Kimmage unleashes hell, counter-sues Verbruggen & McQuaid

[Scott SoCal]

I don't know this Aaron Brown guy from a hole in the ground (is he a cyclist?) but if he was hoping to hitch his fortunes to the cycling world I think that is pretty much finished now.

Going back and re-reading his "As not seen on tv" article in 2r is interesting. He goes into detail about merchandising... different, outside the box thinking to increase revenue streams to the teams.

Interesting he never brings up embezzlement (allegedly) as an additional revenue source. His newest article in 2r is titled "Suspension of Disbelief." It's about McQuaid and the need for change at the UCI for all of the obvious reasons.

So why would he torpedo the backing of the guy front and center in the effort to clean up the UCI and by extension pro cycling?

Edit: let's hope AB is on the up and up. At this point it's probably wishful thinking.

From Velonation...

With no guarantee that he would have access to funds, Kimmage felt he had only one course of action. “Basically I was left with no choice but to call my lawyer and say ‘that’s it, stop,” he said, referring to his criminal complaint against two top UCI names. “I couldn't do anything else.

“It could be that the money is still there. If so, that is great, but what if it is not? I am still going to have to pay the bills at the end of the day. So I told him to stop.”

The irony here is impossible to ignore.

Here is a pretty god summary as of yesterday ;

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/14498/Feature-The-many-questions-about-the-Kimmage-defence-fund.aspx

 

[thirteen]

Kimmage interview from the other day on The Last Word with Matt Cooper: http://media.todayfm.com/podcast/73727

 

[Navigator]

I don't know this Aaron Brown guy from a hole in the ground (is he a cyclist?) but if he was hoping to hitch his fortunes to the cycling world I think that is pretty much finished now.

It raises a larger question about where these twitter personalities come from and why do they become influential figures? Aaron Brown's sudden rise to fame was for being a friend of Floyd Landis. Rumor was he was in cahoots with him on many of his sock accounts. He then somehow turned that into a partially serious critique of Pat McQuaid whilst also promoting himself as some type of comedian.

By being a friend of someone and claiming to have specialist inside knowledge, without ever proving it, you can gain tens of thousands of followers on twitter very quickly, for no apparent substantive reason. You then become a White Knight figure that everybody trusts and is seen as an authority who you can handover lots of money to.

@UCI_Overlord is not alone. There are many people who have leached off the whole UCI/Armstrong affair on twitter essentially to promote themselves and foster their own ego. Without the Armstrong scandal they would be a nobody with a handful of followers.

 

[Benotti69]

It raises a larger question about where these twitter personalities come from and why do they become influential figures? Aaron Brown's sudden rise to fame was for being a friend of Floyd Landis. Rumor was he was in cahoots with him on many of his sock accounts. He then somehow turned that into a partially serious critique of Pat McQuaid whilst also promoting himself as some type of comedian.

By being a friend of someone and claiming to have specialist inside knowledge, without ever proving it, you can gain tens of thousands of followers on twitter very quickly, for no apparent substantive reason. You then become a White Knight figure that everybody trusts and is seen as an authority who you can handover lots of money to.

@UCI_Overlord is not alone. There are many people who have leached off the whole UCI/Armstrong affair on twitter essentially to promote themselves and foster their own ego. Without the Armstrong scandal they would be a nobody with a handful of followers.

This thread has nothing to do with twitter personalities. Off topic.

 

[Navigator]

This thread has nothing to do with twitter personalities. Off topic.

I think you'll find it does.

 

[Race Radio]

What's that smell?

 

[thirteen]

What's that smell?

took the words right out of my mouth... err, nose...

 

[Navigator]

The background as to how Aaron Brown became a trusted figure that could run the Kimmage fund is relevant. It is interesting how it works.

If we don't learn from our mistakes, they are destined to be repeated.

 

[Navigator]

Not only is any criticism of Lesli Cohen offtopic. We now can't mention why Aaron Brown came to be a trusted figure in the online cycling community?

Wow. What can be mentioned in this thread?

 

[Dr. Maserati]

Not only is any criticism of Lesli Cohen offtopic. We now can't mention why Aaron Brown came to be a trusted figure in the online cycling community?

Wow. What can be mentioned in this thread?

Well, you just mentioned Lesli Cohen, and brought up a question about Aaron Brown and you haven't been banned or had your post deleted.

If you are hoping for Internet martyrdom you need to dial up the faux outrage and makeyup stuff.

 

[Navigator]

Well, you just mentioned Lesli Cohen, and brought up a question about Aaron Brown and you haven't been banned or had your post deleted.
If you are hoping for Internet martyrdom you need to dial up the faux outrage and makeyup stuff.

But my post was deleted.

