Marco Pantani?

[Machu Picchu]

Hope there are no objections to the resurrection of such an old thread but wanted to share the news of a new documentary film being made about Il Pirata for those who may not have heard, it is by the same team who did the recent Senna film which I have not seen but heard good things about:

"This is not just a film about cycling, but a psychological exploration of what drives athletes to compete; the masochistic pursuit of victory, to the point of self-destruction," said Erskine.

"It will look in detail at the nature of what it means to be a sporting champion and what great victories mean, in the controversial context of the doping allegations that continue to plague the sport.”

Obviously the life story of Marco is a difficult one with much myth and mystery surrounding it, many friends, colleagues and family have a different take on what happened, what went wrong but also what was right about such a great cycling talent and after this years Giro & Tour I can't help but wish there were a couple more riders like him in the peloton.

The film is scheduled for release next May. More here and here.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Yes, cant wait for this film to come out.

 

[Caruut]

Hope they put a subtitled release out.

 

[cineteq]

Obviously the life story of Marco is a difficult one with much myth and mystery surrounding it, many friends, colleagues and family have a different take on what happened, what went wrong but also what was right about such a great cycling talent and after this years Giro & Tour I can't help but wish there were a couple more riders like him in the peloton.

The film is scheduled for release next May.

One of the producers is the same guy that did the documentary: Senna, which was excellent to say the least.

 

[Machu Picchu]

Hope they put a subtitled release out.

It's by a UK comapny and will also be released on dvd by Channel 4.

One of the producers is the same guy that did the documentary: Senna, which was excellent to say the least.

Yes I mentioned that also did 'Man on a Wire' which I have seen and enjoyed.

 

[Arnout]

I didn't like the Senna documentary that much. Well, it's beautiful to watch, but not as a documentary. The producer chose to go for the duel style, with the good guy Senna and the bad guy Prost. Brilliantly entertaining, not really true. I hope he stays closer to the truth in the Pantani movie.

Nevertheless, looking forward to it. We can't have enough cycling movies (there aren't a lot of them anyway).

 

[Parrot23]

Italians like mixed up people. Otherwise they wouldn't have voted for Berlusconi. As much as they want to take Berlusconi down they also admire him for using every single dodgy method to stay in power. It's the Italian way.

Maybe a cultural thing liking a "good" scoundrel. Momma's boy, etc. Very sweet. Ditto for Pantani. Throw in a dash of melodrama and pride too, and you have wonderful "sauce" for the hoi polloi. Ditto Ricco: a **** you attitude vs. say an Anglo like Rogers who is too nerdy for some to stomach and evokes unfortunate retching among some posters (re if you are going to "cheat", it's thought by some, you have to do it with some panache--a sort of, "Be a Johnny Depp vs. Wayne Newton" type phenom). Not me, though.

Just the sort of guy to bust up the Sky train, and ruffle a few feathers of the unhip.

 

[the asian]

Certainly awaiting the release of this film on one of my favourite cyclists.
Is it based on the book by Matt Rendell.

 

[Zam_Olyas]

That is true. Seems to be a cultural thing. They do seem to like a "good" scoundrel. Momma's boy, etc. Very sweet. Ditto for Pantani. Throw in a dash of melodrama and pride too, and you have wonderful "sauce" for the hoi polloi. Ditto Ricco: a **** you attitude vs. say an Anglo like Rogers who is too nerdy for some to stomach and evokes unfortunate retching among some posters (re if you are going to "cheat", it's thought by some, you have to do it with some panache--a sort of, "Be a Johnny Depp vs. Wayne Newton" type phenom). Not me, though.

A self-ordained professors tongue
too serious to fool.

bob dylan in my back pages.

 

[movingtarget]

If ever a Tour needed an Elephantino it was this year's !

 

[SafeBet]

Italians like mixed up people. Otherwise they wouldn't have voted for Berlusconi. As much as they want to take Berlusconi down they also admire him for using every single dodgy method to stay in power. It's the Italian way.

Quite a generalization isn't it? As if everybody liked Berlusconi while he was in charge. Half the population has never admired him, nor voted for him. Aren't they italians as well?

As for Pantani, he was a national hero until he tested positive, then truly abandoned by all of the mass media and the majority of the fans. The amount of people who left the sinking ship right away, I've never seen anything like that. They felt completely betrayed (and rightfully so, if you ask me). But to say italians liked him because he was mixed up, it's distorting reality.

The Italians are very passionate about all sports and cycling is still hugely popular in Italy.

I have watched many races throughout Europe but I was struck by the passion and knowledge of the Italian fans or casual roadside spectator has.
In Italy they even have a name for those passionate fans called the tifosi.

Tifosi is the literal translation of fans. It's not a special term for the passionate ones, although the ethimology of the word would suggest otherwise.




Don't actually get why this topic is allowed in this section of the forum.

 

[Eshnar]

Quite a generalization isn't it? As if everybody liked Berlusconi while he was in charge. Half the population has never admired him, nor voted for him. Aren't they italians as well?

As for Pantani, he was a national hero until he tested positive, then truly abandoned by all of the mass media and the majority of the fans. The amount of people who left the sinking ship right away, I've never seen anything like that. They felt completely betrayed (and rightfully so, if you ask me). But to say italians liked him because he was mixed up, it's distorting reality.



Tifosi is the literal translation of fans. It's not a special term for the passionate ones, although the ethimology of the word would suggest otherwise.




