Michael Barry

[jam pants]

I did a quick scan of the thread. No mention of Roland Green? For me, that killed the image of MTB XC a clean event (in North America, at least).

 

[D-Queued]

No. You have to recall that after the Ben Johnson doping incident at Seoul in 1988, the Canadian government held a Commission of Inquiry into doping in sport. Canada was the first country in the world to do this. The Dubin Inquiry had subpoena power and all of the top athletes and coaches of the day were obliged to testify and the root of the problem was determined. Substantial recommendations were made that have ultimately caused institutions such as the Canadian Centre for Ethics in Sport to be instituted.

Unfortunately this did not seem to affect cycling

Which is exactly my point.

No need to offer the history lesson.

Ben was so 1988.

Now we have the biggest doping scandal in sport... and... ???

Hejesdal and Barry, unfortunately did not have the moral courage to overcome the culture of doping unique to cycling and in my view they are embarrassments to Canada. ...

Our views are aligned.

...
No. Clara took Barry at face value just like huge numbers of people took Armstrong, Ullrich, Contador etc at face value. Barry doped while at USPS whose special omerta has been well documented by former USPS riders and USADA's reasoned decision. Clara was just as shocked as anyone at Barry's involvement with drugs. ...

Link??

.... But there is a lot of talk about Axel in the cycling community and a lot of people are concerned about his role in development.

Given that I spend hours and hours per week in the 'cycling community' clear across the country, and given that I am as outspoken about doping in the 'community' as I am on these pages, I am struck by the fact that I haven't heard ANY such talk beyond these forum.

Nada.

Maybe it is only restricted to the Kelowna environs.

Dave.

 

[Neworld]

Given that I spend hours and hours per week in the 'cycling community' clear across the country, and given that I am as outspoken about doping in the 'community' as I am on these pages, I am struck by the fact that I haven't heard ANY such talk beyond these forum.

Nada.

Maybe it is only restricted to the Kelowna environs.

Dave.

Thank you for the post Dave.

Is there any truth that MB will be involved in the Milton VeloD intiative?

 

[D-Queued]

Thank you for the post Dave.

Is there any truth that MB will be involved in the Milton VeloD intiative?

Good question. I thought he already was.

Time to update myself.

Dave.

 

[Neworld]

Good question. I thought he already was.

Time to update myself.

Dave.

I found this but it only says that doper Michael was present, I am still not sure if he is apart of the admin, organization or other.

http://www.canadiancyclist.com/dailynews.php?id=25626

PS: my comments are my own and do not reflect, in any way, on Neworld. Milton is getting close to home. Cheers

 

[spetsa]

On a bike manufacturer forum Ryder was called out by close followers from the North American circuit, going as far as calling him a blight on his category. Clearly more than a few knew. Why it never got much traction before his confession? Not a clue really.

Health Net=cleans

 

[purcell]

I remember that Chris Shepard and Mike Vine got a positive test but Seamus in 1997?
Maybe you can refresh my memory on that one as I thought this recent admission was his first?

