Lance the Politician

[Anonymous]

Crap, I got tricked by the troll of cyclingnews forums again. Oh well, another BPC incarnation in "Ignore."

 

[Race Radio]

Are they medical doctors? Did they bring up these questions before or after the Danish story?

Damsgaard's relationship with Armstrong was already distant after they did not do the testing program. I'm not even sure he was still on the payroll by that point?

Do you get tired of getting a new IP address every time you get banned?

The doctors I listed are all experts in their field of doping. Damsgaard was still employed by Armstrong. You easily forget that part of the Catlin lie was that they already had a internal testing program with Damsgaard.

 

[Anonymous]

Do you get tired of getting a new IP address every time you get banned?

The doctors I listed are all experts in their field of doping. Damsgaard was still employed by Armstrong. You easily forget that part of the Catlin lie was that they already had a internal testing program with Damsgaard.

Key word there.

 

[rhubroma]

I don't think he is smearing all doctors. He is merely pointing out that it only takes one person like this to raise a question about his blood profile, and it then becomes fact that he doped across the net. And it only takes one journalist to pick up on this.

In my view he his right that it's not worth the hassle.

And we find out today that Lance officially has given his "approval" of the UCI's bio passport system and thus he and his team won't be needing the indepenpendent services of Damsgaard to perform Radio Shack's anti-dopng program.

Lance donated $200,000 to the UCI anti-doping program. Does anybody else see a huge conflict of interests here? Would the UCI actually nail a guy that has been so generous to it and generates huge profits for their organization? Wonder what his fans in the States think about it...Do they think critically about it? Or do they just put their faith in the man?

Then, of course, I have always believed that the only way to improve anti-doping, is to have the UCI completely out of it (because of the same conflict of interests issue - let's face it the bio passport itself is a form of legalized doping within certain paramaters, though, naturally, is not sold to the public as such). There needs ot be a completely independent body, with no profit interests in the sport, but just in bringing the truth to light, doing the testing. It would have to be paid for by the national federations (or some outside entity) and not the UCI of course.

Had such a system been up prior to Lance's return, I'd bet my house he would never have come back. But, then again, the public often doesn't like to hear about unconfessable truths and it seems that organizations such as the UCI do their best make make sure they never come out. Lance can rest tranquilly at night.

 

[Rex Hunter]

Do I need to post a link that Damsgaard was working for Astana or can you use Google yourself?

Thanks, I wasn't 100% sure. The relationship was already distant he will have known he was starting his own company by the end of this year. There is no great reason for someone of such high standards, who Greg LeMond has praised, to lie. That's just a smear.

Going back to the original question, it's all a matter of interpretation and people will have different views. There are many who will claim LA doped no matter what he does - they assert that he doped for the Giro despite Armstrong's numbers being completely normal. So what is the point of releasing such numbers? What's the upside? If they are normal they will say he doped, if they are unusual and raise questions then it becomes a fact he doped. I can't see why he would want to release them and put up with it.

I can see why they thought it was a good idea by the experiment hasn't worked. All riders will probably not be publishing from now on.

 

[pedaling squares]

Freaking hilarious! He puts his numbers up so that they can be examined. Then changes some of the numbers. Someone examines them and questions some of the values as suspicious. Lance throws a hissy fit and stops all internal testing and publication of values. He should have put a disclaimer with his initial publication that read "you can look at these, and talk about them amongst yourselves so long as you agree that there is nothing wrong with them. Failure to comply will result in their removal." What a complete ***.

Yep. And see insert.

Maaaaaattt Daaaaamon

Welcome back. Ok, I paraphrased your actual text.

See you all in The Clinic.

 

[B.Rasmussen]

Man, It's getting tiresome to add to the ignore list on an almost daily basis. Cya in your next incarnation.

 

[Anonymous]

Just so everyone knows, the "Ignore" function is found under UserCP. Click it, and then on the left side under "Settings & Options" you will see "Edit Ignore List." Click that, and in the box under "Add a Member to Your List..." type in "Rex Hunter" and click "Okay"

 

[Rex Hunter]

And we find out today that Lance officially has given his "approval" of the UCI's bio passport system and thus he and his team won't be needing the indepenpendent services of Damsgarten (or however his name is spelled) to perform Radio Shack's anti-dopng program.

Lance donated $200,000 to the UCI anti-doping program. Does anybody else see a huge conflict of interests here? Would the UCI actually nail a guy that has been so generous to it and generates huge profits for their organization? Wonder what his fans in the States think about it...Do they think critically about it? Or do they just put their faith in the man?

Then, of course, I have always believed that the only way to improve anti-doping, is to have the UCI completely out of it (because of the same conflict of interests issue - let's face it the bio passport itself is a form of legalized doping within certain paramaters, though, naturally, is not sold to the public as such). There needs ot be a completely independent body, with no profit interests in the sport, but just in bringing the truth to light, doing the testing. It would have to be paid for by the national federations (or some outside entity) and not the UCI of course.

Had such a system been up prior to Lance's return, I'd bet my house he would never have come back.

