should have DNF already if his knee was that bad - but how bad was it when we saw him at the front of the peloton chasing Del Toro just a few days ago?

 

[Rackham]

He refused and did not want to help the team. Of course Almeida was frustrated seeing this.

It is not hateful to point that out. Dont generalise and spread false narratives.

He wasn't struggling at all. He finished Galibier in front of Roglic and he didn't want to cooperate when Yates wasn't even working.

I salute his selfishness then.

Seriously, before anyone says "ah but you're a hypocrite because what if he did that to Rog.." Rog isn't Pog. Rog needs all the help he can get. Pog meanwhile... nah. I find it slightly funny that Pog's fans get so salty over Ayuso not dying out there for Pog when they're also constantly boasting 24/7 about how Pog is the GOAT.

And let's be super honest here: interpretation of moral right and wrong in cycling is heavily biased. I've heard and seen it all. I saw an army of Froome fans screaming at Wiggins and Sky for not allowing Froomey to ride off and win the Tour in 2012 (even when he didn't actually stand a chance because Wiggins walloped him in the ITT's).

So yeah, 'betrayal' is subjective. It's also dependent on the severity of the issue. Which means is the teammate 'at fault' trying to seriously undermine the GC leader yes or no. The most you could accuse Ayuso of is riding for his own GC placing. Well behind Pog.

 

[Salvarani]

I salute his selfishness then.

Seriously, before anyone says "ah but you're a hypocrite because what if he did that to Rog.." Rog isn't Pog. Rog needs all the help he can get. Pog meanwhile... nah. I find it slightly funny that Pog's fans get so salty over Ayuso not dying out there for Pog when they're also constantly boasting 24/7 about how Pog is the GOAT.

And let's be super honest here: interpretation of moral right and wrong in cycling is heavily biased. I've heard and seen it all. I saw an army of Froome fans screaming at Wiggins and Sky for not allowing Froomey to ride off and win the Tour in 2012 (even when he didn't actually stand a chance because Wiggins walloped him in the ITT's).

So yeah, 'betrayal' is subjective. It's also dependent on the severity of the issue. Which means is the teammate 'at fault' trying to seriously undermine the GC leader yes or no. The most you could accuse Ayuso of is riding for his own GC placing. Well behind Pog.

This only feels like you are very salty about Pog. No point in discussing anything more after you are exposing that, as it wont be an objective conversation about Ayuso actions affecting the team. As it is clear he didnt obey team orders and his teammates being frustrated with him because of it.

 

[Peyroteo94]

I salute his selfishness then.

Seriously, before anyone says "ah but you're a hypocrite because what if he did that to Rog.." Rog isn't Pog. Rog needs all the help he can get. Pog meanwhile... nah. I find it slightly funny that Pog's fans get so salty over Ayuso not dying out there for Pog when they're also constantly boasting 24/7 about how Pog is the GOAT.

And let's be super honest here: interpretation of moral right and wrong in cycling is heavily biased. I've heard and seen it all. I saw an army of Froome fans screaming at Wiggins and Sky for not allowing Froomey to ride off and win the Tour in 2012 (even when he didn't actually stand a chance because Wiggins walloped him in the ITT's).

So yeah, 'betrayal' is subjective. It's also dependent on the severity of the issue. Which means is the teammate 'at fault' trying to seriously undermine the GC leader yes or no. The most you could accuse Ayuso of is riding for his own GC placing. Well behind Pog.

This is where you are wrong. I don't like Ayuso because I am a fan of Pogacar. I don't like Ayuso because I am a fan of Almeida. What he did in the Tour is the reason we (portuguese fans in general) almost despise him. You go to a cycling portuguese forum or eurosport portugal on Facebook and almost everyone hates him.

 

[AmRacer]

I salute his selfishness then.

Seriously, before anyone says "ah but you're a hypocrite because what if he did that to Rog.." Rog isn't Pog. Rog needs all the help he can get. Pog meanwhile... nah. I find it slightly funny that Pog's fans get so salty over Ayuso not dying out there for Pog when they're also constantly boasting 24/7 about how Pog is the GOAT.

And let's be super honest here: interpretation of moral right and wrong in cycling is heavily biased. I've heard and seen it all. I saw an army of Froome fans screaming at Wiggins and Sky for not allowing Froomey to ride off and win the Tour in 2012 (even when he didn't actually stand a chance because Wiggins walloped him in the ITT's).

So yeah, 'betrayal' is subjective. It's also dependent on the severity of the issue. Which means is the teammate 'at fault' trying to seriously undermine the GC leader yes or no. The most you could accuse Ayuso of is riding for his own GC placing. Well behind Pog.

