More on the Betsy Andreu & Lance. Now with Sally Jenkins

[Dr. Maserati]

Deleted? Well, journalism it indeed a dying animal. Regardless of who or what I believe, I NEVER believe any opinion or view should be censored. It makes me want to puke when I see damage control like that going on.

Mr Wilcockson and Ms Jenkins appear to fall lock step into the belief that ignoring and suppressing information and people that run counter to your line of thinking is OK in journalism. That my friends is the production of propaganda. I honestly fear we are forgetting what real journalism is in favor of popularity and profit.

Yes - deleted - I believe it was taken down within a day.

 

[elizab]

No you're okay thanks. To invite someone so controversial that has tried to bring down the biggest name in cycling, for no obvious reason that anyone can work out, would not be welcome. Indeed it would be trollery.

If you want to suck up to her, continue to send her supportive emails. Don't drag down the forum.

Gonna drag down the forum soon just for the Arbiter! Can't wait to get the fun started but I have to finish reading these posts first.

Betsy

 

[Kennf1]

Gonna drag down the forum soon just for the Arbiter! Can't wait to get the fun started but I have to finish reading these posts first.

Betsy

He' already banned. But welcome!

 

[elizab]

I don't know where to start. I'm kind of surprised that my back and forth with Sweet Sally is being discussed.

Just a correction: Bill Stapleton was not in that room.
HIPPA prevents anyone from that hospital staff to speak about anything they know about this hospital incident.
Also, people forget that James Startt testified that Stephanie told him about the hospital incident in detail i.e. that it did happen. That's overlooked.
It's midnight in Detroit in case people want to say I'm blogging 24/7

 

[Dr. Maserati]

I don't know where to start. I'm kind of surprised that my back and forth with Sweet Sally is being discussed.

Just a correction: Bill Stapleton was not in that room.
HIPPA prevents anyone from that hospital staff to speak about anything they know about this hospital incident.
Also, people forget that James Startt testified that Stephanie told him about the hospital incident in detail i.e. that it did happen. That's overlooked.
It's midnight in Detroit in case people want to say I'm blogging 24/7

Welcome Betsy - and I am delighted to see you join in here.

This thread is only one of a number where the Hospital confession was discussed. I know James Stratts input was discussed on the thread "Why LA is Not a Doper (Seriously)".

That is why there isn't too much detail on this thread as it was discussed in greater detail on other threads!

 

[131313]

Bill Stapleton was not in that room.
HIPPA prevents anyone from that hospital staff to speak about anything they know about this hospital incident.
Also, people forget that James Startt testified that Stephanie told him about the hospital incident in detail i.e. that it did happen. That's overlooked.
It's midnight in Detroit in case people want to say I'm blogging 24/7

Hey, you can blog at all hours as far as I'm concerned. A quick correction: HIPPA (sic) isn't retroactive so no one is bound by it's terms discussing incidents prior to 2003.

 

[Ozzie2]

Betsy be so careful

Think every post, every post, how might those committed to preserving the status quo exploit your words against you, potentially, one day.

My sad experience is that Whistleblowers_only_come out of it with their integrity. Don't risk that for/ on us.

Nonetheless your insight on cyclist psychology and life in the peleton will be enlightening and appreciated

 

[El Imbatido]

Wow. Betsy Andreu posting in the topic i created. This is awesome and thank you. I am not trying to offend you and i will apologise if i do but, is it you? Betsy? I only ask as anyone can make up a screenname and pretend to be someone they are not. ie. We already have a person posting on this forum under the screenname "the Hog" as he tries to impersonate Brunyeel.

As for you, ive got a couple of things to say. Starting with "You go Girl" I love the way you tell them where to stick and stand up for what you know and believe in. That is inspiring. Please never back down from you guns as if it is true and there seems to be a bucketload (for lack of a better word) of evidence suggesting this then i want it exposed. It might be the worlds biggest sporting fraud but i believe it would go a long way toward helping the sport eventually clean itself up once and for all.

I admire what you are doing and really hope you succeed so just keep on keeping on and eventually your time and effort will be rewarded. Please give my best regards to Frankie as well as your self.

 

[Nick777]

I don't know where to start. I'm kind of surprised that my back and forth with Sweet Sally is being discussed.

Just a correction: Bill Stapleton was not in that room.
HIPPA prevents anyone from that hospital staff to speak about anything they know about this hospital incident.
Also, people forget that James Startt testified that Stephanie told him about the hospital incident in detail i.e. that it did happen. That's overlooked.
It's midnight in Detroit in case people want to say I'm blogging 24/7

If this is the real Betsy, welcome to the forum & well done for not backing down.

