New site design

[Eyeballs Out]

Tell us some good news

Hi Greg / Stefan

First off, I won't bother repeating what everyone else has said about the new site except to say I agree with them - hopefully your team is working towards fixing everything.

Previously in this thread you've hinted at some improvements to the results database which I'm looking forward to so I was wondering whether you could say anything more about this.

The only thing I found frustrating about the old site was the search engine which was pretty much unusable - so much so that I sometimes thought about writing my own but hopefully that won't be necessary now.

For example it would be fantastic if it was possible to search for a particular rider and see all their results for each season, their results over all seasons in a particular race, their latest news (which might indicate injuries, contract news, race programmes etc), all in chronological order, maybe a biography and so on. I can see that you're already part of the way there now that each rider has their own web page. Could you expand on how you will be developing this ?

Another way for users to access this sort of info would be for the site to have a really good Advanced Search facility (in other words not the awful one from the old site). In fact that would be really helpful regardless. You have a tremendous archive of information but no easy way to access it. For example, say I wanted to find out which races have used a certain climb in the past and in what years - probably not possible from a results database but a good search engine could do this. It would be important that it would search the old autobus site as well as the new site.

So please cheer us up and tell us some good news about what you have planned regarding what I've outlined above

 

[ryanharne]

Simply put: I think I have somewhat rapidly abandoned my use of cyclingnews. This week I quickly adapted to using other sites to get news and photos of the latest events. Sorry to say that I'm leaving after many years of readership (but only a few forum posts–I've never been a big fan of spending time in forums).

I think my frustration and abandonment peaked this morning while trying to find the Paris-Roubaix coverage from this year while browsing earlier this morning. I clicked the Races tab, then scrolled down that page. Kept scrolling. Lots of white space, I noticed. But nothing about past races. Even the current races stemmed at something that began in early June. At that point, I had lost interest in trying to meander around a website that did not contain clear passageways from one section to another, as the previous cyclingnews website was much better with.

Also, the site still crashes in Safari 4 in Mac OS X when you try to access the drop-down menus of any given stage race. For example, switching from Stage 1 to Stage 3 using the drop-down in a Tour du Suisse page.

Best wishes for further development of the site. Frankly, it'd be nice to come back one day. The writing was pretty good.

 

[stefan]

Hi Greg / Stefan

First off, I won't bother repeating what everyone else has said about the new site except to say I agree with them - hopefully your team is working towards fixing everything.

Previously in this thread you've hinted at some improvements to the results database which I'm looking forward to so I was wondering whether you could say anything more about this.

The only thing I found frustrating about the old site was the search engine which was pretty much unusable - so much so that I sometimes thought about writing my own but hopefully that won't be necessary now.

For example it would be fantastic if it was possible to search for a particular rider and see all their results for each season, their results over all seasons in a particular race, their latest news (which might indicate injuries, contract news, race programmes etc), all in chronological order, maybe a biography and so on. I can see that you're already part of the way there now that each rider has their own web page. Could you expand on how you will be developing this ?

Another way for users to access this sort of info would be for the site to have a really good Advanced Search facility (in other words not the awful one from the old site). In fact that would be really helpful regardless. You have a tremendous archive of information but no easy way to access it. For example, say I wanted to find out which races have used a certain climb in the past and in what years - probably not possible from a results database but a good search engine could do this. It would be important that it would search the old autobus site as well as the new site.

So please cheer us up and tell us some good news about what you have planned regarding what I've outlined above

The rider landing page already auto-updates with every article where the rider is updated. Doing the same for results can be done using the same mechanism - this is already on our list.

With regards to search. Give our new one a whirl.. it's got some cool features.

 

[steevemceven]

New design is so slow to load!!!

I have an iPhone and an iTouch and your wonderful new page takes an eternal to load, whether loading via a provider or my wireless router...
I love the layout, but by the time I can actually read the page, my patience has moved onto another site.

Will it ever load any faster or do I move to a different cycling site?

Disappointingly yours,

A once favourite of Cycling News

 

[Greg Johnson]

For example it would be fantastic if it was possible to search for a particular rider and see all their results for each season, their results over all seasons in a particular race, their latest news (which might indicate injuries, contract news, race programmes etc), all in chronological order, maybe a biography and so on. I can see that you're already part of the way there now that each rider has their own web page. Could you expand on how you will be developing this ?

I can't expand - because showing is much easier So, here is how the race results (not, I'm just talking about the hyper linked rider and team names) should be displayed once we fix the results system and the race sections (http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/24th-tour-de-beauce-2-2/stages/stage-6). So the riders pages currently look like this (http://www.cyclingnews.com/riders/benjamin-day) and the teams pages this (http://www.cyclingnews.com/teams/2009/kelly-benefit-strategies).

The idea is that, in time, once a database of results is built up, the results of each rider will also display on their page.