Maybe they should close the thread if they don't believe any criticism of Aaron Brown is appropriate.

 

[ElChingon]

The whole Kimmage fund fiasco is most likely due to people dealing with things they have no real idea what they are doing. Sure they have the mental goodness to help but there is more to it than that to do it right or legally. Legalities have caught up with this fund and it will probably kill Cyclismas as well and I enjoy their show.

Also, this is not the first or last Cycling related fiasco of money's is it. We all remember the Floyd and Tyler funds don't we? How did those end up...

People still have not learned the lessons previously presented to them. Cycling Fans are not lawyers even if one out there is, this special situation probably is over their heads as well or at least their fee structure to help out and fix it (for free).

 

[Digger]

The whole Kimmage fund fiasco is most likely due to people dealing with things they have no real idea what they are doing. Sure they have the mental goodness to help but there is more to it than that to do it right or legally. Legalities have caught up with this fund and it will probably kill Cyclismas as well and I enjoy their show.

Also, this is not the first or last Cycling related fiasco of money's is it. We all remember the Floyd and Tyler funds don't we? How did those end up...

People still have not learned the lessons previously presented to them. Cycling Fans are not lawyers even if one out there is, this special situation probably is over their heads as well or at least their fee structure to help out and fix it (for free).

That post is complete and utter rubbish and you have no idea what you are on about - merely speculation. One thing caught out this fund, and it wasn't legalities or tax issues.

 

[ElChingon]

That post is complete and utter rubbish and you have no idea what you are on about - merely speculation. One thing caught out this fund, and it wasn't legalities or tax issues.

So then, why are they just now filling out the tax forms? True charity/support funds get setup as such on day one or do you think the Boston Bomb fund for those hurt is just now getting the tax forms set up? No proper channels were setup on day one so people don't get ripped off by people gaming the system. Try setting up a proper charity/support fund and get back to us.

You also missed the part about the Floyd/Tyler funds, maybe you should read up on those as well.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

But my post was deleted.

Maybe they should close the thread if they don't believe any criticism of Aaron Brown is appropriate.

You think you cannot be critical of AB?

Can you point me to a post that is even slightly supportive of him?

So then, why are they just now filling out the tax forms? True charity/support funds get setup as such on day one or do you think the Boston Bomb fund for those hurt is just now getting the tax forms set up? No proper channels were setup on day one so people don't get ripped off by people gaming the system. Try setting up a proper charity/support fund and get back to us.

You also missed the part about the Floyd/Tyler funds, maybe you should read up on those as well.

If you think this is just a small issue of not applying for the correct tax form you may in for a shock.

 

[thirteen]

ElChingon, thank you so much for stepping up to take the place of MarkyW, such a gentleman you are!

are you now going to report me for taking troll-bait by responding to you?

 

[Digger]

So then, why are they just now filling out the tax forms? True charity/support funds get setup as such on day one or do you think the Boston Bomb fund for those hurt is just now getting the tax forms set up? No proper channels were setup on day one so people don't get ripped off by people gaming the system. Try setting up a proper charity/support fund and get back to us.

You also missed the part about the Floyd/Tyler funds, maybe you should read up on those as well.

Again, no issues would be arising if everyone had behaved as they were meant to - you honestly don't have a clue what you are talking about here. And if you honestly think it's just about tax, then you need reading lessons.

 

[BroDeal]

Someone should register KimmageFund Overlord and start tweeting about spending his ill-gotten gains.

 

[ElChingon]

Again, no issues would be arising if everyone had behaved as they were meant to - you honestly don't have a clue what you are talking about here. And if you honestly think it's just about tax, then you need reading lessons.

Its mainly about people outside this cyclismas thing actually biting at a supposed fund to help someone through a PayPal account, some people are truly born to be suckers. Taxes is part of it but the hook line and sinker are the people who put money up thinking this fund was a proper fund to help Kimmage, proper in the legal sense not the mental I want to help Kimmage against the UCI.

 

[hiero2]

So then, why are they just now filling out the tax forms? True charity/support funds get setup as such on day one or do you think the Boston Bomb fund for those hurt is just now getting the tax forms set up? No proper channels were setup on day one so people don't get ripped off by people gaming the system. Try setting up a proper charity/support fund and get back to us.

You also missed the part about the Floyd/Tyler funds, maybe you should read up on those as well.

El - as a poster, I say lighten up. I HAVE done stuff like this before, and the Boston Marathon bombing funds seem, at the moment, to be extremely exceptional. Dotting the i's and crossing the t's usually happens much later than it ever should, and this whole Paul Kimmage assistance effort was a very grassroots evolution - which would make it distinctly unlikely, in my experience, that the finer points were considered before the taxman got in touch and said wtf!

