Now Alberto is out, who will win the 2012 Tour de France?

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Now Alberto is out, who will win the 2012 Tour de France?

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airstream

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Kvinto said:
There is difference, you just don't get it. You seem to underestimate the psychological aspect of the sport taking into account only physical part of it. The problem being that it's an easier aim just to drop someone you get to see than to drop by certain time as well as it's easier to give your best having a strong rival who would be a good indicator of your own strength. Dropping Contador (ie dropping the best) on Morzine-Avoriaz by some insignificant 10sec gave Andy confidence which the winning against anybody else by a minute would have never gave. I even don't know how to explain :eek:

Why? It seemed to me I overestimate it. :eek: I tried to tell the Hitch and other guys that one real unsuccessful Contador's pull could have influenced seriously on his aspitation to attack further as well as course of fighting in the mountains in general and was ridiculed. :) I partially share your point, though it's all known fact an opponent sitting on your wheel iritates and worsens aerodinamic effects. It is possible to look at that other way. Schleck would have tried a lot earlier, if Contador hadnt been there, and taken much more than 10sec. But we still believe that Contador helped him in there too, alright.. :)
 
Oct 28, 2010
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airstream said:
Why? It seemed to me I overestimate it. :eek: I tried to tell the Hitch and other guys that one real unsuccessful Contador's pull could have influenced seriously on his aspitation to attack further as well as course of fighting in the mountains in general and was ridiculed. :) I partially share your point, though it's all known fact an opponent sitting on your wheel iritates and worsens aerodinamic effects. It is possible to look at that other way. Schleck would have tried a lot earlier, if Contador hadnt been there, and taken much more than 10sec. But we still believe that Contador helped him in there too, alright..

If someone sits on your wheel you get angry and try to ride harder and harder (making efforts you wouldn't have made in any other occasion) to drop the parasite :) So, yes, the presence of Contador helps :p
 
I don't know how Contador helps. In 2010 yes, Madeleine put Andy on the podium. But last year lets see:
- stage to Gap: Contador lights up a stage where nothing was supposed to happen, Andy loses what? 1.30minutes or so
- stage to Alpe: Andy follows Contador in a suicide move. Tired for the last climb failing to put time on Evans and tired for the TT.

So my point is, probably it's better for Andy to race without Contador and especially without doing that attack-looking back-thing.
 
Oct 28, 2010
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trevim said:
I don't know how Contador helps. In 2010 yes, Madeleine put Andy on the podium. But last year lets see:
- stage to Gap: Contador lights up a stage where nothing was supposed to happen, Andy loses what? 1.30minutes or so
- stage to Alpe: Andy follows Contador in a suicide move. Tired for the last climb failing to put time on Evans and tired for the TT.

So my point is, probably it's better for Andy to race without Contador and especially without doing that attack-looking back-thing.

it was only about 2010 when Contador was in his best and only in the aspect of gaining time over the others

Kvinto said:
If someone sits on your wheel you get angry and try to ride harder and harder (making efforts you wouldn't have made in any other occasion) to drop the parasite :) So, yes, the presence of Contador helps :p

btw, to prevent the misunderstanding, i don't mean Alberto is a wheelsucker or so :eek: just a theory
 

airstream

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Mar 29, 2011
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trevim said:
I don't know how Contador helps. In 2010 yes, Madeleine put Andy on the podium. But last year lets see:
- stage to Gap: Contador lights up a stage where nothing was supposed to happen, Andy loses what? 1.30minutes or so
- stage to Alpe: Andy follows Contador in a suicide move. Tired for the last climb failing to put time on Evans and tired for the TT.

So my point is, probably it's better for Andy to race without Contador and especially without doing that attack-looking back-thing.

Then they rather helped each other, otherwise Menchov could have smashed both in TT and won le Tour, considering how the things unfolded..
 
Jan 27, 2011
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18-Valve. (pithy) said:
All this talk about Contador, Riis, Valverde and anti-doping and you support ...............Menchov?! :eek:

My god, you are a trip, Havetts. :)

Haha, I do not "Support" Menchov, I simply said if everyones watching Andy & Cadel there could be someone profiting from that. And that would be Menchov, who I rate higher than Wiggins. Its no secret that Andy will be the best climber, but who will be the best TTr between Wiggo, Cadel and Denis? I think only time will tell.
 
Jul 16, 2010
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Havetts said:
Haha, I do not "Support" Menchov, I simply said if everyones watching Andy & Cadel there could be someone profiting from that. And that would be Menchov, who I rate higher than Wiggins. Its no secret that Andy will be the best climber, but who will be the best TTr between Wiggo, Cadel and Denis? I think only time will tell.

You said "I hope this happens". If you're hoping Menchov wins, then you're being supportive of him.
 
airstream said:
Why? It seemed to me I overestimate it. :eek: I tried to tell the Hitch and other guys that one real unsuccessful Contador's pull could have influenced seriously on his aspitation to attack further as well as course of fighting in the mountains in general and was ridiculed. :)

Umm what did you try to tell me?

I dont recall speaking one way or anohter on this issue.
 

airstream

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Mar 29, 2011
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The Hitch said:
Umm what did you try to tell me?

I dont recall speaking one way or anohter on this issue.

Oh, I can't find it. You responded something sort of Evans and Schleck would have had to use laser into Contador's eyes to restrain him. :)
 
Havetts said:
Haha, I do not "Support" Menchov, I simply said if everyones watching Andy & Cadel there could be someone profiting from that. And that would be Menchov, who I rate higher than Wiggins. Its no secret that Andy will be the best climber, but who will be the best TTr between Wiggo, Cadel and Denis? I think only time will tell.


El Pistolero said:
You said "I hope this happens". If you're hoping Menchov wins, then you're being supportive of him.

Exactly. The anti-doping crusader Havetts made it perfectly clear that he wants him to win.

I guess dopers are okay though if they have a history with Rabobank.
 
Evans trained with Ferrari. And rides for Rhis.

Of course training with Ferrari and riding for Rhis doesnt mean hes a doper but the possibility that someone who trains with Ferrari (and in his 30's becomes the best/2nd best gt rider of his generation), doesnt dope, is roughly the same as the possibility that Contador got the clen from the steak rather than illegal doping.