Agreed on the weigh in, but then the argument will be that they will still do it and just not have time to rehydrate which also threatens their health.
A better way would be to do some longitudinal weight testing, and not allow fighters to fight in a weight class that is say less than a few % below their average weight over time. Say it is 3%, then a WW could not fight at that weight if their avg was over 175 over a certain time. That would cut all this *** out pronto.
So, I stay up until midnight and I get rewarded with an early stoppage. What a joke that was.
A better way would be to do some longitudinal weight testing, and not allow fighters to fight in a weight class that is say less than a few % below their average weight over time. Say it is 3%, then a WW could not fight at that weight if their avg was over 175 over a certain time. That would cut all this *** out pronto.
So, I stay up until midnight and I get rewarded with an early stoppage. What a joke that was.
- Jul 18, 2010
- 1,301
- 34
- 10,530
The point of the weigh-ins the day before is that it lessens the likelihood of having to scratch a fight from the card because a fighter could not make weight. The UFC offers a fighter a 2-hour waiver before a fighter is declared to have missed weight, after which "the commission" has the option of offering the fighters a "catch-weight" fight. And that change requires the fight contract be renegotiated to the agreement of both camps. Which can't happen in the twinkling of an eye.
Ostensibly this is done for the benefit of both the fighters and the fans, when in fact it robs the fans because it fair guarantees that when two 155-pound fighters enter the cage, both will weigh significantly in excess of 155, and neither of them might be fighting at their full potential.
If the weigh-in were two hours ahead of the fight, UFC probably would have to drop the 2-hour waiver because then they would be guaranteeing that one fighter will be significantly less well re-hydrated because the other had a two hour head start.
It seems like all the Brazilians are known for high levels of weight-cutting, starting with Anderson Silva, who usually fights at middleweight but walks around at heavy. Last year, Renan Barao was forced out of UFC 177 after falling and hitting his head in the bathtub while cutting weight. And earlier this year, Chris Cyborg famously tweeted this snap three days after competing at 145:
In 2012, Cyborg reportedly was advised by a cardiologist it would be too dangerous for her to cut to 135 (then the target weight for a fight with Ronda Rousey). If this photo is legit, I can see why. That would be a 23% cut, and according to Jeff Novitzky, loss of 15% of bodyweight from dehydration runs the risk of "imminent death."
The problem obviously is systemic in the sport but the UFC in particular has a unique tool to regulate fighter weight in the form of the (USADA-administered) OOC testing. Come up with a number, say 5%, and a fighter can weigh no more than 5% more than his weight class allows when the OOC is administered. A 155 pound fighter can weigh no more than 162. If he's 163, he gets 30 minutes in the 'loo, then re-weighed. Blood and urine are taken only after the weigh-in to preclude the use of prohibited laxatives or diuretics. If he fails, he automatically loses 20% of his purse, and is guaranteed an additional OOC no less than one week before the scheduled event. If he fails to make weight at the second OOC, he is DQed.
A simpler and less costly method, one perhaps applicable to lesser venues, is to have two weigh-ins, one 25 hours before the opening fight (as is the habit now in the UFC), and another on fight day, roughly two hours prior to the scheduled fight, and before the fighter is allowed to enter his dressing room. The weigh-in the day before satisfies the prompters' need to eliminate no-shows, and the second weigh-in should reduce "weight cheating" because no one could afford to remain significantly dehydrated for ~23 hours before a competition.
The promoters might carp at this because the public weigh-in is a relic of the olden days of prizefighting, when fighters were weighed in public so to assure both weights were on the up-and-up. And they might not want the additional expense of a second public weigh-in, but there's no reason it should not be done in private when performed by an accredited official.
And I see no reason the UFC could not implement both. Include a weigh-in in every OOC, and weigh fighters twice before every fight.
Ostensibly this is done for the benefit of both the fighters and the fans, when in fact it robs the fans because it fair guarantees that when two 155-pound fighters enter the cage, both will weigh significantly in excess of 155, and neither of them might be fighting at their full potential.