Don't actually get why this topic is allowed in this section of the forum.

+1 to everything (especially the Berlusconi part )
I should add that with his death he gained a certain part of his former followers. Martyr effect.
Anyway I started following cycling in those days, and I can't deny the charisma of Pantani was a factor.
When he got caught the popularity of cycling in Italy dropped like a stone

 

[The Hitch]

Is their not also.an.Italian.film.about pirata from about 07?

 

[Zam_Olyas]

Safebet and eshnar i agree, but i did not even feel like replying them in my previous post.

"A self-ordained professors tongue,too serious to fool"

 

[Eshnar]

Is their not also.an.Italian.film.about pirata from about 07?

I'm afraid I can't tell. Never been much into these kind of films.

 

[Machu Picchu]

Is their not also.an.Italian.film.about pirata from about 07?

There's this but I've never seen it, anyone?

 

[Dekker_Tifosi]

This guy was around a couple years before I began watching cycling. I was just wondering why there is still such a strong following with him? I have done some research on him and he seemed to be a big doper and really the poster boy of the era that cycling wanted to end. I never saw him race so I don't really understand why he is so likable.

Everyone doped in that era, you had no choice. Either dope or become someone who finishes every race as 74th and eventually run out of a job.

 

[perico]

A good read is "The Death of Marco Pantani" by Matt Rendell. Meticulously researched and very well written. Sad story though

Excellent book, and highly recommended.

Pantani was a true (pardon the cliche) "tortured soul" of the peloton. There are very few climbers that were as beautiful to watch going up hill, and I've been watching the sport for 30+ years.

When it comes to Pantani, he's one that I think his fans outside of Italy will seperate the man from the myth. They remember the joy he brought them by his style, and ridiculously over the top persona.

Not to bring you know who into it, but the funniest thing Armstrong ever said was when he referred to Pantani as "an artiste" during the 2000 Tour. The guy referred to himself in the 3rd person.

People also tend to forget that he was Armstrong's most dangerous rival in 2000. They remember Armstrong vs. Ullrich, but it was Pantani who lit up that race, and who I consider the American's greatest rival along with Der Kaiser.

In some ways, it was kind of the same way when you watched Cipollini sprint. Head to head, Cavendish is probably a better sprinter than Cipo, but the Lion King was such a character and more fun to watch (Cavendish is getting more entertaining though), the same could be said about Pantani and his personality. His ego wasn't like Cipo's, but it was still blatantly obvious.

Guys like Pantani and Cipollini were true characters.

 

[perico]

Actually, he is a damned nice guy. Like all of us, he now finds that life has taken a few unexpected turns. And don't we all have to live with the consequences of our decisions?

So the other question was; if Pantani were alive and facing the consequences of his decisions on a daily basis, and in this very public forum, would he still be revered as a Campione' or just another cycling doper has been?

It seems time is a lot tougher on those who hang around to face the music.

This is a good post, as well as the one comparing him to Hamilton. Personally, I don't hate him or bash him or anyone else. From Pantani to Riis, to Armstrong, Virenque, Ullrich, Hamilton... they all had their demons and I try not to let my sporting opinions color what I think about any of them personally.

 

[Swifty's Cakes]

This is a good post, as well as the one comparing him to Hamilton. Personally, I don't hate him or bash him or anyone else. From Pantani to Riis, to Armstrong, Virenque, Ullrich, Hamilton... they all had their demons and I try not to let my sporting opinions color what I think about any of them personally.

If he had continually denied doping he would be castigated like LA. If he had been caught, banned and spoken out against doping he would be castigated like David Millar.
If he had been caught, banned kept his mouth shut and got on with racing he would be loved like Vino

 

[Machu Picchu]

If he had continually denied doping he would be castigated like LA. If he had been caught, banned and spoken out against doping he would be castigated like David Millar.
If he had been caught, banned kept his mouth shut and got on with racing he would be loved like Vino

The first two are full of **** and cared too much for their own image, the third just raced.

 

[la.margna]

I went to his home town recently in Cesenatico. It’s a sleepy beach town and a little naff. Think Blackpool in Italy but with much much better food (and women).

In each and every cafe, bar and restaurant was a photo of the man himself. Next to a picture of Jesus.

I was told the day he attacked Ullrich in the 98 Tour everyone ran from their shops, bars and homes to the beach where they had large screens erected. They crowd were shouting "Pantani, attacco, attacco!" in football like chants.

He is held up like a God. A good description of him is “quixotic”. The Times in London gave him this title and best describes the man.

Italians like mixed up people. Otherwise they wouldn't have voted for Berlusconi. As much as they want to take Berlusconi down they also admire him for using every single dodgy method to stay in power. It's the Italian way.

Very nice comment. I couldn't have put it in better sentences/words. Pantani vive. sempre. Everybody knows he was full, but nobody cares. A victim of the times. Sad, that it had to end this way. But that's life.

 

[gustienordic]

The first two are full of **** and cared too much for their own image, the third just raced.

Which is why, I suppose that Vino may be the most loved "recent" past doped cyclist.

 

[Vino attacks everyone]

Which is why, I suppose that Vino may be the most loved "recent" past doped cyclist.

"the awesome one" is quite loved indeed

 

[TylerDurden1]

Senna and Man on Wire were both great. Can't wait, this docu should be good