 

[Zen Master]

If this is the real Betsy

This is real Betsy Andreu if you ask me !?
Welcome on board elizab

 

[scribe]

Bring me up to speed. How did this person ever get into position to testify regarding what was said at this meeting? In other words, how did it become known they were privy to overhearing a specific conversation as it might relate to professional accomplishments by Armstrong years after the fact?

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

Welcome aboard indeed, elizab. Though it's true some may try to twist your words against you, I have this feeling you're pretty used to that and can handle yourself.

Sure (cyclists talk about doping amongst each other), and what keeps it silent for the most part is that many of those people are also your only real friends.

That's a real interesting aspect of this entire conversation. In that original link, at one point Betsy points out that Lance talks to Frankie because he knows Frankie is one of his only friends through the years*. This is interesting because it implies that most people around Lance are likely leaches, or hangers on, and Frankie never was. And, someone correct me if you think I'm extrapolating, Frankie knows a lot about Lance, and despite "only" testifying under oath and defending Betsy, hasn't really revealed anything damning about Lance, and despite a lot of negative things happening to his post-cycling career, he remains mum, even rather gentlemanly about the whole thing.

Also lost in this entire conversation is the IM swap between Frankie and JV. Not sure if elizab or anyone else wants to divert the conversation that direction though.

* I just checked and can't find it, but I know she wrote it. It seems the Post deleted a few of Betsy's posts there, and only left one up.

 

[Anonymous]

1. You are Trolling
2. Lance's Cancer Doctor, Dr. Nichols, was not his doctor at the time of the incident.
3. You are a Troll
4. If you are from the UK why would you write "Take the 5th"? There is no 5th amendment in Britain.
5.Isn't it past your Troll bedtime, or is the meth keeping you up?

to be fair, its a very commonly used phrase in britain.. its all the ****e american tv we have been force fed for the last ten years

 

[Digger]

Bring me up to speed. How did this person ever get into position to testify regarding what was said at this meeting? In other words, how did it become known they were privy to overhearing a specific conversation as it might relate to professional accomplishments by Armstrong years after the fact?

Considering Betsy is actually here, maybe we should let her answer this herself. However, how I understand it is this: The incident occured in 1996. Rumours were circukating in cycling circles for years after. People like Lemond and David Walsh heard it. David Walsh phoned Betsy, and Betsy was shocked that Walsh even knew about it. Initially Betsy wouldn't speak to Walsh about the incident. This to me should make sh** of the idea that Betsy was out to get Lance or had an 'axe to grind'. Then the laywers for SCA were doing their research and investigating, and they didn't have to look too hard to find out about the hospital room. So Betsy and Frankie were subpoenaed to testify at the SCA trial.

I stand corrected by Betsy on this obviously. But this is my understanding of the chain of events.

Some people say that Betsy fell out with Lance and invented this incident as payback. But a number of Betsy's friends (names revealed) told David Walsh they vividly recall where and when Betsy told them about this back when it occured (not later), as Betsy was about to marry Frankie and didn't know what to make of what she had just heard. Obviously the implication of hearing Lance say this was, what the h*** is my husband to be doing in this sport?

 

[tubularglue]

Also lost in this entire conversation is the IM swap between Frankie and JV. Not sure if elizab or anyone else wants to divert the conversation that direction though.

* I just checked and can't find it, but I know she wrote it. It seems the Post deleted a few of Betsy's posts there, and only left one up.

page 306 scroll down

http://books.google.com/books?id=zJ9IOdnm5mQC&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q=&f=false

 

[Anonymous]

to be fair, its a very commonly used phrase in britain.. its all the ****e american tv we have been force fed for the last ten years

Yea, and we also love to take your TV ideas and "Americanize" them. I am just pissed that NBC squashed "Top Gear" here, though I have to say that there is no way on earth that it could have been nearly as entertaining as your version.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

page 306 scroll down

I mean the quotes by Betsy on the Post's website (link on page 1 of this thread), that's what was deleted - where Betsy says that Frankie is actually one of Lance's only true friends through the years, which is why Lance is comfortable talking to him on TV . And I don't think she was being smart.

But yes, L2L is a very good read, and anyone with an open mind should buy and read it.

 

[elizab]

Considering Betsy is actually here, maybe we should let her answer this herself. However, how I understand it is this: The incident occured in 1996. Rumours were circukating in cycling circles for years after. People like Lemond and David Walsh heard it. David Walsh phoned Betsy, and Betsy was shocked that Walsh even knew about it. Initially Betsy wouldn't speak to Walsh about the incident. This to me should make sh** of the idea that Betsy was out to get Lance or had an 'axe to grind'. Then the laywers for SCA were doing their research and investigating, and they didn't have to look too hard to find out about the hospital room. So Betsy and Frankie were subpoenaed to testify at the SCA trial.