If the weigh-in were two hours ahead of the fight, UFC probably would have to drop the 2-hour waiver because then they would be guaranteeing that one fighter will be significantly less well re-hydrated because the other had a two hour head start.
It seems like all the Brazilians are known for high levels of weight-cutting, starting with Anderson Silva, who usually fights at middleweight but walks around at heavy. Last year, Renan Barao was forced out of UFC 177 after falling and hitting his head in the bathtub while cutting weight. And earlier this year, Chris Cyborg famously tweeted this snap three days after competing at 145:
In 2012, Cyborg reportedly was advised by a cardiologist it would be too dangerous for her to cut to 135 (then the target weight for a fight with Ronda Rousey). If this photo is legit, I can see why. That would be a 23% cut, and according to Jeff Novitzky, loss of 15% of bodyweight from dehydration runs the risk of "imminent death."
The problem obviously is systemic in the sport but the UFC in particular has a unique tool to regulate fighter weight in the form of the (USADA-administered) OOC testing. Come up with a number, say 5%, and a fighter can weigh no more than 5% more than his weight class allows when the OOC is administered. A 155 pound fighter can weigh no more than 162. If he's 163, he gets 30 minutes in the 'loo, then re-weighed. Blood and urine are taken only after the weigh-in to preclude the use of prohibited laxatives or diuretics. If he fails, he automatically loses 20% of his purse, and is guaranteed an additional OOC no less than one week before the scheduled event. If he fails to make weight at the second OOC, he is DQed.
A simpler and less costly method, one perhaps applicable to lesser venues, is to have two weigh-ins, one 25 hours before the opening fight (as is the habit now in the UFC), and another on fight day, roughly two hours prior to the scheduled fight, and before the fighter is allowed to enter his dressing room. The weigh-in the day before satisfies the prompters' need to eliminate no-shows, and the second weigh-in should reduce "weight cheating" because no one could afford to remain significantly dehydrated for ~23 hours before a competition.
The promoters might carp at this because the public weigh-in is a relic of the olden days of prizefighting, when fighters were weighed in public so to assure both weights were on the up-and-up. And they might not want the additional expense of a second public weigh-in, but there's no reason it should not be done in private when performed by an accredited official.
And I see no reason the UFC could not implement both. Include a weigh-in in every OOC, and weigh fighters twice before every fight.
Re:
Fights would be better with two athletes at/near their true weight.
Those athletes would lose to the ones who didn't have to cut (or cut as much) therefor a true weight fighter would win (most of the time), and the big weight cutting would quickly end.Spawn of e said:
Fights would be better with two athletes at/near their true weight.
Re:
It wouldn't take too long for fighters to be in their natural weight class if their pay checks disappear.StyrbjornSterki said:The point of the weigh-ins the day before is that it lessens the likelihood of having to scratch a fight from the card because a fighter could not make weight. The UFC offers a fighter a 2-hour waiver before a fighter is declared to have missed weight, after which "the commission" has the option of offering the fighters a "catch-weight" fight. And that change requires the fight contract be renegotiated to the agreement of both camps. Which can't happen in the twinkling of an eye.
Ostensibly this is done for the benefit of both the fighters and the fans, when in fact it robs the fans because it fair guarantees that when two 155-pound fighters enter the cage, both will weigh significantly in excess of 155, and neither of them might be fighting at their full potential.
If the weigh-in were two hours ahead of the fight, UFC probably would have to drop the 2-hour waiver because then they would be guaranteeing that one fighter will be significantly less well re-hydrated because the other had a two hour head start.
It seems like all the Brazilians are known for high levels of weight-cutting, starting with Anderson Silva, who usually fights at middleweight but walks around at heavy. Last year, Renan Barao was forced out of UFC 177 after falling and hitting his head in the bathtub while cutting weight. And earlier this year, Chris Cyborg famously tweeted this snap three days after competing at 145:
In 2012, Cyborg reportedly was advised by a cardiologist it would be too dangerous for her to cut to 135 (then the target weight for a fight with Ronda Rousey). If this photo is legit, I can see why. That would be a 23% cut, and according to Jeff Novitzky, loss of 15% of bodyweight from dehydration runs the risk of "imminent death."
