Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[purcell]

It does (although it doesn't always work)

Thank you, sadly, I think I knew that.

Time zones suck.

 

[Merckx index]

I read it that Weisel, Knaggs, and Stapleton are working on their own deal.....I doubt I am wrong

So much for his friends

That’s consistent with the U.S. reserving the right to dismiss claims against them. As I understand it, the most the government could get (shared with FL) would be about $90 million, and probably it would be more like $60 million. If Weisel and co. are making their own deals, which surely won't be cheap, how much does that leave LA to pay? The government already turned down a $5 million offer.

Wow, the Complaint is an interesting document. It breaks down the money flow between the feds and the defendants, the doping activities, the complicated web of companies set up by Weisel (aka Weisel’s alter egos ). Also gives some info about Armstrong’s salary, $15 million for 2001-2004 plus bonuses.

Paragraph 227 states ‘Tyler Hamilton’s 2011 book The Secret Race’. Shouldn’t that be 2012? Typo? Imagine where things would be today if Tyler’s book came out in 2011.

Where are you getting this info? It's not in the link RR provided.

 

[Athame]

I know this is sort of pathetic but still, . . . I can't wait to see the
"you-know-what eating grin pics" of Floyd getting paid.

 

[northstar]

Where are you getting this info? It's not in the link RR provided.

I got it from RR's earlier post. I see the link does not work now. Something's up I guess.

 

[DirtyWorks]

gentle reminder

Maybe a lawyer can correct me, but I think they go after Tailwind, not individuals in Tailwind. Corporate veil and all that protects the individuals.

I think Tailwind pretends they "have no money."

Still, it was nice to hear on NPR's top-of-the-hour news lead-in. There's a long, long way to go yet though.

 

[Alpe d'Huez]

I read it that Weisel, Knaggs, and Stapleton are working on their own deal.....I doubt I am wrong....so much for his friends

As the old saying goes, there is no honor among thieves.

 

[Briant_Gumble]

The bigger fish affect the ecosystem much more than Lance does. I can see your point but also see the governments view and they don't bite the hand that feeds (more).

Good analogy.

 

[Race Radio]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/126823648/Landis-42-Second-Amended-Complaint-Redacted

If you are having trouble with the original link

A few notes

Armstrong, Heras, and Bruyneel's salary was protected. Everyone else on the team could be asked to take a pay cut if the team was not profitable

The doc also points out how some of their actions were criminal (Schedule III drugs)

Dr. Dag Van Elslande is mentioned as the guy who did the transfusions. He also worked for the UCI as OCC tester

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/1...-also-worked-as-doping-control-inspector.aspx

Weisel contributed $50,000 to Mr. Landis’ defense against doping charges

In or around late 2006 or early 2007, Mr. Landis had a conversation with Jim Ochowicz about how Mr. Landis should respond to the adverse analytical finding he had received in the 2006 Tour de France. The two met at Sheryl Crow’s house in California but Armstrong was not present. At the meeting, Mr. Landis openly referenced the doping program of the U.S. Postal Service team and the fact that he needed help to fight the pending doping
charges against him. Mr. Ochowicz did not express any surprise regarding Mr. Landis’ references to doping on the USPS Team, implicitly indicating he already was aware of the fact, nor did he give any indication in the conversation that he planned to refer the matter to USADA, WADA or UCI for further inquiry. To Mr. Landis' knowledge, Mr. Ochowicz took no such action to inform USADA, WADA, or UCI regarding his conversation with Mr. Landis. Mr. Ochowicz just indicated to Mr. Landis that he would have Lance Armstrong call Mr. Landis.

Weisel’s firm thus received sponsorship benefits for minimal out of pocket cost, while Tailwind continued to struggle financially in need of cash

163. Meanwhile, certain other sponsors were being asked to pay far more for sponsorship rights. Examples include Monarch Beverage Company, which produced Allsport and agreed to pay $250,000 in 2002, $350,000 in 2003, and $400,000 in 2004, plus provide 12,000 water bottles and other products, to sponsor the team. Nike paid $150,000 in cash and provided $165,000 in product at Nike’s landed cost each year between 2001 and 2004. In 2003, discussions were underway with Subaru, which was being asked to pay $400,000 per year (“To Tailwind: $350k” “To CSE (Lance Armstrong): $50k”).

164. Based on the foregoing, Weisel’s firm Thomas Weisel Partners did not pay adequate consideration for its sponsorship benefits during the period that it was a sponsor of the USPS Team

Relator is also informed and believes that Weisel engaged in less than arms-length transactions with other sponsors of the USPS Team.