Those are interesting points, but it would be a hell of a risk to take. The bio passport system is tightening up every year and riders are way below the 50% limit these days because of this. How could Armstrong be 100% sure that the UCI will be able to order the doctors and testers involved in the process to let him off? It seems too much of a conspiracy to me and very high risk - anyone could speak out. And will donations years ago count in 2010?

 

[Rex Hunter]

I seem to be very unpopular for standing up for Armstrong on this issue. Are the forums on this site always like this? I'm sorry but it's just the way I see this - there is just no upside to publishing results for any rider, but particularly Armstrong. Perhaps it's better to stick to the issue and use evidence and reason rather than attack me for taking a different view.

 

[Race Radio]

Thanks, I wasn't 100% sure. The relationship was already distant he will have known he was starting his own company by the end of this year. There is no great reason for someone of such high standards, who Greg LeMond has praised, to lie. That's just a smear.
.

I have proved links that show that Damsgaard's "High Standards" are in question. This conflict is even more obvious when you factor in Damsgaard's statements about Rassmusen.

Please provide any evidence that the "relationship was distant"....or are you just trolling again?

Arbiter/BritishProCycling/BanProCycling/Sprocket1/Earth Tribe/Max Power and now Rex Hunter

The Herpes of the message board is having another flair up

 

[rhubroma]

Those are interesting points, but it would be a hell of a risk to take. The bio passport system is tightening up every year and riders are way below the 50% limit these days because of this. How could Armstrong be 100% sure that the UCI will be able to order the doctors and testers involved in the process to let him off? It seems too much of a conspiracy to me and very high risk - anyone could speak out. And will donations years ago count in 2010?

I have no faith in the transparancy of the UCI, and even less in Lance.

I know its unpopular in the US to believe in conspiracies, and yet the world is full of them. But if conspiricy is too far fetched for you, then how about improper economic relationship that places loads of doubt on the sincerity of the parties involved?

 

[Race Radio]

I seem to be very unpopular for standing up for Armstrong on this issue. Are the forums on this site always like this? Perhaps it's better to stick to the issue and use evidence and reason rather than attack me for taking a different view.

Surely we can all agree that you are trolling again. Multiple claims back up by no evidence.

Given your history on this forum of highjacking threads with useless garbage you should not be surprised that when you get yet another ip address to get around yet another ban that you are no welcomed back with open arms.

 

[Rex Hunter]

I have proved links that show that Damsgaard's "High Standards" are in question. This conflict is even more obvious when you factor in Damsgaard's statements about Rassmusen.

Well Greg LeMond has praised him as someone he really respects. How do you know that Damsgaard did not see something in these results that he did not see in the other results? I think your take is a bit simplistic. What payroll is Erik Heier on? I disagree with your interpretation. Is that a crime?

Please provide any evidence that the "relationship was distant"....or are you just trolling again?

It's my opinion of the relationship after Armstrong did not go ahead with the testing program. He seems to have been in a consultancy roll from then on with Astana as a team - a team that Armstrong did not control - probably knowing he would move on in a few months. I don't see why he should lie. That's my view.

Do you have the evidence that the doctors you cited are medical doctors yet? I'm not saying they're not but you seem reluctant to provide evidence.

Not sure what your last comment is about. Best to stick to the issue.

 

[Rex Hunter]

Surely we can all agree that you are trolling again. Multiple claims back up by no evidence.

I'm sorry but I have provided more evidence than you have.A large part of the case against Armstrong has no evidence for it, so that's a bit of a cheek to be honest. Where is your evidence that Armstrong doped for all his tour wins? Where is your evidence that he doped for the Giro this year? We are all just interpreting information at the end of the day. You seem to be saying anyone who doesn't accept your interpretation and assertions is trolling. My argument here is quite logical even if you disagree with it. There is no trolling - unlike some of the comments by you and ThoughtforFood have made. Perhaps you should find another thread to play in.

 

[Deagol]

Crap, I got tricked by the troll of cyclingnews forums again. Oh well, another BPC incarnation in "Ignore."

I was thinking that by "his" third or fourth post and wondered why no one else was saying anything.

Edit:
Some people have made a religion out of LA: fanatical, zealous, and relentless. Arbiter is a high priest. I am now, after watching this unfold for many months, always suspicious of a new members who come out of nowhere to defend their messiah at any cost. The zeal is hard to hide and starts to show through after a short while.

 

[Race Radio]

Well Greg LeMond has praised him as someone he really respects. How do you know that Damsgaard did not see something in these results that he did not see in the other results? I think your take is a bit simplistic. What payroll is Erik Heier on? I disagree with your interpretation. Is that a crime?



It's my opinion of the relationship after Armstrong did not go ahead with the testing program. He seems to have been in a consultancy roll from then on with Astana as a team - a team that Armstrong did not control - probably knowing he would move on in a few months. I don't see why he should lie. That's my view.

Do you have the evidence that the doctors you cited are medical doctors yet? I'm not saying they're not but you seem reluctant to provide evidence.

Not sure what your last comment is about. Best to stick to the issue.

Lemond praised him when he first started. When it became clear that he was compromised he changed his opinion. As did his boss, his co workers, and his employer. That you do not even attempt to address this issue shows you are again only interested in trolling.