I stand corrected by Betsy on this obviously. But this is my understanding of the chain of events.

Some people say that Betsy fell out with Lance and invented this incident as payback. But a number of Betsy's friends (names revealed) told David Walsh they vividly recall where and when Betsy told them about this back when it occured (not later), as Betsy was about to marry Frankie and didn't know what to make of what she had just heard. Obviously the implication of hearing Lance say this was, what the h*** is my husband to be doing in this sport?

This incident was the "secret" that so many cycling knew about. When The Troll (David) called me asking me if it were true, what shocked me is how accurate he was in retelling it to me. So no, I was never The Troll's source for this hospital incident. As I said, many people knew about this and obviously many people talked about it. James Startt testified that Stephanie told him about this hospital incident as well. That in and of itself (along with Stephanie's own admission that it did happen when not under oath) should refute that this story is somehow concocted. Craig Nichols, by the way, was never in the room when this happened. (He also happens to be a doctor who never asks his patients what medications or drugs his patients are using.)

We were subpoenaed to testify and went so far as having our lawyer tell SCA that we didn't have to comply with the subpoena because it wasn't under Michigan jurisdiction. SCA went through the Michigan courts and voila, the fun began.

 

[ggusta]

you're either a. not from london, b. a wum, c. just a thick southerner,

careful with that southern cr@p pal!

Been living in NC since 1994. Aside from frequently leaving my front door open while away from the house and keys in the car while away from the car, there's no difference. ya got yer' thick headed aholes back home, too. Ratio is the same here with a different accent.

I have been on 3 continents. Good and bad everywhere. Mostly good.

'course, when I am stuck behind one going 37.2 mph on a two lane road......

 

[scribe]

anyone got any more on this SCA company, bringing the lawsuit? What little I can find is that it was a texas based insurance company. I can now only find an SCA insurance (life) based out of Colorado.

$7.5mil is an awful lot of money in bonus payment to a cyclist, for a company not so recognizable (at least to me). It seems as if the bonus payment was tied into the 6th tour win, but I have little information as to what they were getting out of the arrangement.

 

[Ozzie2]

careful with that southern cr@p pal!

Been living in NC since 1994. Aside from frequently leaving my front door open while away from the house and keys in the car while away from the car, there's no difference. ya got yer' thick headed aholes back home, too. Ratio is the same here with a different accent.

I agree with you gusta

after just having this emailed to me this morning

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JP5ZVrwmX0g

i have an increased respect for southerners too



(last question - is there a bigger version of that avatar of the lady coming out of the water getting around?)

 

[ggusta]

I agree with you gusta

after just having this emailed to me this morning

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JP5ZVrwmX0g

i have an increased respect for southerners too



(last question - is there a bigger version of that avatar of the lady coming out of the water getting around?)

1st of all, a couple of them looked like they have Dr Ferrari on speed dial. (Or to use the parlance of a major league ball player, they just 'got some supplements at GNC and had no idea what was in them.')

2nd, my neighbor saw this type of fishing on dirty jobs (TV show), he thinks it's awesome and wants to do it, too. Oh yeah, he's originally from California.

 

[coffeebean2]

Craig Nichols, by the way, was never in the room when this happened. (He also happens to be a doctor who never asks his patients what medications or drugs his patients are using.)

That's a pretty sweeping statement. You've personally spoke with all of his patients to make that claim? Or has Dr. Nichols, in some sort of legal or medical document, admitted as such? If so, please post a link to said documentation.

 

[Epicycle]

anyone got any more on this SCA company, bringing the lawsuit? What little I can find is that it was a texas based insurance company. I can now only find an SCA insurance (life) based out of Colorado.

$7.5mil is an awful lot of money in bonus payment to a cyclist, for a company not so recognizable (at least to me). It seems as if the bonus payment was tied into the 6th tour win, but I have little information as to what they were getting out of the arrangement.

http://www.scapromotions.com/main/promotionalRiskCoverage

If you really want a laugh read Armstrong's testimony at the SCA trial. A guy known for being meticulous about every part of his life suddenly can't remember sh!t.

 

[fatandfast]

I am not a Lance hater. The way I read all this, The guy is on his death bed and being candid with his doctors and others. Says some things that he wishes could be forgotten and when they were not, he wiggled his way out of it. The Andreau's seem like good friends to have through thin and thick in Lances case.