Ayuso wants to be captain, he doesn't want to work for someone else, Pogi, Toro etc. He wants a team dedicated to him only. That's fine, but he won't get that riding for UAE.

It's simple as that. Pog haters don't get it.

 

[Peyroteo94]

This only feels like you are very salty about Pog. No point in discussing anything more after you are exposing that, as it wont be an objective conversation about Ayuso actions affecting the team. As it is clear he didnt obey team orders and his teammates being frustrated with him because of it.

And of course Salvarani is right. Team orders are team orders, it doesn't matter if it's Roglic or Pog the leader.

 

[AmRacer]

And of course Salvarani is right. Team orders are team orders, it doesn't matter if it's Roglic or Pog the leader.

Or Del Toro.

 

[Rackham]

This only feels like you are very salty about Pog. No point in discussing anything more after you are exposing that, as it wont be an objective conversation about Ayuso actions affecting the team.

You have to wonder though how this villainous Ayuso keeps on getting the favors of Gianetti and UAE.

You know, Pog's actual bosses. It's like... maybe the team just sees things differently than hardcore fanboys do who're getting their 'insider' scoops from mou on social media.

This is where you are wrong. I don't like Ayuso because I am a fan of Pogacar. I don't like Ayuso because I am a fan of Almeida. What he did in the Tour is the reason we (portuguese fans in general) almost despise him. You go to a cycling portuguese forum or eurosport portugal on Facebook and almost everyone hates him.

Of course some of the Portuguese 'hate Ayuso'. The same way some Belgians hate on Rog since Imola 2020.

Chauvinism is endemic in cycling. That's not a critique btw, it's a statement of fact. People get very easily riled up at perceived insults and betrayals. That has been true in cycling for a very, very long time.

 

[Salvarani]

You have to wonder though how this villainous Ayuso keeps on getting the favors of Gianetti and UAE.

You know, Pog's actual bosses. It's like... maybe the team just sees things differently than hardcore fanboys do who're getting their 'insider' scoops from mou on social media.

Why are you so obsessed with Pog? You seem to have a problem about him and other posters more than anything else here.

We are only talking about Ayuso in here and his actions. You are trying to make it about something else and going at other posters for absolutely no reason.

Ayuso let his team and teammates down in the Tour last year. They were visibly frustrated with him in Almeida case. Objectively this is what transpired.

Ayuso is a young and very talented rider. Of course he will get more opportunities to redeem himself. His ceiling is still high and he has currently a few years left on his contract with the team, unless something happens. Unless they have a big fallout... he will continue with them and they will work on things.

 

[Peyroteo94]

Why are you so obsessed with Pog? You seem to have a problem about him and other posters more than anything else here.

We are only talking about Ayuso in here and his actions. You are trying to make it about something else and going at other posters for absolutely no reason.

Ayuso let his team and teammates down in the Tour last year. They were visibly frustrated with him in Almeida case. Objectively this is what transpired.

Ayuso is a young and very talented rider. Of course he will get more opportunities to redeem himself. His ceiling is still high and he has currently a few years left on his contract with the team, unless something happens. Unless they have a big fallout... he will continue with them and they will work on things.

Don't forget Yates's post race interview. These are facts but he is trying to blame us (Pogacar fans) for overreaction.

"I had to do my job early cause some guys weren't in position" - Adam Yates hints at Juan Ayuso's tactics on Galibier

Adam Yates' performance on the Galibier climb was more than disappointing and this morning before the race he wanted to blame his teammate Juan Ayuso for being left early. Surprisingly, he didn't spen...

cyclinguptodate.com

 

[fenns]

Difficult to understand why he was continuing the race if he had a problem with his knee.

 

[Brullnux]

We have an answer and I was right. Selfish rider.

He can't see man

 

[Extinction]

You have to wonder though how this villainous Ayuso keeps on getting the favors of Gianetti and UAE.

You know, Pog's actual bosses. It's like... maybe the team just sees things differently than hardcore fanboys do who're getting their 'insider' scoops from mou on social media.



Of course some of the Portuguese 'hate Ayuso'. The same way some Belgians hate on Rog since Imola 2020.

Chauvinism is endemic in cycling. That's not a critique btw, it's a statement of fact. People get very easily riled up at perceived insults and betrayals. That has been true in cycling for a very, very long time.

I personally think it just has to do with expecting to race for himself, even when he's not the strongest (and then refuses to help). Anybody that has raced on a team knows this is not an endearing quality.