The doctors I provided are some of best in the sport. They have developed some of the key tests and have covered multiple areas of the sporting world. Your attempt to marginalize them is just another sad attempt to highjack the thread.

You are going on the ignore list just like all your previous usernames.

 

[William H]

I think Armstrong does have something of a point. There is a problem that someone whose values change for innocent reasons could find himself tainted, with no real way to clear your name.

I also think it's rather silly to make something public, and then complain that someone chose to look at and comment on it.

 

[Race Radio]

I think Armstrong does have something of a point. There is a problem that someone whose values change for innocent reasons could find himself tainted, with no real way to clear your name.

.

I would think he would at least make an attempt to address the legitimate questions.

There are multiple studies on blood levels during a three week Tour. Teams have been tracking them for decades. Damsgaard's own study shows an average of a 12% decrease. That Armstrong's number increased 10% from his off season baseline during the last week of the Tour is certainly questionable as it goes against any evidence.

That Armstrong chooses to ignore the obvious issue and instead attack the massager, change his numbers, then take them down all together make the increase even more questionable.

 

[Rex Hunter]

Lemond praised him when he first started. When it became clear that he was compromised he changed his opinion.

Do you have evidence that he changed his opinion? I have not see this, thanks.

As did his boss, his co workers, and his employer. That you do not even attempt to address this issue shows you are again only interested in trolling

.

You're saying that unless I accept your belief that Damsgaard is corrupt then I am trolling? I have given my view of it - I think he has a high reputation and would not lie about this.

The doctors I provided are some of best in the sport. They have developed some of the key tests and have covered multiple areas of the sporting world. Your attempt to marginalize them is just another sad attempt to highjack the thread.

Where have I attempted to marginlize these doctors? I asked for evidence that they are medical doctors. I have already provided you with evidence from a top scientist who says his view of the blood result was that Armstrong was clean. I could say your refusal to address that means you are trolling.

You've accused me of trolling for not accepting your belief about Damsgaard, accused me of something I did not say, and have refused to actually address the broader issue about interpretation and why there is no upside for an athlete to publish numbers. You don't seem to be interested in debate and just want to smear me and shut me down. This is what a troll does.

 

[Publicus]

Hey this ignore thing is all right!

 

[Polish]

Blood results are not all the same - they are a matter of interpretation. All it takes is for something a bit unusual to occur and again it becomes fact that he doped. It's quite a smear itself. Even when there is nothing unusual, such as the Giro blood results, people still assert that he doped, so what exactly is the benefit of posting the results online? I think he's right to take them down - there is zero benefit to be had. No gain but potential pain.

Exactly!

And the Hater Cult viewing this action by Lance as diabolical only
goes to prove Lance's point. The Cult sees Evil in everything Lance
related.

If the Dalai Lama's blood values were posted up on the interwebs,
but were labeled with "Lance's" name - how long do you think it would
be before some Distinquished Member of the cult connects the dots
in such a way that would PROVE "Lance" was doping? Not long LOL.
.
.
.

 

[Rex Hunter]

Exactly!

And the Hater Cult viewing this action by Lance as diabolical only
goes to prove Lance's point. The Cult sees Evil in everything Lance
related.

If the Dalai Lama's blood values were posted up on the interwebs,
but were labeled with "Lance's" name - how long do you think it would
be before some Distinquished Member of the cult connects the dots
in such a way that would PROVE "Lance" was doping? Not long LOL.
.
.
.

Yeah, they really don't like people disagreeing with them. You're right that it seems like a cult in that respect. All the evidence has to point one way. How can any athlete post blood results in this circumstance?

 

[Race Radio]

Exactly!

And the Hater Cult viewing this action by Lance as diabolical only
goes to prove Lance's point. The Cult sees Evil in everything Lance
related.

If the Dalai Lama's blood values were posted up on the interwebs,
but were labeled with "Lance's" name - how long do you think it would
be before some Distinquished Member of the cult connects the dots
in such a way that would PROVE "Lance" was doping? Not long LOL.
.
.
.

Why is it ok to question Landis', Basso's and Rassmusen's numbers when they made similar jumps but not Armstrong's?

 

[Publicus]

Exactly!

And the Hater Cult viewing this action by Lance as diabolical only
goes to prove Lance's point. The Cult sees Evil in everything Lance
related.

If the Dalai Lama's blood values were posted up on the interwebs,
but were labeled with "Lance's" name - how long do you think it would
be before some Distinquished Member of the cult connects the dots
in such a way that would PROVE "Lance" was doping? Not long LOL.
.
.
.

This is such a nonsensical argument. No one is arguing that an allegation is iron-clad proof. We are simply noting that if a cyclist or other professional athlete posts his blood values on the web, folks are going to look at them and make comments. And if the cyclist did it to PROVE that he was clean, folks are DEFINITELY going to look at them. Taking them down because someone did the inevitable is just dumb and frankly smells like pretext.

His (Lance's) reaction is just wrong from a PR point of view. He's feeding the suspicion that he has something to hide--not starving it.