The problem obviously is systemic in the sport but the UFC in particular has a unique tool to regulate fighter weight in the form of the (USADA-administered) OOC testing. Come up with a number, say 5%, and a fighter can weigh no more than 5% more than his weight class allows when the OOC is administered. A 155 pound fighter can weigh no more than 162. If he's 163, he gets 30 minutes in the 'loo, then re-weighed. Blood and urine are taken only after the weigh-in to preclude the use of prohibited laxatives or diuretics. If he fails, he automatically loses 20% of his purse, and is guaranteed an additional OOC no less than one week before the scheduled event. If he fails to make weight at the second OOC, he is DQed.
A simpler and less costly method, one perhaps applicable to lesser venues, is to have two weigh-ins, one 25 hours before the opening fight (as is the habit now in the UFC), and another on fight day, roughly two hours prior to the scheduled fight, and before the fighter is allowed to enter his dressing room. The weigh-in the day before satisfies the prompters' need to eliminate no-shows, and the second weigh-in should reduce "weight cheating" because no one could afford to remain significantly dehydrated for ~23 hours before a competition.
The promoters might carp at this because the public weigh-in is a relic of the olden days of prizefighting, when fighters were weighed in public so to assure both weights were on the up-and-up. And they might not want the additional expense of a second public weigh-in, but there's no reason it should not be done in private when performed by an accredited official.
And I see no reason the UFC could not implement both. Include a weigh-in in every OOC, and weigh fighters twice before every fight.
You missed it. What a fight. It was close and he finally got him down and mounted in 3. It should have been stopped in 3. Same thing happened halfway thru 4, Weidman ate alot, all busted up bad. He was eathing all kinds of elbows and fists.
I thought Rockhold would gas, he was breathing hard pretty quickly in round 1 and 2, which is unusual for him. I thought Weidman would wear him down and get him in the 4th or 5th. After the fight he admitted he had a staff infection and was on antibiotics. That explains it, 100% Rockhold wins easily.
I thought Rockhold would gas, he was breathing hard pretty quickly in round 1 and 2, which is unusual for him. I thought Weidman would wear him down and get him in the 4th or 5th. After the fight he admitted he had a staff infection and was on antibiotics. That explains it, 100% Rockhold wins easily.
OMFG. I changed the channel 30 seconds after Aldo hit the floor, can't bear to listen to this clown.
- Mar 25, 2013
- 5,389
- 0
- 0
Totally agree. An absolute clown. We will never hear the end of it over here.
He has a huge following and he's been covered incessantly by the Irish media, but I'm far from alone in my dislike of him. Remember Poirier said he got loads of responses from Irish people hoping he would beat him before his fight. I still can't forget that disgraceful press conference up in Dublin where he grabbed Aldo's belt and shouting that "King of Dublin" nonsense. And then flashing the money and saying to people who criticise him that he will wipe away his tears with his money. I could go on and on.
An idiot.
He has a huge following and he's been covered incessantly by the Irish media, but I'm far from alone in my dislike of him. Remember Poirier said he got loads of responses from Irish people hoping he would beat him before his fight. I still can't forget that disgraceful press conference up in Dublin where he grabbed Aldo's belt and shouting that "King of Dublin" nonsense. And then flashing the money and saying to people who criticise him that he will wipe away his tears with his money. I could go on and on.
An idiot.
But, his act is making him and the UFC lots of money. Controversy and blatant BS sells over respect and grace. See Donald Trump.
I caught the back end of an interview with him at that round table with some media guy, Sonnen, and another couple of guys (maybe one was Melendez?) on ESPN. He actually seemed normal, was respectful and was not in his public persona mode.
