Official Lance Armstrong Thread: Part 3 (Post-Confession)

[thehog]

McQuaid is also going in. Their target is the same, Travis Tygart and **** Pound

Again, you have no idea what is being said in confidential hearings. That would just be speculating.

 

[andyfrun]

Beyond puff

The Richardson piece made me ill. His stipulations and his making cancer survivors seemingly too desperate to have morality...

Five days before the USADA posted the evidence online, this was written. What are these "journalists" getting paid to write such b.s?

What ever happened to this lance approved lady? http://www.texasmonthly.com/story/e...s-candidly-about-cancer-and-comedy?fullpage=1

Langer is a music journalist. What is this about? Would love to hear your thoughts.

Also the facebook comments following the Esquire article seem fake. The positive ones. I'm pretty sure that is a service from his reputational management law and PR firms.

Not sure if it's common knowledge, but the internet is teeming with all forgiving trolls who attack normal morally upright folks. Kroll Inc is known for this kind of "reputational management" and "asset protection."

 

[Race Radio]

Again, you have no idea what is being said in confidential hearings. That would just be speculating.

Again, you have no idea of the boasting to "Friends" that gets repeated. To be fair Lance was in there for 7 hours, Travis was not the only topic.....I am sure Frankie, Horner, and Contador's names came up

 

[86TDFWinner]

McQuaid is also going in. Their target is the same, Travis Tygart and **** Pound

Do they even have anything on either to make a difference, or get anything to stick? I mean, you'd think Wonderboy would've come forward sooner considering his current situation. If he had anything worth value on either, certainly he would've spewed it by now, or are his lawyers REALLY that stupid?

Plus, wouldn't anything on either be considered a vendetta against them? Wonderboys cred has been shot for some time, he's pathological, so anything out of his mouth cannot be truthful.

 

[thehog]

Again, you have no idea of the boasting to "Friends" that gets repeated. To be fair Lance was in there for 7 hours, Travis was not the only topic.....I am sure Frankie, Horner, and Contador's names came up

Like I said, speculation. You have no idea what has been said or what is about to be said.

You can't possibly know unless your friends with the Dame

 

[Race Radio]

Do they even have anything on either to make a difference, or get anything to stick? I mean, you'd think Wonderboy would've come forward sooner considering his current situation. If he had anything worth value on either, certainly he would've spewed it by now, or are his lawyers REALLY that stupid?

Plus, wouldn't anything on either be considered a vendetta against them? Wonderboys cred has been shot for some time, he's pathological, so anything out of his mouth cannot be truthful.

Wonderboy's key goal right now is to promote the idea that everyone was doing it and that everyone knew about it.....including the folks at the USPS. If he can get a majority of the jury to believe this myth then it achieves 2 goals

*It kills the ability of the Government to toll the SOL
*It means the USPS was not damaged as they knew what they were buying and paid the market rate for it

 

[Race Radio]

speculation

No, speculation would be the nonsense that you invent daily......Wonderboy's friends talking about how Lance boasted that Horner should just retire now because he will be done anyways after he talks to the CIRC is hearsay.

 

[thehog]

No, speculation would be the nonsense that you invent daily......Wonderboy's friends talking about how Lance boasted that Horner should just retire now because he will be done anyways after he talks to the CIRC is hearsay.

Good for Lance, I hope he does drop Horner in it. But you don't know what he said. It's not possible. It was confidential.

 

[mewmewmew13]

Good for Lance, I hope he does drop Horner in it. But you don't know what he said. It's not possible. It was confidential.

exactly.
I don't think he said what you think he said..and i'm betting he didn't say what Peters said he said.

Spin.

 

[86TDFWinner]

I don't think he said what you think he said..and i'm betting he didn't say what Peters said he said.

Spin.

How do we know what anyone said? Just because you said, that he said, that the other guy said, that he said, what you said isn't really what the other guy said......is what was said...... and I said, what you said, but what the other guy never said, said(I think).......you dig?

(Now, can you explain that back to me please, so I can understand what I just said?)

 

[Energy Starr]

It's an interesting question. If he came back from cancer and presented himself as the "average guy" making it good in the peloton he would have been ok. He wasn't Froome. Armstrong could maybe win a stage at the Tour and one day races. He could have even become a David Miller type and campaigned to rid the sport of the doping that have him cancer. Still would have made money. Good money as well.