Mr. Weisel also benefited by his association with the fraudulent successes of the USPS Team through his business relationships with other sponsors. For example, lavish hospitality events hosted by the Team, including events at the Tour de France during the period of the 2000 Sponsorship Agreement, were also attended by team sponsors or others with whom Mr. Weisel had or could potentially have business relationships. Mr. Landis personally attended these events during his tenure on the team and witnessed the attendance of Weisel and of prominent business people and prospective clients of Mr. Weisel’s investment banking firm at these events.

167. Mr. Weisel also benefited from his coordination of Champions Club events. The Champions Club was made up of individuals who had made large donations to the USA Cycling Foundation, whose board was also chaired by Weisel. During Mr. Landis’ tenure on the team, there were events during spring training camp each year where Champions Club members
joined the team for a few days and rode with the team. There were also week-long trips for the Champions Club during the Tour de France after which the members of the Club would attend a gala event with the team. These events included individuals who were not part of the Champions Club but were, relator is informed and believes, associates or business relations of
Thomas Weisel.

168. The following relationships, among others, existed between Weisel’s investment banking business and his ownership of Tailwind: Yahoo!, a company that Weisel previously helped take public in approximately 1996 and continued to represent until at least 1999, was a co-sponsor of the USPS Team during at least 2000, 2001, and 2002. Interwoven obtained a
sponsorship of the USPS Team in 2002 for only $10,000 cash, plus stock options that ultimately proved to be worthless. In 2003, Weisel’s firm acted as the advisor for iManage in connection with its merger with Interwoven. Amgen, which produced the Epogen brand of EPO and was a sponsor of Livestrong and the Tour of California, used Montgomery Securities to underwrite part of its initial public offering. Montgomery Securities had holdings in 5am Ventures whose CEO was the former CEO of Nycomed Salutar, which manufactured Actovegin, a drug allegedly used by the Team during the 2000 Tour de France. I

 

[BroDeal]

Armstrong's missteps are perplexing. The sticking point that prevented a settlement with DOJ seems to not be money but Armstrong's requirement for broad criminal immunity. The DOJ was only willing to offer immunity for the USPS fraud. What possessed Armstrong to confess on Oprah? Was it pure ego? His recent interview makes it sound like the motive was to start the process of image rehabilitation but it seems crazy that he would be so desperate that he could not wait another six months to see how the legal side of things had fallen out. At the very least he could have waited a few weeks for the DOJ's deadline to join the qui tam had passed. It makes no sense. He has to be seriously delusional.

He has been so lucky in the past but he now has the Midas mistouch. Everything he touches turns to merde.

 

[BroDeal]

Anyone heard from MarkW.

"Bueller...Bueller..."

 

[Tom375]

I know this is sort of pathetic but still, . . . I can't wait to see the
"you-know-what eating grin pics" of Floyd getting paid.

This made me think of him getting one of those big cheques like people get for winning the lottery an so forth. I was hoping to find an image of Floyd Landis with such a cheque but alas no (and i don't have photoshop).

Whilst looking i did find the image below though, which made me laugh anyway

 

[D-Queued]

...

Dr. Dag Van Elslande is mentioned as the guy who did the transfusions. He also worked for the UCI as OCC tester

...

Interesting.

Not sure about all of the Montgomery Securities relationships.

While some raise eyebrows (EPO, Actovegin), there is nothing illegal or untoward about doing business deals with folks you already know.

Dave.

 

[D-Queued]

Anyone heard from MarkW.

"Bueller...Bueller..."

The response is deafening.

He is almost certainly trying to craft another argument to blame Frankie.

Dave.

 

[Tom375]

http://www.scribd.com/doc/126823648/Landis-42-Second-Amended-Complaint-Redacted

Dr. Dag Van Elslande is mentioned as the guy who did the transfusions. He also worked for the UCI as OCC tester

Handy, wonder where he's working now?

 

[ChewbaccaD]

The response is deafening.

He is almost certainly trying to craft another argument to blame Frankie.

Dave.

Yea, I'm sure we will see a "Frankie should be included in the Qui Tam because he helped Lance dope" argument.

Dude's a coward not to show his face today, but it doesn't surprise me he didn't.

 

[Fortyninefourteen]

Yea, I'm sure we will see a "Frankie should be included in the Qui Tam because he helped Lance dope" argument.