Anyway, Aldo needs to go away and regroup. That was a disgusting performance, and he was psyched out. I never paid alot of attention to Aldo except for a few fights, and I never watched how he acted right before fights but you could tell he didn't want to be there during introductions. He was not bouncing around, he just stood in one place and looked at the ground. Never looked up even when they went to the center. He hardly moved in the 5 minutes after he got to the ring until the bell. I felt he was screwed even before the bell.
Hard to imagine a champion of his pedigree could be gotten to like that, but he is humble and quiet and had never been disrespected like that in MMA and he couldn't handle it IMO. He will lose the Macgregor 10/10 times now.
He should not get an immediate rematch, not after that debacle and the way Aldo lost, and his body language in the ring. Even GSP had to regroup and fight Koscheck before he got another shot. Yes, people get caught and if that was the only thing in play then i would be open to immediate rematch, but that is not what happened IMO.
The fight I want to see is Macgregor vs Cerrone. Redneck Cerrone would talk alot of *** in return and brings alot of fans. He wouldn't sit there and take the *** Aldo did, and it would fuel him. There would also probably be fights in the audience.
I caught the back end of an interview with him at that round table with some media guy, Sonnen, and another couple of guys (maybe one was Melendez?) on ESPN. He actually seemed normal, was respectful and was not in his public persona mode.
Anyway, Aldo needs to go away and regroup. That was a disgusting performance, and he was psyched out. I never paid alot of attention to Aldo except for a few fights, and I never watched how he acted right before fights but you could tell he didn't want to be there during introductions. He was not bouncing around, he just stood in one place and looked at the ground. Never looked up even when they went to the center. He hardly moved in the 5 minutes after he got to the ring until the bell. I felt he was screwed even before the bell.
Hard to imagine a champion of his pedigree could be gotten to like that, but he is humble and quiet and had never been disrespected like that in MMA and he couldn't handle it IMO. He will lose the Macgregor 10/10 times now.
He should not get an immediate rematch, not after that debacle and the way Aldo lost, and his body language in the ring. Even GSP had to regroup and fight Koscheck before he got another shot. Yes, people get caught and if that was the only thing in play then i would be open to immediate rematch, but that is not what happened IMO.
The fight I want to see is Macgregor vs Cerrone. Redneck Cerrone would talk alot of *** in return and brings alot of fans. He wouldn't sit there and take the *** Aldo did, and it would fuel him. There would also probably be fights in the audience.
- Jul 18, 2010
- 1,301
- 34
- 10,530
Ye gods, did Rockhhold man-handle Weidman or what? I was shocked. Then again -- and excuse me beating a dead horse -- that was another case of one fighter looking significantly bigger than the other. He not only was Rockhold taller than Weidman, his every limb was more thickly muscled. None of which detracts from the fact that Luke Rockhold. is. One. Stud. Duck.
I really admire Herb Dean's restraint not stopping that fight at the end of the third. It was actually "Big John" McCarthy who forced UFC management in the early days to accept the principle of empowering the referees to stop the contest if one fighter was "no longer intelligently defending himself." All through that ground-and-pound, Weidman continued to show intelligent decision making, just not effective defense. And I give Herb credit for being in the proper place to observe minute details to assess whether a fighter is trying to carry on, or has simply lost the will to fight and is hoping the referee ends it. Herb was so close during that exchange, he literally was in peril of being struck by a stray blow. And I trust he was in a better position that I was to judge whether a stoppage was warranted.
If it had been Mario Yamasaki instead of Herb Dean, he'd have stopped the fight when the fighters touched gloves at the start of the first.
I honestly think the Aldo-McGregor fight was the most shocking finish I ever have seen to a fight (shocking as in astonishing, not shocking as in seeing one fighter's tibia wrap around his opponent's knee). It was like the finish to Rocky II, when both fighters knock each other down. Truly a Hollywood ending. If McGregor's left hadn't switched off Aldo, Aldo's counter left might very well have switched off McGregor. And it was over in a flash. The precision of that shot gives me to think McGregor had studied Aldo's fight films and noticed he dropped his shoulder when he threw the right.
