Kittel Tweet

[mattghg]

Omerta lives...in the clinic. How often here do I see riders castigated for speaking out, the same way people speak out here about suspicious performances everyday. It appears you only like it when they speak out riders you like to speak out about. They are in double trouble if they actually cite an example of a clean rider that you have already spoken out about as being a dirty dawg.

Then they are being unprofessional and a big meanie to the poor rider.

This is why I like Benotti, consistency

This x1000

 

[Arnout]

I wonder if Kittel only was the tough man on twitter or if he also went up to Sayar in real life. Nothing is going to improve by loose cannons tweeting the equivalent of bull****.

Sayar might be doped or might not be. If I was gonna be disgusted everytime I see a doped rider do something, I wouldn't watch pro cycling anymore. In fact, it's a wonder Kittel stays on his bike every day.

There's one thing worse than cheating and that's applying hypocritical double standards to people you don't know. If that Sayar guy was picked up by Argos last year and he would show the same performance Kittel would be tweeting about a brilliant new young talent.

 

[Libertine Seguros]

Well, if he doesn't get busted, maybe a team like Argos will pick him up at the end of the year for cheap UCI points, then Kittel can work out how he wants to play it. After the weekend he probably won't see the guy until the season's over anyhow.

 

[The Hitch]

Watching it today and it was just plain wrong. At the steepest part of the climb he was in the big ring and off he goes, making up the difference to the guys in front easily. If he isnt caught then just give up.


And I am sick of people going on about sky in every thread . We know its suspect there are masses of pages on it. C an we not have a discussion on something which in its own right stinks without all the sky trolls

If he has never tested positive then it is most definately relevant to sky especially (since they did it on the biggest stage ) as well as any other rider who improved from dog **** to serial winner and 5.9 watt climber, at bigger races than the tour of turkey, who Kittel has not yet questioned

 

[Pentacycle]

If he has never tested positive then it is most definately relevant to sky especially (since they did it on the biggest stage ) as well as any other rider who improved from dog **** to serial winner and 5.9 watt climber, at bigger races than the tour of turkey, who Kittel has not yet questioned

Where would you put Sayar on the graph?

 

[The Hitch]

Sorry. Not buying that for a second. You either want riders to be willing to break ranks when they suspect something or you don't.

Yet again, all the moral outrage boils down to picking your favourites. The same posters who make a tool like Ricco out to be a 'victim'.

Well, I like the new phrase at least, "turd in the swimming pool" - the new "spitting in the soup". Completely unbelievable, all the high moral dudgeon about breaking omerta and finding dopers and hating the cheats - but only on the teams I don't like, you understand, not the other 'nice' possible cheats...

In Ireland we have a phrase, that came from the troubles - 'whataboutery' - that tendency of politicians to speak with high moral outrage about every terrorist act...except the ones done by their 'own' side

Every challenge to their hypocrisy gets answered with, "yeah, but what about"... and immediately they 'pick' the victim or the outrage they want to talk about...always one done by the 'other' side...and it becomes quickly clear, they talk only about what suits their wider power agenda...they pick their favourites.

It's a form of low hypocrisy that deserves only contempt. And while cycling doping is not anything like as serious as blowing people up, the basic hypocrisy, picking your favourites while pretending to actually have a moral compass, is clear and unavoidable. And just as deserving of contempt.

EDIT : by the way, that's not personal to you Benotti, you have your moments but you are actually far from the worst offender...

A few points you seem to be missing.

1 since Kittel has not clarified why he has gone after this particular rider so hard, nor given any explanation, implicit or explicit, why other riders smashing out similar (read far more impressive) performances do not provoke such a reaction from him, then we have every right to question why he went after this rider

2 The wording of the tweet. Hes not saying – I am suspicious. Hes not saying like Kimmage – there are a lot of questionmarks. He is not asking how.

He is straight up accusing the guy of doping. In about as hard and upfront manner as possible for a 140 character post.

3 You accuse posters of critiscising Kittel's tweet based on their own models and thought proccess, and not Kittel's , yet proceed to do the exact same thing with your own post.

You accuse bennoti and others of thinking in terms of like and don't like. Hes not happy that they go after Sayer cos he likes him but thinks its ok to go after froome who he doesn't like.

Maybe thats how you approach theses issues, that doesn't mean thats how everyone else does it.

A pretty obvious variable you are ignoring is the money one. Sayer is small fry. Russian amateur is small fry. Vuelta Costa Rica podium is small fry.

These people get paid a few grand, slightly more than subsistance level, probably half of it in vouchers for whatever the part time sponsor they represent is selling, and the only people who give a **** are their immediate family.

Guys who win the Tour, the Giro, the Worlds, The Vuelta, PR, MSR, LBL, GDL, RVV, paris nice, Tirreno, etc etc etc, get million dollar contracts, get fame cum heroworship amongst the considerable worldwide population of cycling fans/ National hero and global celebrity status if its the tdf.

Not to mention the fact that cheating someone of victory in the tour of turkey or costa ricca or the u23 tour of siberia, is a lesser crime then doing it on the big stage.

Oh and its a matter of record that governing bodies have thrown nobodies to the wolves in order to cover up the big names.

So to me it seems perfectly logical that people roll their eyes evertytime some no name gets all the heat (in this case for doing absolutely nothing that 10 other guys considered heroes have not done). And something that doesn't have to have anything to do with nationality or like and dislike.

When sayer starts to win the PN, Romandie, Dauphine, tour and olympics on 1 half year long peak, and a whole national press + army of posters take on an agenda of shoving all the suspicion surrounding that under the carpet, im sure the reaction will be far stronger.

 

[The Hitch]

Where would you put Sayar on the graph?