Yeah I guess we should look to all the clean guys that were cheated out of their chances to get any perspective on the PRO experience? Looking backward and only Allison comes up clean. I assume you are not suggesting they are telling young innocents to dope now? No doubt we wish they made better choices and I suppose if they all were clean then Canada would have no successful cyclists as role models. I get they are not such good roe models but they were there in the heat of the problem and coping like just about all the players at the time.
Most of the riders I know that were robbed of opportunity were women and Jeansen was the thief.
The real dirt was in the background. More than any other Canadian athlete there were more red flags over that girl and her coach but the National team selectors were falling all over themselves to kiss JJ and AA's tails. At the 2003 wolds support riders are cozen by JJ and Lynn without much consideration of a team. 2 stars got their choice of support riders and lift consideration of those riders resume. Several very accomplished riders were passed over so JJ could have the domestique she wanted as was Lynn.
No one was listening to the suspicion around JJ yet the same structure would not let Luca race in Seoul Korea because he was working outside the Canadian team structure. He won the trials. He never failed a drug test. He was the best Sprinter. He watched the race. Hypocrisy is rampant everywhere.
So do we throw out the past and all the players? do we ignore what these people know about the sport and its dark side? do we only use bright fresh young coaches with no experience and start over?
You call Axel a pariah but he is doing a lot in Kelowna for the sport and the growth of youth. I am pretty sure they are not teaching micro dosing either.
By all accounts John is a good president and has represented Canada well. I doubt he can do more to stop anyone from coaching or working in cycling when they are not under some suspension.
The Gran Fondo's that Axel and Seamus organize provide participation events that certainly do a lot to increase general participation in cycling. They both capitalize on famous riders names for recognition. For most people riding with Axel is riding with the son of the greatest racer ever. For most Canadians I really don't think these past transgressions are reasons to avoid these athletes now.
MB turned out to be just another of a long list of pros that when faced with that dark choice, succumbed to the dark side. Maybe it might have been better that Canadians could not make it in Europe but that was not what happened. We as racing fans probably knew this all along yet we were there to see our stars rip it up and we still are.
You are supporting those riders now by coming here. You prove you are interested and you are participating. You can go to the start of these Fondo's and carry a sign outlining your opposition to these people. Will that stop anyone form participating? maybe a few won't take the start but they are there for their reasons and I think for reasons not about Axel's past. Axel brings Cache. this brings interest. Interest generates sponsor dollars. those dollars provide a positive cycling experience so in fact we are getting a positive return on past deeds. I get that if these people are perpetuating the past then lets catch them at it. That would do something for credibility.
I believe these past sinners can bring positive things to the sport including a change for the better. If anything they are probably some of the best resources for change since they won't be so naive.
Today I think only Allison Sydor came out of that generation as an honest Canadian champion but I wonder whether she would have done as well if she started 5 years later? As storied and successful as she was her marketability today is not attracting the sponsors that Axel or Hesjedal are.
Too bad all our Canadians were not so honest.

I live in the midst of this and due to my life to date many of these people are "friends" ... Used loosely.

I am not concerned that Axel is teaching kids how to dose, and I am confident that Ron Hayman would not be within 100 miles of it if he was, I am concerned about the mentality of the people that turn out for these things. The crowd that turn out for anything with Merckx's name attached are different than the crowd that turn out for the whistler GF.

Mid 40 year olds with veins popping on their arms, legs and shoulders and single digit body fat numbers are not normal, no matter how much you ride your bike and this is a common sight at the Merckx events. It's like " he knows what we're all about" .... But during the GF you have a bunch of kids events that Alison Sydor leads, and what the kids are seeing is a bunch of adults hopped on steroids and T.

I did a climbing camp with Axel a few years ago and that crowd was nuts. Guys had driven in from Calgary to "race" the hills.

They are middle aged folks with jobs, what the hell is the payoff??

 

[DirtyWorks]

I did a climbing camp with Axel a few years ago and that crowd was nuts. Guys had driven in from Calgary to "race" the hills.

They are middle aged folks with jobs, what the hell is the payoff??

Some variation of "Now that I have my professional life sorted out, I want to do this thing that has totally captured my attention" Most sports have some variation of it.

Cycling in combination with some T is pretty potent anti-aging.

 

[Master50]

I live in the midst of this and due to my life to date many of these people are "friends" ... Used loosely.

I am not concerned that Axel is teaching kids how to dose, and I am confident that Ron Hayman would not be within 100 miles of it if he was, I am concerned about the mentality of the people that turn out for these things. The crowd that turn out for anything with Merckx's name attached are different than the crowd that turn out for the whistler GF.

Mid 40 year olds with veins popping on their arms, legs and shoulders and single digit body fat numbers are not normal, no matter how much you ride your bike and this is a common sight at the Merckx events. It's like " he knows what we're all about" .... But during the GF you have a bunch of kids events that Alison Sydor leads, and what the kids are seeing is a bunch of adults hopped on steroids and T.

I did a climbing camp with Axel a few years ago and that crowd was nuts. Guys had driven in from Calgary to "race" the hills.

They are middle aged folks with jobs, what the hell is the payoff??

