Mathieu Van der Poel

[Rollthedice]

Another fairytale.

 

[the delgados]

Ha! Nice.
It's like watching the coronation of a kid produced by Genevieve Jeanson and Frank Vandenbrouck who was delivered and nurtured over the years by Dr. Ferrari.
Unreal.

 

[Akuryo]

And people thought Ricco looked obvious. The Cobra was a joke compared to the current Van der Poel show. But he's not a climber, nothing to see here...

 

[Red Rick]

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

 

[the delgados]

Re:

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

And so on and so forth and more of the same.
I submit that someone who thinks a neo-pro who wins a 250 km race against the best in the world are living in denial. Like a ten-year old kid who refuses to believe his hero cheated.
What we saw today is definitely not normal.
No doubt MVDP agrees. See him slap his helmet after crossing the line? It's like, Holy schit! This stuff really works!
Waiter! Give me some more, please.

 

[Gigs_98]

Re:

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

In all honesty though, can someone be so much better than everyone else in a worldwide sport? I mean I genuinely cannot remember a more dominant performance in a one day race and so often in the past did I already think "no way that dude is not doping" despite the performances being less unreal.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Re: Re:

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

In all honesty though, can someone be so much better than everyone else in a worldwide sport? I mean I genuinely cannot remember a more dominant performance in a one day race and so often in the past did I already think "no way that dude is not doping" despite the performances being less unreal.

I think it's possible, yes. But then there usually are some physical traits (abnormalities) to go along with that. For instance, Michael Phelps had freakishly long arms...

 

[the delgados]

Re: Re:

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

In all honesty though, can someone be so much better than everyone else in a worldwide sport? I mean I genuinely cannot remember a more dominant performance in a one day race and so often in the past did I already think "no way that dude is not doping" despite the performances being less unreal.

I think it's possible, yes. But then there usually are some physical traits (abnormalities) to go along with that. For instance, Michael Phelps had freakishly long arms...

And Usain Bolt has freakishly long legs; and the Australian swimmer Thorpe has fin-like feet; and Lance invented cadence; and most recently, the guy formerly from GCN claimed that human physiology has evolved since the Armstrong era.
Uh huh.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

In all honesty though, can someone be so much better than everyone else in a worldwide sport? I mean I genuinely cannot remember a more dominant performance in a one day race and so often in the past did I already think "no way that dude is not doping" despite the performances being less unreal.

I think it's possible, yes. But then there usually are some physical traits (abnormalities) to go along with that. For instance, Michael Phelps had freakishly long arms...

And Usain Bolt has freakishly long legs; and the Australian swimmer Thorpe has fin-like feet; and Lance invented cadence; and most recently, the guy formerly from GCN claimed that human physiology has evolved since the Armstrong era.
Uh huh.

What

 

[the delgados]

@Red Rick
I think the guy's name is Matt Stephens, but I could be wrong; he used to work for GCN. Anyway, check out a video posted on Youtube where he goes on a ride/interview with Alex Dowsett (sp?) from Katusha. They're just shootin' the stool when at one point the guy mentions the enormous gains made by modern technology that does not include next level doping. I could be wrong, but I am pretty sure he mentions gains in physiology.

 

[armchairclimber]

I watched that video and chuckled ... thinking, that'll be in the clinic before long.

 

[Red Rick]

Re: Re:

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

In all honesty though, can someone be so much better than everyone else in a worldwide sport? I mean I genuinely cannot remember a more dominant performance in a one day race and so often in the past did I already think "no way that dude is not doping" despite the performances being less unreal.

Statistically very unlikely.

Though I do really think this performance gets a little too much credit cause Fuglsang and Alaphilippe were *** around so much.

 

[JosephK]

Re: Re:

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

In all honesty though, can someone be so much better than everyone else in a worldwide sport? I mean I genuinely cannot remember a more dominant performance in a one day race and so often in the past did I already think "no way that dude is not doping" despite the performances being less unreal.

Statistically very unlikely.

Though I do really think this performance gets a little too much credit cause Fuglsang and Alaphilippe were **** around so much.

Just this. The MVDP show for Amstel Gold was brow-raising, but it pales in comparison with truly outlandish/alien shows we've seen in the recent past -- for instance, Dawg's stage 19 at the 2018 Giro.

 

[Ripper]

Re: Re:

Hot take:

He won't get busted
The Dutch won't entertain the idea that it might look suspicious
The Dutch will all be surprised pikachu when some 4th rate Austrian gets busted for epo and gasp at how that can happen in a clean sport like cycling

In all honesty though, can someone be so much better than everyone else in a worldwide sport? I mean I genuinely cannot remember a more dominant performance in a one day race and so often in the past did I already think "no way that dude is not doping" despite the performances being less unreal.

Statistically very unlikely.