While it does have some humour, and has been well thought out and organized, it lacks the most important factor cartoons/parodies, of this sort ought to possess – an actual point to hit out at.

The idea that the original graph was a total fabrication, has no basis in reality. There is no reason to believe that froome's position on that graph was misplaced. So your graph has no real value beyond comedy.

 

[The Hitch]

BTW could anyone give me a translation of -“I look forward to hearing what you will say about Wiggins at the Giro and Froome at the Tour”, in German.

Preferably limited to 140 characters.

Cheers.

 

[Dear Wiggo]

Thats the beauty of clean cycling. Clean Turkish riders can now have a go at their own Ataturk Tour.

Did he stay under the 6w/k? Then he is clean, believable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0yww20gLFzY

PS: the guy has some nice results in his pockets, from the past 2/3 years

He should get JV to test him, that will put the rumours to rest.

 

[Big Doopie]

Go Kittel. I will always support a rider that breaks omertà.

 

[martinvickers]

BTW could anyone give me a translation of -“I look forward to hearing what you will say about Wiggins at the Giro and Froome at the Tour”, in German.

Preferably limited to 140 characters.

Cheers.

"Es wird sehr mich freun Sie zu hoeren wann Sie auf Wiggins und Froome auch sagan"

something like that, anyway

p.s. Es tut mir leid, ich versuche deutsche zu lernen.

 

[burning]

Ich freue mich zu hören, was du über Wiggo bei Giro und über Froome bei Tour sagen wirst

This could be better but my German is very rusty though

 

[Dear Wiggo]

He only rode from 3km to go, what's the big deal? And he looked very human the entire time. I've seen Porte and Froome do this same thing from the bottom of the (6km) climb and put the same or more time into actual PT riders.

 

[martinvickers]

Ich freue mich zu hören, was du über Wiggo bei Giro und über Froome bei Tour sagen wirst

This could be better but my German is very rusty though

Ich werde mich freuen zu hören? (It will please me, rather than it pleases me?)

 

[Le Baroudeur]

He only rode from 3km to go, what's the big deal? And he looked very human the entire time. I've seen Porte and Froome do this same thing from the bottom of the (6km) climb and put the same or more time into actual PT riders.

The big deal is Kitten acting like a self apointed Senator McCarthy.

 

[burning]

Ich werde mich freuen zu hören? (It will please me, rather than it pleases me?)

I think what I wrote is better but a native speaker could end this discussion for sure

 

[martinvickers]

I think what I wrote is better but a native speaker could end this discussion for sure

True; I'm very much a beginner, it was more a question than a suggestion?

 

[The Hitch]

p.s. Es tut mir leid, ich versuche deutsche zu lernen.

I did it for a levels. Teacher was a **** so dropped it afterwards and learnt Spanish instead. German girls aren't all that.

 

[Ferminal]

There is testing at the Tour of Turkey, no?

 

[Le Baroudeur]

There is testing at the Tour of Turkey, no?

There was last year...

 

[Ferminal]

Yep, better than some other races.

Time will tell on Kittel, if Mustafa doesn't test positive he is in a shameful position, but if he does... well you can't fault Marcel for being correct.

 

[Le Baroudeur]

Yep, better than some other races.

Time will tell on Kittel, if Mustafa doesn't test positive he is in a shameful position, but if he does... well you can't fault Marcel for being correct.

The time for kitten's faux scorn would be after, and if a rider tested positive, not before? It's hugely arrogant to appoint himself judge and jury, not to mention highly unprofessional. The only thing uglier than the court of public opinion, is the agent inciting the mob.

 

[Ferminal]

lol I forgot to time it live but if my replay is correct:

4.8km
374m
7.8%
12'55"
22.3kmh
1737m/h

Only 15 minutes, though

 

[Ripper]

Well well well

I had an interesting reaction to this.

On one hand I am OK with riders speaking out. I don't really care about the timing. We need to encourage no omerta.

I think the ride looks more than a little suspect.

On the other hand, I sorta dislike Kittel, and it is partly because he tends to pick targets that won't create a problem for him. I think LS noted that he's not gonna have to see much of Sayer and his team for the rest of the year. There have been other suspect performances where Kittel is completely silent. I also think Kittel is a bit like a whiny schoolchild.

This said, I gotta be OK with calling what we think.

 

[Galic Ho]

It's always great when dopers are called out. But is he a doper? Does Kittel know more than he tells? Or does he just call a no-name out, so that he himself will be seen in a better light?

If I was a rider and publicly called others for dopers, then I would start with those that actually have a link to doping. Like some of the Fuentes and/or Ferrari clients....

That's it. Perception. Say something about a guy whose performance even the pros know is abnormal and above what it should be. Make sure it's someone almost nobody knows, a race nobody gives a darn about other than locals and addicts and finally do it on twitter so it can spread like wild fire,

It isn't about clean cycling. It's not about you getting robbed. It's all about Kittel. Marketing 101. It's how you promote yourself. Would he do this about one of the guys Bro Deal mentioned? A big obvious doper, who everyone knows? Hell no. So what does that reveal? Kittel is more concerned about being viewed, heard, seen and thus perceived to be anti-doping than he is about being beaten by a doper. He's just paying his dues. Does this make me question his cleanliness? Sure does. Smells like someone is paying their omerta dividends.

Bro Deal is right. Time to get the twits off of twitter. Nobody came along and dropped a turd in the Germans lap, so why is Kittel doing it to some low range nobody only Libertine has heard of? He ain't telling the whole story, so why talk at all? Simply to fool people and misdirect them. When he calls out a huge name...like Froome, who is a similar example, then he's legit. Till then he's just a coward jumping through the hoops. It's akin to picking on Ricco. Pointless.