TO FEEL YOUNG AND VIBRANT sorry caps lock. have you no imagination? oh you are young and kicking b u t t (censored? really?)
getting old sucks
they can afford it
they love how they feel
If you don't get it now. you will.
I came home after a trip to Colorado and for the first MTB ride in 15 years I kept up with the front guys. I have no trouble "getting it". I am living it. That said I'd buy an altitude tent before I'd take drugs. Some social lubricants excepted.

 

[purcell]

TO FEEL YOUNG AND VIBRANT sorry caps lock. have you no imagination? oh you are young and kicking b u t t (censored? really?)
getting old sucks
they can afford it
they love how they feel
If you don't get it now. you will.
I came home after a trip to Colorado and for the first MTB ride in 15 years I kept up with the front guys. I have no trouble "getting it". I am living it. That said I'd buy an altitude tent before I'd take drugs. Some social lubricants excepted.

I can't tell if you are serious or not.

I am 54. I grew up riding with a lot of these guys, and have spent my life riding with guys that are routinely discussed on these pages.

I am 54, I'm getting older and it is wonderful, and it sucks.

But I'm doing without any help. I just have contempt for the non-pro "athletes" who are so damned concerned about staying young that they are willing to take ****. Pathetic really.

I just can't believe the crowd that flock to the Merckx events here. You can smell the stuff from a mile away.

 

[the delgados]

No. Clara took Barry at face value just like huge numbers of people took Armstrong, Ullrich, Contador etc at face value. Barry doped while at USPS whose special omerta has been well documented by former USPS riders and USADA's reasoned decision. Clara was just as shocked as anyone at Barry's involvement with drugs.

Good one.

 

[the delgados]

Sorry, I meant to quote the sentence written by another poster about how Clara was shocked by Barry's admission.

I find that very hard to believe. Maybe I'm missing something. It wouldn't be the first time.

 

[RobbieCanuck]

D-Queued

No need to offer the history lesson. Ben was so 1988. Now we have the biggest doping scandal in sport... and... ???

People today think the Armstrong Lie is the biggest doping scandal in sport because USADA said it was, and because for years Armstrong was cycling's biggest "star" and as you say Johnson is so 1988.

But in the doping world, as opposed to the cycling world, the Ben Johnson scandal was the biggest sporting scandal, and you still see posters in the Clinic raise the Johnson scandal. The Johnson scandal exposed the underbelly of doping in track and field, because the Dubin Inquiry had the power of subpoena. All the players had to take the stand on national TV no less. The point I was trying to make is the process is what ferreted out the truth about doping. And at that time no other nation had the ba))s to order a judicial inquiry into doping.

The point being that for doping to be eradicated it is necessary to have a subpoena power process with teeth.

Given that I spend hours and hours per week in the 'cycling community' clear across the country, and given that I am as outspoken about doping in the 'community' as I am on these pages, I am struck by the fact that I haven't heard ANY such talk beyond these forum.

Nada. Maybe it is only restricted to the Kelowna environs. Dave.

Perhaps I should have said the local cycling community in the Okanagan. But recall this post by Neworld last week,

"3. Axel Merckx - Married to a Canadian Triathlete and coach of young Canadian kids in Victoria and Kelowna (http://amydf.org). He should be banned from coaching and developing young Canadian athletes. Axel is rancid. What is worse is that he has been recognized and partnered with Cycling BC and the Canadian Cycling Association...Mr. Tolkamp, John 604 737-8258 President John.tolkamp@gmail.com https://twitter.com/jtolkamp Allowing AM access to young Canadian riders is a direct attack on building a clean sport in our Nation and Mr. Tolkamp is presently responsible for dealing with this."

So obviously there is a lot of talk in the cycling community to prompt Neworld to make this solicitation in the Clinic. Its a big country Dave!

 

[RobbieCanuck]

D-Queued

Re: Clara Hughes

Originally Posted by RobbieCanuck
...
No. Clara took Barry at face value just like huge numbers of people took Armstrong, Ullrich, Contador etc at face value. Barry doped while at USPS whose special omerta has been well documented by former USPS riders and USADA's reasoned decision. Clara was just as shocked as anyone at Barry's involvement with drugs. ...

Link??