Another way for users to access this sort of info would be for the site to have a really good Advanced Search facility (in other words not the awful one from the old site). In fact that would be really helpful regardless. You have a tremendous archive of information but no easy way to access it. For example, say I wanted to find out which races have used a certain climb in the past and in what years - probably not possible from a results database but a good search engine could do this. It would be important that it would search the old autobus site as well as the new site.

I don't imagine search will extend to the old autobus website, unfortunately. Although a lot of some aspects of the old website - like news and tech - is included in the CMS database.

Have you tried the search functionality on the new website? I'd be keen to hear your feedback on it.

Thanks
Greg Johnson

 

[zyxwvu]

One thing is for sure, Lance let his 1,1 million followers know he doesn't like the new site either:

@lancearmstrong dude! send a letter to the new owners of cyclingnews.com and tell them to put their old format back up they butchered it

@CoryThompson I agree 100%.
about 8 hours ago from web in reply to CoryThompson

 

[stefan]

Okay thanks

Windows XP
Internet Explorer Version 6.0.2900.5512
Home
bandwidth, I'm not sure what that means, but I have unlimited downloads if that is what you mean

Did I get that right?

Oops sorry, broadband.

Pretty much Many thanks.

Our support for Internet Explorer 6 is likely the culprit - IE6 is no longer supported by Microsoft (current version is 8.X), and although we've done what we can to make the site usable in IE6, support for it is 'best effort only'. I obviously have no business telling you which browser to use, but if you at all get a chance to upgrade your Internet Explorer, you will likely see benefits, not just from us, but pretty much all over the web. IE 8 is a free download away:

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/internet-explorer/default.aspx

or Firefox3 if you're that way inclined:

http://www.mozilla.com

If you choose to upgrade from IE6 to pretty much anything else, you will make a lot of web developers happy, not just at Cyclingnews, but everywhere.

 

[danmaas]

What happened to the stage maps and profiles?

Guys,

Where can I find the stage maps and profiles? I really found it nice on your old site to be able to see the profile of a race, so you know when what climb is coming up during a course. Were they removed altogether or are they now somewhere else?

Working at a websdesign firm myself, did you do usability and or A/B testing to compare the new design to the old? I do feel you made some surprising decisions in the new website, such as no clickable photos under the 'stages' tab where you give the race results, dropping the 'related gallery' link from the photo gallery and dropping navigation back to that overview once you've clicked on a photo.

My personal usability bilble is Stev Krug's "Don't make me Think!" (http://www.amazon.com/Think-Common-Sense-Approach-Usability/dp/0789723107). I feel the new CN site requires a little too much thinking to get around.

 

[Lones1]

Pretty much Many thanks.

Our support for Internet Explorer 6 is likely the culprit - IE6 is no longer supported by Microsoft (current version is 8.X), and although we've done what we can to make the site usable in IE6, support for it is 'best effort only'. I obviously have no business telling you which browser to use, but if you at all get a chance to upgrade your Internet Explorer, you will likely see benefits, not just from us, but pretty much all over the web. IE 8 is a free download away:

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/internet-explorer/default.aspx

or Firefox3 if you're that way inclined:

http://www.mozilla.com

If you choose to upgrade from IE6 to pretty much anything else, you will make a lot of web developers happy, not just at Cyclingnews, but everywhere.

Okay, I am downloading the IE8 now. I will let you know if it helps, cause at the moment your site is a mess for me. Thanks for the help

 

[wdymtlrt]

Have you tried the search functionality on the new website? I'd be keen to hear your feedback on it.

Thanks
Greg Johnson

The rider (and teams) database that will be a real improvment. Great! (had to go to radsportnews.com for this)
Tried the search:
"Boonen" gives "No olympics..."
"Ballan" gives "Ballan frustrated [Carcasonne]"
"tour de suisse" gives "gerolsteiner line up..."
"Gerdemann" gives "Gerdemann to CSC"
as first results. You still have some work to do...

 

[Greg Johnson]

Guys,

Where can I find the stage maps and profiles? I really found it nice on your old site to be able to see the profile of a race, so you know when what climb is coming up during a course. Were they removed altogether or are they now somewhere else?

such as no clickable photos under the 'stages' tab where you give the race results, dropping the 'related gallery' link from the photo gallery and dropping navigation back to that overview once you've clicked on a photo.

Pretty much all of this will be changed under the revisions we're currently doing. The intent is to carry the same volume and type of content (maps, profiles, start lists etc.) from races - we've just got to iron it out some.

Cheers
Greg Johnson

PS. I've been over the revisions tonight and asked for some more. It's getting to the point it needs to be at.

 

[danmaas]

Tried the search:
"Boonen" gives "No olympics..."
"Ballan" gives "Ballan frustrated [Carcasonne]"
"tour de suisse" gives "gerolsteiner line up..."
"Gerdemann" gives "Gerdemann to CSC"
as first results. You still have some work to do...