Dude's a coward not to show his face today, but it doesn't surprise me he didn't.

Where is Mark??

Warm bath, vanilla candle, chardonnay, Adele?

 

[BroDeal]

Handy, wonder where he's working now?

Quick. Someone check Sky's list of employees.

 

[BroDeal]

Interesting.

Not sure about all of the Montgomery Securities relationships.

While some raise eyebrows (EPO, Actovegin), there is nothing illegal or untoward about doing business deals with folks you already know.

Dave.

I think it is really interesting. Weisel was giving out sweetheart deals to companies he had business relationships with while others were paying significantly more. I don't know what the legal implications are, but it seems like the argument is that Weisel obtained value in excess of what he and his friends paid even as Tailwind was struggling. Maybe that excess value can be recovered.

 

[Tom375]

Quick. Someone check Sky's list of employees.

Sorry can't help you there at the moment...

I did find this http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/13824/Former-Armstrong-doctor-Van-Elslande-also-worked-as-doping-control-inspector.aspx


And also this which i found amusing sounds a bit errr 'Marginal gains'

"The entire program is awesome! It started with a super professional training camp at Altitude in Albuquerque, New Mexico. There we got tested by specialists and Bernard even flew over experts like Dr. Dag Van Elslande [ex team-doctor for Discovery channel] and Dr. Andy Pruitt from Boulder (CO). Then our racing season brought us to lots of stage races and top U23 international races in several countries in Europe. All training-efforts are monitored with Ergomo and Cyclingpeaks. This way we do not loose any time. Besides the physical part Bernard and his wife Ann teach us to live like professionals as well. Little details can make big differences, the results of all this are very much visible."

Have to wait until RR or someone with a bit more more research integrity uncovers where he's at now..

 

[Tom375]

Quick. Someone check Sky's list of employees.

Apparently he's working for DAG/ digitale wachtkamer - don't ask me what they do, couldn't tell from the website which seemed quite basic and my Flemmish or whatever language it's in is non existent. There is an email address on there with which to contact him though.

 

[D-Queued]

Sorry can't help you there at the moment...

I did find this http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/13824/Former-Armstrong-doctor-Van-Elslande-also-worked-as-doping-control-inspector.aspx


And also this which i found amusing sounds a bit errr 'Marginal gains'



Have to wait until RR or someone with a bit more more research integrity uncovers where he's at now..

This part was interesting:

"...the doctor Dag Van Elslande acted as a doping control tester in the Flemish region..."

Wonder how he got connected with Lance? The UCI is kind of obvious. Especially when McQuaid cited Belgium as being clean - which has obvious irony in this case.

At the same time, anyone remember where Eddy is from? Would Emile Vrijman live anywhere near there?

Dave.

 

[Tom375]

This part was interesting:

"...the doctor Dag Van Elslande acted as a doping control tester in the Flemish region..."

Wonder how he got connected with Lance? The UCI is kind of obvious. Especially when McQuaid cited Belgium as being clean - which has obvious irony in this case.

At the same time, anyone remember where Eddy is from? Would Emile Vrijman live anywhere near there?

Dave.

According to article just read the link is Bruyneel, and Dirk Demol.

Elslande worked in different teams with other doctors, such as the now suspended Del Moral , Celaya and left Peter Lagrou (Vacansoleil). The link with Bruyneel and Armstrong by Belgian team manager of RadioShack Dirk Demol for years Elslande as his doctor had. As it turns out, Van Elslande also worked as doping inspector for the Flemish Cycling Federation from the nineties to 2004.

 

[Race Radio]

So Och knew all along about the USPS doping program, but never told anyone. Someone should have asked him about it......oh, wait. Somebody did

http://bcove.me/m8kk9lhl

 

[Granville57]

So Och knew all along about the USPS doping program, but never told anyone. Someone should have asked him about it......oh, wait. Somebody did

http://bcove.me/m8kk9lhl

Christ. He took the words right out of Allen Lim's mouth in that one.

 

[Oldman]

So Och knew all along about the USPS doping program, but never told anyone. Someone should have asked him about it......oh, wait. Somebody did

http://bcove.me/m8kk9lhl

And this is where it gets interesting for Och...there are guys ready to corroborate his testimony or; confirm he committed perjury if he lies. Another loose end for Stapleton and Weisel under the circumstances.
This is like a bad 80's novel except the ending was never in doubt for some of us.
It is awfully quiet on the yellow band front; even the paid interns see the end.