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1449961#post1449961

Excerpt,
“After being encouraged by the team, pressured to perform and pushed to my physical limits I crossed a line I promised myself and others I would not: I doped. ... I apologize to those I deceived. I will accept my suspension and any other consequences. I will work hard to regain people’s trust.”

 

[Fortyninefourteen]

D-Queued

Re: Clara Hughes

Originally Posted by RobbieCanuck
...
No. Clara took Barry at face value just like huge numbers of people took Armstrong, Ullrich, Contador etc at face value. Barry doped while at USPS whose special omerta has been well documented by former USPS riders and USADA's reasoned decision. Clara was just as shocked as anyone at Barry's involvement with drugs. ...

Link??

http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showthread.php?p=1449961#post1449961

Excerpt,
“After being encouraged by the team, pressured to perform and pushed to my physical limits I crossed a line I promised myself and others I would not: I doped. ... I apologize to those I deceived. I will accept my suspension and any other consequences. I will work hard to regain people’s trust.”

There is no chance that Clara is complicit in any of Barry's bul5hit. He has been in hiding, literally, since his disrobing and avoiding anyone from the cycling community.

 

[Catwhoorg]

According to the Times, Barry’s book stops short of any other major revelations. Unlike other recent tell-all books, including Tyler Hamilton’s The Secret Race, which pulled back the curtain on illicit doping programs inside the peloton, Barry makes no major revelations about Sky.

In fact, he claims that Sky is otherwise racing clean, and did not expose any illegal doping practices during his three years with the British outfit, which has won two consecutive Tours de France, with Bradley Wiggins (2012) and Chris Froome (2013).

Read more at http://velonews.competitor.com/2014...-dont-use-tramadol_325617#ejjWMP662br9iBr8.99

 

[caryopsis]

There is no chance that Clara is complicit in any of Barry's bul5hit. He has been in hiding, literally, since his disrobing and avoiding anyone from the cycling community.

That may have been true until recently, but now he has been given the opportunity to tour around with others to promote the PanAm Games and the Milton Velodrome (and theoretically the future of Canadian cycling)...

 

[Fortyninefourteen]

That may have been true until recently, but now he has been given the opportunity to tour around with others to promote the PanAm Games and the Milton Velodrome (and theoretically the future of Canadian cycling)...

Fukc me......

 

[muddyarse]

That may have been true until recently, but now he has been given the opportunity to tour around with others to promote the PanAm Games and the Milton Velodrome (and theoretically the future of Canadian cycling)...

Yeah, not quite in hiding.

 

[badbrainaj]

Axel is still working with a development team ?

 

[DirtyWorks]

In fact, he claims that Sky is otherwise racing clean

How many years do we wait for this to become a work of fiction?

 

[purcell]

Axel is still working with a development team ?

In conjunction with others, Axel runs the Axel Merckx Youth Development Foundation.

Board is a group of locals (funny I was never asked to join! - imagine that). I really don't think (with one exception) that they have a clue how the sausage is actually made so a perfect group.

But Axel gets to host the really young kids at MTB camps, and road camps and what not.

I don't know if the Bissell team counts as a development team anymore, but the AMYDF is certainly a development project.

 

[Neworld]

Yeah I guess we should look to all the clean guys that were cheated out of their chances to get any perspective on the PRO experience? Looking backward and only Allison comes up clean.

Yes we should feel sorry for the former clean and cheated athletes, those are the people with the moral fabric I want in my society. Is Allison S the only clean Canadian rider you can come up with? Try again.

I assume you are not suggesting they are telling young innocents to dope now?

No, but they are dopers. Axel was a big doper...just watch the 1998 - 2006 TdF to see who and how he was climbing/with on final ascents to solidify that fact. He came in 10th in 1998 TdF...completely clean. There are many non-dopers that can coach our future generation and failure to recognize that Canadian Cycling associations need to completely separate from those know dopers is a mistake.

No doubt we wish they made better choices and I suppose if they all were clean then Canada would have no successful cyclists as role models

I would rather have positive, inspiring, non-doping coaches and role models that we can now acknowledge and advocate for. And, being able to tell young minds with big dreams that yes these Canadian riders weathered the storm, didn't dope and as you see now from the massive LA et al. blow-back those clean riders made the right choice. Its like having kids...almost anyone can make them, its raising them properly that is the hard part.