And now Dana White is speculating that McGregor's next fight might be a lightweight title match.
Speaking of "Big John," it's good to see him back in the ring in 'Vegas. He lost his Nevada licence when he left the UFC for a spell, and for years after, Nevada refused to reinstate it, simply stating, "We have all the referees we need, thank you very much."
And speaking of leaving the UFC, did anyone else notice who Wladimir Klitschko's cut man was in the loss to Tyson Fury? It was Stitch Duran, AKA Jeraldo Santana, former UFC cut man. Good to see he's not fallen on hard times for a mere (anti-Rebok) slip of the tongue.
I really admire Herb Dean's restraint not stopping that fight at the end of the third. It was actually "Big John" McCarthy who forced UFC management in the early days to accept the principle of empowering the referees to stop the contest if one fighter was "no longer intelligently defending himself." All through that ground-and-pound, Weidman continued to show intelligent decision making, just not effective defense. And I give Herb credit for being in the proper place to observe minute details to assess whether a fighter is trying to carry on, or has simply lost the will to fight and is hoping the referee ends it. Herb was so close during that exchange, he literally was in peril of being struck by a stray blow. And I trust he was in a better position that I was to judge whether a stoppage was warranted.
If it had been Mario Yamasaki instead of Herb Dean, he'd have stopped the fight when the fighters touched gloves at the start of the first.
I honestly think the Aldo-McGregor fight was the most shocking finish I ever have seen to a fight (shocking as in astonishing, not shocking as in seeing one fighter's tibia wrap around his opponent's knee). It was like the finish to Rocky II, when both fighters knock each other down. Truly a Hollywood ending. If McGregor's left hadn't switched off Aldo, Aldo's counter left might very well have switched off McGregor. And it was over in a flash. The precision of that shot gives me to think McGregor had studied Aldo's fight films and noticed he dropped his shoulder when he threw the right.
And now Dana White is speculating that McGregor's next fight might be a lightweight title match.
Speaking of "Big John," it's good to see him back in the ring in 'Vegas. He lost his Nevada licence when he left the UFC for a spell, and for years after, Nevada refused to reinstate it, simply stating, "We have all the referees we need, thank you very much."
And speaking of leaving the UFC, did anyone else notice who Wladimir Klitschko's cut man was in the loss to Tyson Fury? It was Stitch Duran, AKA Jeraldo Santana, former UFC cut man. Good to see he's not fallen on hard times for a mere (anti-Rebok) slip of the tongue.
Joe says Aldo looks soft, deflated, and nervous on UFC control room audio feed. Steroid implications?
https://www.reddit.com/r/MMA/comments/3wokwd/joe_says_aldo_looks_soft_deflated_and_nervous_on/
@jeremybotter: "Post-USADA Dos Anjos is a different human than the one who won the belt. Looks shockingly different."
https://twitter.com/jeremybotter/status/676118832520368129
Dave Meltzer-"Everyone is remarking that Dos Anjos is Much Smaller"
https://www.reddit.com/r/MMA/comments/3wn70h/dave_meltzereveryone_is_remarking_that_dos_anjos/
They don't look any different to me, but these guys see them up close and in person.
https://www.reddit.com/r/MMA/comments/3wokwd/joe_says_aldo_looks_soft_deflated_and_nervous_on/
@jeremybotter: "Post-USADA Dos Anjos is a different human than the one who won the belt. Looks shockingly different."
https://twitter.com/jeremybotter/status/676118832520368129
Dave Meltzer-"Everyone is remarking that Dos Anjos is Much Smaller"
https://www.reddit.com/r/MMA/comments/3wn70h/dave_meltzereveryone_is_remarking_that_dos_anjos/
They don't look any different to me, but these guys see them up close and in person.
- Jul 18, 2010
- 1,301
- 34
- 10,530
McGregor is medically suspended for six months, or until his left wrist is X-rayed and declared healthy, whichever comes first.
Same with Rockhold's left foot and ankle.