The search is fast and the news is all there, but the sorting of the newsitems is wrong, they're all dated 9-Apr.

 

[lucybears]

The rider (and teams) database that will be a real improvment. Great! (had to go to radsportnews.com for this)
Tried the search:
"Boonen" gives "No olympics..."
"Ballan" gives "Ballan frustrated [Carcasonne]"
"tour de suisse" gives "gerolsteiner line up..."
"Gerdemann" gives "Gerdemann to CSC"
as first results. You still have some work to do...

teams database with Info Riders News etc
http://www.wvcycling.com/ploegen/

 

[danmaas]

Pretty much all of this will be changed under the revisions we're currently doing. The intent is to carry the same volume and type of content (maps, profiles, start lists etc.) from races - we've just got to iron it out some.

Cheers
Greg Johnson

PS. I've been over the revisions tonight and asked for some more. It's getting to the point it needs to be at.

Thanks Greg for the fast reply. Looking forward to seeing these changes coming up.

 

[Eyeballs Out]

I can't expand - because showing is much easier So, here is how the race results (not, I'm just talking about the hyper linked rider and team names) should be displayed once we fix the results system and the race sections (http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/24th-tour-de-beauce-2-2/stages/stage-6). So the riders pages currently look like this (http://www.cyclingnews.com/riders/benjamin-day) and the teams pages this (http://www.cyclingnews.com/teams/2009/kelly-benefit-strategies).

The idea is that, in time, once a database of results is built up, the results of each rider will also display on their page.



I don't imagine search will extend to the old autobus website, unfortunately. Although a lot of some aspects of the old website - like news and tech - is included in the CMS database.

Have you tried the search functionality on the new website? I'd be keen to hear your feedback on it.

Thanks
Greg Johnson

Thanks. I like the hyperlink facility for each rider name in the results page. I wonder whether eventually each rider webpage will have different Tabs - say Bio, Results, News say. Then clicking on the rider hyperlink from the results page could automatically start with the results tab for that rider. Whatever, I think this is a nice step forward and as you say the more results are in this format the more the database will increase and the more useful it will be. Shame it's unlikely to be retrospective but I guess that would be a huge task

I guess what I was hoping for for the search facility were options on how to sort the search results - especially chronologically rather than by "relevance" which I assume it is now - in fact that chronologically, most recent first, would be the default for me; options to search for phrases as well as single words; options to search different types of pages (news/races/tech etc) rather than everything lumped together - basically all the things you can usually do with an Advanced Search on other websites - and of course include the old site with all this but you've already addressed this

 

[Cypome]

Cnn/cn

One question for you - on other news sites (BBC, CNN etc) would you expect them to keep the breaking news off the front page to enable people not to see spoilers?

News stories are now correctly grouped into two editions per day, as you can see.

Do CNN and BBC only report about cycling? I believe that CN only reports about cycling... Since there are limited number of races every day there wouldn't need to be any spoilers to "attract" the attention from a reader - I'm pretty sure that most CN-visitors know cycling very well and know what to look for when they visit the site. To me it seems like you are now focusing on random visitors instead of those cyclingfans who used to visit the site frequently. I wish you good luck with that approach but I'm afraid it won't work to your advantage.

 

[Lones1]

Pretty much Many thanks.

Our support for Internet Explorer 6 is likely the culprit - IE6 is no longer supported by Microsoft (current version is 8.X), and although we've done what we can to make the site usable in IE6, support for it is 'best effort only'. I obviously have no business telling you which browser to use, but if you at all get a chance to upgrade your Internet Explorer, you will likely see benefits, not just from us, but pretty much all over the web. IE 8 is a free download away:

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/internet-explorer/default.aspx

or Firefox3 if you're that way inclined:

http://www.mozilla.com

If you choose to upgrade from IE6 to pretty much anything else, you will make a lot of web developers happy, not just at Cyclingnews, but everywhere.

Okay, I have downloaded IE8, it has upset my printer apparently, but never mind. The site downloads faster now, except getting from the home page to the forum is still slow and I get the white page for about a minute. The site itself is faster. The results of the Tour de Suisse is still weird and hard to read though. Two lines for each person and the different coloured lines is annoying on the eyes, just my thoughts. Never mind though I have a new site that shows it just the way I like it.

I thank you for your help, your are still not forgiven mind. The spoilers for me are a friendship breaker, I am still hoping you can put a link to the live ticker archive or whatever you IT folk do. That way I can read the European races like before, without knowing the ending. I know, I know we have been there before, but you did say it might be possible and I am holding out for that before making my final decision on the new site.