Now, that said, this whole bit seems extremely dodgy. Aaron Brown doesn't smell particularly rosy, and the role of all the other people is not clear. I don't see any heroes in this story, including Kimmage. In spite of the fact that he appears to me to be clearly wronged, he seems a bit whiny. Not to mention a bit dense - but it isn't his area of expertise, ok, I get that.

Waiting for another shoe to drop.

 

[Scott SoCal]

El - as a poster, I say lighten up. I HAVE done stuff like this before, and the Boston Marathon bombing funds seem, at the moment, to be extremely exceptional. Dotting the i's and crossing the t's usually happens much later than it ever should, and this whole Paul Kimmage assistance effort was a very grassroots evolution - which would make it distinctly unlikely, in my experience, that the finer points were considered before the taxman got in touch and said wtf!

Now, that said, this whole bit seems extremely dodgy. Aaron Brown doesn't smell particularly rosy, and the role of all the other people is not clear. I don't see any heroes in this story, including Kimmage. In spite of the fact that he appears to me to be clearly wronged, he seems a bit whiny. Not to mention a bit dense - but it isn't his area of expertise, ok, I get that.

Waiting for another shoe to drop.

I don't see any heroes in this story, including Kimmage. In spite of the fact that he appears to me to be clearly wronged, he seems a bit whiny. Not to mention a bit dense - but it isn't his area of expertise, ok, I get that.

I have now, literally, read it all on his forum.

That is a disgrace.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Paul Kimmage has been described as 'excitable' and 'high-strung' ...
this may be a fairly accurate description of his personality but it doesn't mean he is in the wrong or mishandling this.

Everyone deals with things differently.

 

[DirtyWorks]

Its mainly about people outside this cyclismas thing actually biting at a supposed fund to help someone through a PayPal account, some people are truly born to be suckers. Taxes is part of it but the hook line and sinker are the people who put money up thinking this fund was a proper fund to help Kimmage, proper in the legal sense not the mental I want to help Kimmage against the UCI.

To the bolded, you sure have a funny way of showing it. What is the rush to condemn everyone? You've even included the people perfectly willing to fund Kimmage's SLAPP defense in less than ideal circumstances. Stop wondering why organizing change is so difficult because your comments are a prime example of how any momentum at all is destroyed.

Now is a good time to remind you how quickly the whole thing took off.

Ideally, there's a clear accounting of the funds at some point. Hopefully, the matter resolves itself well. It might not resolve well. Even in the worst case, it's a start. Finally, I'd fund the Kimmage Attack Fund with no regrets.

 

[Nick777]

Like plenty of others, I donated, but wouldn't dream of asking for my money back. All I want is to know that the funds are available to Kimmage. I wouldn't care if he used it to build an extension on his house.

One person is coming out of this looking less than stellar. Not sure what he is playing at, but I am looking forward to the end of the story.

 

[ElChingon]

To the bolded, you sure have a funny way of showing it. What is the rush to condemn everyone? You've even included the people perfectly willing to fund Kimmage's SLAPP defense in less than ideal circumstances. Stop wondering why organizing change is so difficult because your comments are a prime example of how any momentum at all is destroyed.

Now is a good time to remind you how quickly the whole thing took off.

Ideally, there's a clear accounting of the funds at some point. Hopefully, the matter resolves itself well. It might not resolve well. Even in the worst case, it's a start. Finally, I'd fund the Kimmage Attack Fund with no regrets.

I think you're mistaking some of what I wrote, should read (the bolded)

Taxes is part of it but the hook line and sinker are the people who put money up thinking this fund was a proper fund to help Kimmage, proper in the legal sense not of the mentality I want to help Kimmage against the UCI.

I wrote in haste before. Many people contributed because of the latter and forgot the to check former. Yes, easily to overlook considering the situation at the time, just like in all rushed causes, hence the tax laws.

Condemn everyone? Well I am assuming an audience of adults here with enriched lives and experiences and some memory of the past. That being said, who would put up money to some random person on the street stating they are against some cause you particularly believe in? I am just hoping people either know this person is legit or are throwing their money at them to feel like they are contributing without really doing anything that might cause some of their personal time. Has anyone sent Paul Kimmage any money directly? Is that way too hard to do? Why not give at the root of the issue? Guess PayPal is much easier for those who want the quick satisfaction or feel good mouse click.

Like plenty of others, I donated, but wouldn't dream of asking for my money back. All I want is to know that the funds are available to Kimmage. I wouldn't care if he used it to build an extension on his house.

One person is coming out of this looking less than stellar. Not sure what he is playing at, but I am looking forward to the end of the story.

I'm thinking there are many people which are looking less than stellar, several thousands. In this day and age, you better know who you are sending money too and know its legit, or the headlines might just include your name next time.