McGregor made half a mil USD, not including any as-yet undisclosed win bonus. Aldo made $400,000 in total.
There's no news yet of a McGregor-Aldo rematch, and the rumour among the MMA forums is that Dana was looking for a way to ditch Aldo because his lack of flamboyancy limited his gate appeal.
Same with Rockhold's left foot and ankle.
McGregor made half a mil USD, not including any as-yet undisclosed win bonus. Aldo made $400,000 in total.
There's no news yet of a McGregor-Aldo rematch, and the rumour among the MMA forums is that Dana was looking for a way to ditch Aldo because his lack of flamboyancy limited his gate appeal.
Good press conference:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37KwXmGoD1w
Good interview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLBwC8XbQ8U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=37KwXmGoD1w
Good interview:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLBwC8XbQ8U
- Jul 18, 2010
- 1,301
- 34
- 10,530
Great fight card last night for a "Fox TV" show. One thing really caught my eye:
'Reem left, 2011, 263 pounds; 'Reem right, this weekend, 243 pounds.
Did I mention he was busted in 2012 for a T/E ration of 10:1?
'Reem left, 2011, 263 pounds; 'Reem right, this weekend, 243 pounds.
Did I mention he was busted in 2012 for a T/E ration of 10:1?
- Apr 30, 2014
- 9,605
- 393
- 22,381
Wow, that's disturbing to think that the UFC was allowing these obviously doped fighters to get in the ring.StyrbjornSterki said:Great fight card last night for a "Fox TV" show. One thing really caught my eye:
'Reem left, 2011, 263 pounds; 'Reem right, this weekend, 243 pounds.
Did I mention he was busted in 2012 for a T/E ration of 10:1?
I'm glad the anti-doping policy that was brought in is having some sort of affect. I'm sure the policy isn't perfect but those two pictures clearly show a doped fighter (left pic) and a much less doped (right pic) or (perhaps) clean fighter.
In 2011 I think he was with StrikeForce so it wasn't the UFC letting him fight "top fuel". Just like other sports though, many/most bend the rules a far as they can and sometimes they get busted.Irondan said:Wow, that's disturbing to think that the UFC was allowing these obviously doped fighters to get in the ring.StyrbjornSterki said:Great fight card last night for a "Fox TV" show. One thing really caught my eye:
'Reem left, 2011, 263 pounds; 'Reem right, this weekend, 243 pounds.
Did I mention he was busted in 2012 for a T/E ration of 10:1?
I'm glad the anti-doping policy that was brought in is having some sort of affect. I'm sure the policy isn't perfect but those two pictures clearly show a doped fighter (left pic) and a much less doped (right pic) or (perhaps) clean fighter.
- Dec 7, 2010
- 8,770
- 3
- 0
I'm hoping that reading these last few posts that you guys and gals don't actually believe this UFC stuff is clean?
None and I mean 0 are clean in my opinion.
That sport is set up perfect to juice.
None and I mean 0 are clean in my opinion.
That sport is set up perfect to juice.
One Championship bans weight cutting by dehydration
http://onefc.com/news/611-one-championship-revolutionizes-mma-with-new-weigh-in.html
http://onefc.com/news/611-one-championship-revolutionizes-mma-with-new-weigh-in.html
TRENDING THREADS
-
Tre Valli Varesine 2025, one day race, October 7- Started by Lequack
- Replies: 150
-
European Championship 2025: Men’s RR, October 5- Started by Berniece
- Replies: 854
-
World Championship 2025: Men’s RR, September 28- Started by Berniece
- Replies: 2K
-
World Championship 2025: Men’s ITT, September 21- Started by Berniece
- Replies: 942
-
Teams & Riders The Remco Evenepoel is the next Eddy Merckx thread- Started by DNP-Old
- Replies: 35K
-
Teams & Riders Tadej Pogačar discussion thread- Started by Lequack
- Replies: 40K
-
European Championship 2025: Men’s ITT, October 1- Started by Berniece
- Replies: 278
Facebook
Twitter
Instagram