Thank you for all your time and help

 

[lucybears]

Startlsts are back
http://www.cyclingnews.com/races/73rd-tour-de-suisse-2009-upt/start-list

 

[Porzana P]

Okay, no-one is listening, we get it!!

If anyone wants to read the results of the Tour de Suisse in a proper format try this link. They don't do live tickers from what I can see, but they sure beat the double spacing, half the number missing mess on this site.

http://www.roadcycling.co.nz/Results/tour-de-suisse-results.html

Thank you!
This is exactly what I have been looking for since CN messed up big time.

News I can get everywhere.
Statistics about teams and riders cant get any better than this:
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/start.asp
Live ticker is almost always available at organizers websites.

So I guess I have everything covered now,
but still it saddens me that this was the way it would end up,
as i have been visiting this site several times a day for the last 5-6 years or so
but hey! nothing lasts forever.
Thanks for those years, you had the greatest cyclingsite in all aspects!!
but no longer... I´m out of here.

 

[manolo]

CN only reports about cycling... Since there are limited number of races every day there wouldn't need to be any spoilers to "attract" the attention from a reader... you are now focusing on random visitors instead of those cyclingfans who used to visit the site frequently...

This may be a very simple argument, but I think it captures the essence of the no-spoiler argument.

... thank you for your help, your are still not forgiven mind. The spoilers for me are a friendship breaker, I am still hoping you can put a link to the live ticker archive or whatever you... do. That way I can read the European races like before, without knowing the ending... you did say it might be possible and I am holding out for that before making my final decision...

I agree. I, too, would like to know how "we" are coming along with the idea of a "Live-Coverage-only" page/tab or a Stage-Races Table (as in
http://autobus.cyclingnews.com/road/2009/jun09/dauphinelibere09/?id=stages)?

 

[pedrospeeps]

Info on advertisers

Well it seems that the new owners of the cyclingnews brand name currently have little incentive to respond to the hundreds of complaints about the "new look". I would suggest that the best way to get their attention is to make the new change cost them. I for one am going to check out every ad on every page, and then contact all the advertisers and suggest they are doing themselves no favors by advertising on a site that seems hell bent on ****ing off it's readers. My single emails will have little effect, but if all the people who are writing in to this forum to express their displeasure did the same to the advertisers then something might happen. "Money Talks"
I'll bet the guys at VeloNews, Pez, etc. are laughing their asses off right now.

I am sure they are. We need to get those advertisers info up on this forum as I think we can see by the recent post (over night for me) they are getting their mothers to email in with stupid questions about IE8 etc and not the point that the website does not work what ever IE you have computer or cell phone...it is rubbish and will always be until the people that produced this are sacked and a real webpage design company brought tin. So if you can help and post the contact info for these poor advertisers that have also been let down by cyclingnews...they can go else where...we have to spend time setting up our new way to find simple information about the sport we love..I would never get my mother to email in with prepared questions however I need a job...it just shows how shakey these people are.

 

[Ninety5rpm]

If it ain't broke...

I'm a longtime cn fan, visiting the site multiple times per day, on many days, for years. I've given the new format a few days. Maybe it needs a few weeks, but so far I just don't get it. I didn't realize how effective the old format was until now that it's gone.

There are three things I look for:
1) general cycling news (including interview and feature stories)
2) race results
3) live reports

For all the reasons given, the spoilers have to go. I want to be able to come here and read the news from a few hours ago without learning who won the stage about which I am still going to learn on TV or in reading a full live report.

In the old format, everything was plain, but neat and tidy.
Now it looks fancy, but is actually messy.

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it."

You tried to fix something that wasn't broken, and of course you broke it in the process.

 

[pedrospeeps]

Calling the Good Doctors Boss

can you spell ARROGANCE?

Calling the good doctors Boss. He need a holiday and a little time away from his work. He also needs NOT to write anymore on this list...he just does not get it.

Better idea...give him the sack!

 

[lucybears]

1) general cycling news (including interview and feature stories)

your best alternative interview provider
http://interview.cyclingfever.com/

 

[maxlite]

things are looking better.......but its not CN

I keep on coming back, but I still can't get on with this new site...

It just doesn't look right, far too much white space, text font seems very fine/small for such a large amounts of text.

.......not a pleasant experience

Just and added note, I've worked for 40 years as a graphic designer

Thank you!
This is exactly what I have been looking for since CN messed up big time.

News I can get everywhere.
Statistics about teams and riders cant get any better than this:
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/start.asp
Live ticker is almost always available at organizers websites.

So I guess I have everything covered now,
but still it saddens me that this was the way it would end up,
as i have been visiting this site several times a day for the last 5-6 years or so
but hey! nothing lasts forever.
Thanks for those years, you had the greatest cyclingsite in all aspects!!
but no longer... I´m out of here.

Thanks for the link, great site!
http://www.cqranking.com/men/asp/gen/start.asp