I get they are not such good roe models but they were there in the heat of the problem and coping like just about all the players at the time

Are you honestly of this opinion? I think you are lost in a confused state trying to make sense of something that is ethically wrong. Maybe you like to live in a sports related world where you make concessions for people with low moral standards but I do not. We're not talking about a person in a war scenario that stole food from someone else to survive. Canadian kids have innumerable opportunities to find honerable work, education and sporting satisfaction without cheating. So no, they are the least likely people to be role models in any future (ie: we have an opportunity to choose better prospective) cycling environment. As with Michael Barry and any future Velodrome/National Track riding plans, he is the absolute last person to seek out, not only because he was a doper, but he has yet to tell the whole truth.

Why doesn't MB write a vividly open and honest book about his past and doping, and send 10 or 20% of the profits to the Canadian centre for ethics in sports, or WADA, or help WADA catch cheaters like him. Give back to the sport in that capacity? Because MB doesn't care about cycling or the future in Canada, just that he can now transition into being a journalist or sports author. You have read 'inside the postal' book or fallacies right?

His recent touching Twitter blogs about athletes being overly taxed to seek out success in whatever means necessary is meaningless given his past lies and doping activities.

So do we throw out the past and all the players? do we ignore what these people know about the sport and its dark side? do we only use bright fresh young coaches with no experience and start over?

Yes, see above. BTW are you serious or is this just some stream of consciousness and personal monologue?

You call Axel a pariah but he is doing a lot in Kelowna for the sport and the growth of youth. I am pretty sure they are not teaching micro dosing either.

Are you telling us that Axel is the only person capable of doing a lot for cycling in BC? Axel is a massive doper and cheat that has no chance of gainful employment, and his wife wants to stay in BC, so he is doing whatever he can under the radar to make a go of it. His 'doing' is not without selfishness.

The Gran Fondo's that Axel and Seamus organize provide participation events that certainly do a lot to increase general participation in cycling. They both capitalize on famous riders names for recognition.

No worth the exposure and I disagree with your myopic view(s)

You are supporting those riders now by coming here. You prove you are interested and you are participating.

Sorry Master50, you have NO idea why I read these entries. Are you one the riders that paid 20K to ride with Lance in Alberta?

I believe these past sinners can bring positive things to the sport including a change for the better.

I disagree. I think they should be used to find other cheats, to help WADA devise plans to reduce the ways they can beat tests and then allowed to humbly retire and remove themselves from cycling forever.

 

[RobbieCanuck]

That may have been true until recently, but now he has been given the opportunity to tour around with others to promote the PanAm Games and the Milton Velodrome (and theoretically the future of Canadian cycling)...

Yes but the others have way more cred and cache than Barry - Hartnett and Bauer.

 

[D-Queued]

...

Given that I spend hours and hours per week in the 'cycling community' clear across the country, and given that I am as outspoken about doping in the 'community' as I am on these pages, I am struck by the fact that I haven't heard ANY such talk beyond these forum.

Nada. Maybe it is only restricted to the Kelowna environs. Dave.

Perhaps I should have said the local cycling community in the Okanagan. But recall this post by Neworld last week,

"3. Axel Merckx - Married to a Canadian Triathlete and coach of young Canadian kids in Victoria and Kelowna (http://amydf.org). He should be banned from coaching and developing young Canadian athletes. Axel is rancid. What is worse is that he has been recognized and partnered with Cycling BC and the Canadian Cycling Association...Mr. Tolkamp, John 604 737-8258 President John.tolkamp@gmail.com https://twitter.com/jtolkamp Allowing AM access to young Canadian riders is a direct attack on building a clean sport in our Nation and Mr. Tolkamp is presently responsible for dealing with this."

So obviously there is a lot of talk in the cycling community to prompt Neworld to make this solicitation in the Clinic. Its a big country Dave!

Hmmm...

I think you just confirmed what I said.

Anything beyond these forums???

And, when I asked for a link on Clara, I meant a quote or SOMETHING from Clara. NOT another quoted post from these forums.

Still waiting.

Dave.