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Apr 22, 2012
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BigMac said:
Kokoso said:
How about Amador? I realize that it probably has been discussed here throughly but don't have enough power to read this all. Last year's Giro surprise. In 2012 he couldn't follow Bárta who is not climber at all on Col de Joux, 2045 4th at Giro. Only one proffesional win. Not excatly most expectable result. Not exactly Froomish, but far from what he ever had done before.
Did Amador not win that stage?
he did. And what? That doesn't prove he was better climber there, you know cycling well enough to know that, so why do you react so silly.

Barta went alone on Col de Joux and gain 40 seconds advantage but lost his advantage downhill because his tyres were very slippy so he couldn't descend fast, so Amador passed him downhill and build up a lead. First De Marchi caught with him and Barta caught with them late. True, Barta didn't take leads if I remember correctly. Everything was decided in final sprint, where Barta opened sprint and kind of lead out Amador. There was no time gap between the two. Amador won that stage in the sprint.

So, Amador definitely didn't make the difference uphill. First time non-climber Barta gapped Amador uphill, then he was able to caught Amador uphill again. In one stage. Surely you know that win in the sprint doesn't have to depend on climbing strength.

So does this example show Amadors climbing improved a lot? I'm nut sure but I think rather it does. If Amador was able to make a difference uphill he wouldn't wait for final sprint, would he? These days Amador would never be caught by de Marchi or Barta.
 
Stranger things have happened in GT breakaways ... form (of the day), tiredness from the previous stages, effort put in maintaining the breakaway, and tactics all have an impact. Geschke won a mountain stage from a break with Uran and Pinot.
 
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Gung Ho Gun said:
Stranger things have happened in GT breakaways ... form (of the day), tiredness from the previous stages, effort put in maintaining the breakaway, and tactics all have an impact. Geschke won a mountain stage from a break with Uran and Pinot.
Seems Nans Peters proved my point
 
Apr 22, 2012
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Gung Ho Gun said:
Stranger things have happened in GT breakaways ... form (of the day), tiredness from the previous stages, effort put in maintaining the breakaway, and tactics all have an impact. Geschke won a mountain stage from a break with Uran and Pinot.
You are not catching the point. I've wrote what I've wrote and Big Mac's reaction was, that Amador won the stage, thus implying, that he was the better climber there. That is unfair reaction (and Bic Mac probably knew after he wrote that becase later he didn't bother to elaborate). My point is, that simply stating who won doesn't tell whole story here. That Amador won the stage doesn't mean he was the better climber there.
 
Apr 22, 2012
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Libertine Seguros said:
Kokoso said:
BigMac said:
Kokoso said:
How about Amador? I realize that it probably has been discussed here throughly but don't have enough power to read this all. Last year's Giro surprise. In 2012 he couldn't follow Bárta who is not climber at all on Col de Joux, 2045 4th at Giro. Only one proffesional win. Not excatly most expectable result. Not exactly Froomish, but far from what he ever had done before.
Did Amador not win that stage?
He did. But what of it?
So he couldn't follow Bárta on the Col de Joux... but won the stage by being the best in the break on the climb to Cervinia at the end. So it sounds kind of like Bárta cooked himself by going too hard early in the stage and Amador rode a smarter race, no?
No, not really, I suppose you've at least heard something about sprinting ability, some riders do it better, some do worse and it has nothing to do with smarter race. Amador won that stage in sprint.

But it but it's more complicating than that. Barta went alone on Col de Joux and gain 40 seconds advantage but lost his advantage downhill because his tyres were very slippy so he couldn't descend fast, so Amador passed him downhill and build up a lead. First De Marchi caught with him and Barta caught with them late. True, Barta didn't take leads if I remember correctly. Everything was decided in final sprint, where Barta opened sprint and kind of lead out Amador. There was no time gap between the two. Amador won that stage in the sprint.

So, Amador definitely didn't make the difference uphill. First time non-climber Barta gapped Amador uphill, then he was able to caught Amador uphill again. In one stage. Surely you know that win in the sprint doesn't have to depend on climbing strength.

So does this example show Amadors climbing improved a lot? I'm not sure but I think rather it does. If Amador was able to make a difference uphill he wouldn't wait for final sprint, would he? These days Amador would never be caught by de Marchi or Barta.

P.S. I suppose you've chosen not to react deliberately...wouldn't expect such cowardice from you.
 

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