Though I do really think this performance gets a little too much credit cause Fuglsang and Alaphilippe were **** around so much.

Just this. The MVDP show for
Amstel Gold was brow-raising, but it pales in comparison with truly outlandish/alien shows we've seen in the recent past -- for instance, Dawg's stage 19 at the 2018 Giro.

The thing is, if they had not be messing about, MvdP would still have unleashed that ridiculous sprint. He was the main person pulling for many km, he was on the front drilling it, and then rode everyone off his wheel and made it look like the rest of the riders were Cat 3s. If they had not messed about he would have at minimum still had a ridiculous 3rd. And who knows, he may have still caught them.

BTW, some of the postings in the RR section are getting a little silly. Basically, folks are going nuts and think he can win anything and everything. The thing with that is, if true, that's actually not a good sign.

 

[42x16ss]

There are people saying VdP can win all 5 monuments, but in reality, Lombardia and probably Liege as well would be a bridge too far for him. At least I hope so, for the state of the sport. If VdP starts climbing like his grandfather something truly stinks.

 

[Mamil]

I've watched very little cyclo-cross - obviously van der Poel is exceptionally good at it, but how much of that particular ability should we expect to translate to the road? For a clearly elite athlete, in particular one with an impeccable family cycling pedigree, how much specific road training and racing should be required before that individual can be hanging with and even beating the likes the Alaphilippe and Kwiatkowski?

Looking purely at his Amstel performance, it was certainly impressive, but there are some extenuating factors. Had Ala and Fuglsang not screwed up he would never have won it, he didn't waste any energy until the last 10k's apart from that one short attack with around 40-odd to go, and, while Simon Clarke is a really solid rider, he's hardly elite and he came 2nd. No question van der Poel's last 3k's and his sprint were remarkable, as his whole spring has been, but I'm not quite convinced that his performances are unbelievable just yet.

On the comment on his future GC ability, well why not, should he ever choose to head down that path? He's naturally stick-thin and tall-ish, not unlike dare I say it Froome or perhaps more relevantly his fellow Dutchman Dumoulin, and obviously has a big engine and Poulidor for a grandfather. I'd find it more believable (relatively) that some others, the Dawg included.

 

[laughingcavalier]

Did he fall into a cauldron when he was a baby?

 

[nayr497]

Who knows, but he certainly has great genes, his father noted his class early on, even compared to his brother, his has experience in numerous disciplines, and truly seems hungry and on-form. And, never hurts to have a home crowd cheering you on, nor what sounds like race radio issues that created some chaos.

 

[Ripper]

And we now folks trying to explain this. Great genes (his dad was busted for doping as well!) There were radio issues (even if he had not won, it would not be terribly believable given to what extent he destroyed everyone else; also, it's not just Amstel). He was good from a young age (no one is saying he was a donkey or this was the ludicrous Froomformation). He certainly generates a fair bit of fanboy fever, which I guess makes sense as he is personable and is exciting as a racer.

 

[meat puppet]

He probably has way above average neuromuscular power thanks to CX and the specificity principle - on top of a very strong aerobic engine. Obviously a good thing to have in the classics.

Believable? Hell no.

 

[armchairclimber]

This is interesting ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDTXlZ3Dg_Q

 

[Cookster15]

Of course his dad was a doper, look at the years he was riding. Irrelevant. But if anyone can make a good case why he is doping more or better than any of the other riders he completely demolished on Sunday after the earlier attacks and huge pull he did I'd be happy to read it.

 

[the delgados]

Re:

Of course his dad was a doper, look at the years he was riding. Irrelevant. But if anyone can make a good case why he is doping more or better than any of the other riders he completely demolished on Sunday after the earlier attacks and huge pull he did I'd be happy to read it.

As has been mentioned, MVDP is a terrific bike racer. Of that there is no doubt.
I am not a doctor, but I agree that the fact his dad was on the gear is irrelevant. But I don't agree with the insinuation that doping was a big problem in the past compared to now.
I cant answer your question, but I think looking at money earned and connections would be a great place to start.

 

[red_flanders]

Re:

Of course his dad was a doper, look at the years he was riding. Irrelevant. But if anyone can make a good case why he is doping more or better than any of the other riders he completely demolished on Sunday after the earlier attacks and huge pull he did I'd be happy to read it.

Because doping isn't pervasive now?

But no, no case to be made that he's doping more or better than everyone else. Seems most likely that most of the top riders are doping, just as they have been for a long, long time. Dope or not, the guy is obviously a huge talent. Unlike some riders who only came to the fore after taking on new programs.

 

[Logic-is-your-friend]

Re:

This is interesting ... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDTXlZ3Dg_Q

Can you tell us what is interesting, or what part specifically. Never had much love for the man, even before i thought he doped. So i'm not about to sit through 33 minutes if him babbling unless i know why, lol.