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Lemond's body of evidence

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Feb 21, 2010
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Polish said:
EPO would be like a commonly used fuel additive.

Blood Transfusions would be like removing the engine, cleaning, and putting the same engine back in.

Hardly actions that would "transform' a race car lol.

But maybe cancer treatment would be analogous to a major overhaul/transformation?

No, EPO is like a turbocharger.. a bolt on addition.

Transfusions are essentially the same, perhaps like a surpercharger.

HGH is like installing a larger carburetor and fuel pump.

The "fuel" is still the same.
 

Dr. Maserati

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Since we are on car anologys.

Remember the Festina riders who were heavily juiced gave their team Doctor Eric Rijkaert the nickname "Dr. Punto" - because he was unable to get the best out of the PED's and take risks like Dr. Ferrari.

The Fiat Punto :eek:
m8k6xg.jpg
 
Jun 19, 2009
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Polish said:
EPO would be like a commonly used fuel additive.

Blood Transfusions would be like removing the engine, cleaning, and putting the same engine back in.

Hardly actions that would "transform' a race car lol.

But maybe cancer treatment would be analogous to a major overhaul/transformation?


No, but continued use of the restorative medications that came from a cancer treatment would. What they are giving my Dad: anabolics (recovery), anabolics (inhaled for improved breathing) and, prospectively-current-market EPO (recovery and added strength).
Not a complicated routine but alot like giving him higher octane fuel, removing the restrictor plate to his fuel intake system and letting him sit in the pits for a lap without penalty. Yeah, it's more like that kind of advantage.
 
Mar 8, 2010
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Dr. Maserati said:
Since we are on car anologys.

Remember the Festina riders who were heavily juiced gave their team Doctor Eric Rijkaert the nickname "Dr. Punto" - because he was unable to get the best out of the PED's and take risks like Dr. Ferrari.

The Fiat Punto :eek:
m8k6xg.jpg

You screwed up your own post with your hypothetical things, again. What a shame.

So next step/try:
- Ferrari just took more risks

Sounds a little bit desperate right now, like grabbing a straw while being washed away by the flood.
 

Dr. Maserati

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Cobblestoned said:
You screwed up your own post with your hypothetical things, again. What a shame.

So next step/try:
- Ferrari just took more risks

Sounds a little bit desperate right now, like grabbing a straw while being washed away by the flood.

You have a fixation on addressing posters - and not their posts.

Either articulate your point - or if your only way to rebut a post is to make it personal then don't reply.
 

Polish

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Mar 11, 2009
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Dr. Maserati said:
Since we are on car anologys.

Remember the Festina riders who were heavily juiced gave their team Doctor Eric Rijkaert the nickname "Dr. Punto" - because he was unable to get the best out of the PED's and take risks like Dr. Ferrari.
]


waa waa.
The poor Festina team
waa waa.

The team that helped bring EPO into the peloton gets beat at their own game.

waawaawaa.
 
Mar 8, 2010
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Dr. Maserati said:
You have a fixation on addressing posters - and not their posts.

Either articulate your point - or if your only way to rebut a post is to make it personal then don't reply.


I addressed your post. So whats your problem, dottore ?

But yes. I am well known for messing up onesided haterfestivals by bringing these partyanimals down to earth.
I live on planet earth and want to discuss there - thats the whole problem.
Its like the "give and take" or "reaping what you seeded" principle.

Hey you! Up in the sky
Learning to fly
Tell me how high
Do you think you'll go
Before you start falling
 

Dr. Maserati

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Cobblestoned said:
I addressed your post. So whats your problem, dottore ?

But yes. I am well known for messing up onesided haterfestivals by bringing these partyanimals down to earth.
I live on planet earth and want to discuss there - thats the whole problem.
Its like the "give and take" or "reaping what you seeded" principle.

Hey you! Up in the sky
Learning to fly
Tell me how high
Do you think you'll go
Before you start falling

As I said earlier -

Either articulate your point - or if your only way to rebut a post is to make it personal then don't reply.
 

Dr. Maserati

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Polish said:
waa waa.
The poor Festina team
waa waa.

The team that helped bring EPO into the peloton gets beat at their own game.

waawaawaa.

Sensible, articulate, reasonable, factual, educational, thought provoking, rational, intelligent...

None of those words spring to mind when I read that post.

Have a tissue.
20iw508.jpg
 
Jun 15, 2009
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Polish said:
waa waa.
The poor Festina team
waa waa.

The team that helped bring EPO into the peloton gets beat at their own game.

waawaawaa.

Apparently the :eek: icon above the Punto pic. wasn't enough to convey the humor in the post. Therefore, the poster must be a doped-up Festina apologist?

No jokes in here - this Clinic stuff is serious business!
 
Cobblestoned said:
I addressed your post. So whats your problem, dottore ?

But yes. I am well known for messing up onesided haterfestivals by bringing these partyanimals down to earth.
I live on planet earth and want to discuss there - thats the whole problem.
Its like the "give and take" or "reaping what you seeded" principle.

Hey you! Up in the sky
Learning to fly
Tell me how high
Do you think you'll go
Before you start falling

Well I have seen very little of you wanting to discuss anything, you have illustrated what you think on certain topics based on nothing else other than what you believe. For example your only reference for Lance becoming a 7 time champion is based solely on the fact that he won the worlds championships at 21.

You berate those who hold the opposite opinion even though this was also the prevailing opinion of the vast majority of the cycling community, riders, managers, commnetators etc from 93 until about 01. I guess all those people who were at the coalface of pro racing and had that view back then must have been all haters too, right.

I found this quote from Lance just after he won the Worlds and was asked about becoming the next Greg LeMond

'Greg LeMond won two world titles, now I have one under my belt, but he won the Tour three times, and I dont consider myself a Tour rider. I respect him as much as I respect anyone out there but I am not folowing the Greg LeMond route'

Hardly the words of a future Tour contender.
 
Mar 8, 2010
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pmcg76 said:
Well I have seen very little of you wanting to discuss anything, you have illustrated what you think on certain topics based on nothing else other than what you believe. For example your only reference for Lance becoming a 7 time champion is based solely on the fact that he won the worlds championships at 21.

You berate those who hold the opposite opinion even though this was also the prevailing opinion of the vast majority of the cycling community, riders, managers, commnetators etc from 93 until about 01. I guess all those people who were at the coalface of pro racing and had that view back then must have been all haters too, right.

I found this quote from Lance just after he won the Worlds and was asked about becoming the next Greg LeMond

'Greg LeMond won two world titles, now I have one under my belt, but he won the Tour three times, and I dont consider myself a Tour rider. I respect him as much as I respect anyone out there but I am not folowing the Greg LeMond route'

Hardly the words of a future Tour contender.

Very modest and respectful. A true champion. :)
There are lot of more references, but I hate repeating.
 

flicker

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L'arriviste said:
How on earth does old Greg find the time to put together 70,000 pages? I work with databases that couldn't do it quicker!

Wish I'd been a pro cyclist and not given up when I was grovelling as a rubbish junior. By now, I'd be close to retirement and a life of nothing but spare time. :p

Since my cyberspace smackdown by an unnamed individual I have seen a new light. I will share this forum with any one who is interested. Note the lack of snarkey comments there. FLICKER (The formerley rude and now have seen the light polite poster on cyclingnews.)

http://www.bikeforums.net/archive/index.php/t-509611.html
 
Mar 17, 2009
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Charly Mottet rode to 4th at 1991 TDF, plus won two stages, so Greg is kinda lumping Mottet in with epoh users when voet swore Mottet was totally clean
 
Dave_1 said:
Charly Mottet rode to 4th at 1991 TDF, plus won two stages, so Greg is kinda lumping Mottet in with epoh users when voet swore Mottet was totally clean

no. he has never said that. he has said that epo shortened his career and made him ride and train differently. all that mattered to lemond was winning the tour -- not beating mottet. if it was just beating mottet he would have marked mottet and never allowed him to get 5 minutes in one stage. nor would he have attacked non stop to try and get back the time he had lost on indurain, chiappucci and bugno (who were all juiced on epo). in fact in that tour leblanc, fignon and mottet all beat him and none of them were on epo. however, if indurain, bugno and chiappucci had not been on epo (and their respective teams as well), then I believe Lemond would have won easily. he had put several minutes into the three frenchmen in the first ITT.

see my post here about the 1991 tour:

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?t=11029&page=3