But it wasn't him. He had to win all the time. So he fairly much went back to what he was doing and on a much larger scale.

There was an interview around the time after he came back after cancer when he returned to Europe. He had very poor results and went back to Texas again. He sounded humble and disillusioned. Almost likeable. It's probably around that time he decided that he was going to do this thing "hard" or not at all.

Sliding Doors. What could have been.

There are "average guys" who had cancer and are racing professionally. There is at least one in the TDF now. As you can tell, no one pays attention or donates millions in the name of "average guy". Maybe he would have been nice or likeable or whatever......but he cares not one iota about such things, obviously.

 

[Energy Starr]

Some here think it is smart to double down on a bad hand but I have no desire to see the guy go down in flames. Would rather he work out an exit from the mess that all can live with and move on with his life. It appears that point has long past and he is going to continue on the path that, so far, has been mostly failure.

You're too nice. I want flames!!!

 

[movingtarget]

Support For Lance's Legacy

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling...rmstrongs-record-to-stand-20140717-ztuye.html

Past Tour winners support Lance.

 

[Energy Starr]

http://www.smh.com.au/sport/cycling...rmstrongs-record-to-stand-20140717-ztuye.html

Past Tour winners support Lance.

No offense MT but this is covered in another thread, or rather previously in this one.

 

[ScienceIsCool]

You're too nice. I want flames!!!

No. Humbled and reduced to a modest home in a decent neighbourhood, sure. Required to work a day job; yeah, I can get behind that. He's a regular person just like the rest of us.

Two key points for me: First, he did have a lot of natural talent and deserves to be compensated for a career commensurate to that talent. Essentially, enough to get a two or three bedroom home in a fair sized city. Second, and for me this is the most important, he has a family that does not deserve to have their dignity trampled just because of their father.

As for the rest, he obtained it through pure fraud and deceit. He has no claims to the millions he possesses. The whole thing should be forfeit. Maybe a hundred grand in an RRSP or something.

John Swanson

 

[Archibald]

Why not just read the link. I took the time to look it up and put it there so it's easy for you to read. All you have to do is click the button.

But Just for you cause you're too lazy to click the link.

Actually, some, like me are reading this via work computers during lunch breaks, so not all links work thanks to company IT security settings. For me, about 30% of links work, so it does get frustrating when someone just sticks up a link without any kind of decent referrals/comments...

we now return to the normal broadcast

 

[buckle]

Are the federal government suing the wrong party here? The doping of Armstrong was so obvious that surely the problem rests with the UCI and ASO. Both parties should be pursued in the courts by the US government and other interested parties. Armstrong is not the issue here despite Kimmage's claims.

 

[BikeCentric]

Are the federal government suing the wrong party here? The doping of Armstrong was so obvious that surely the problem rests with the UCI and ASO. Both parties should be pursued in the courts by the US government and other interested parties. Armstrong is not the issue here despite Kimmage's claims.

US Government didn't have a contract with UCI or ASO. They're suing Armstrong for breach of contract.

 

[MarkvW]

Hmmm, not convinced.

It makes good sense to defend SCA & the Government. They are his biggest exposures. Meaning if you're going to blow $10m on legal fees make sure you blow it on your biggest exposure of $100m & $12-15m.

Times and Assurance which I mentioned in my first post were about a million each. Those are out of the way and I think it was very good strategy to get Murdoch/Walsh off his plate. They could have caused a lot of damage to his already destroyed image. But not fighting Murdoch was the right move.

You see it's not all stupid what he's doing. There is some planning to his demise.

What he is doing isn't stupid at all, because he likely has no real choice, but what he has been doing is monumentally and colossally stupid. He has stupidly maneuvered himself into a no win situation.

He has dragged his downfall out for years. He has forced his opponents to allocate significant resources to fight him--now they're committed and they're not likely to back down until they get seriously paid.

Lance had the knowledge available to predict how bad this was going to get, at the latest, when he knew his former henchmen were talking to the GJ. That was when he needed to generously negotiate. He didn't need to admit any fault--he could have generously paid off the Times, the Feds, Acceptance, and maybe even SCA. Once the criminal process was over, he could have made his public apologies. Then, after a decent interval, he could have commenced his redemption campaign. Awful for awhile, but no loose ends.

But nooooo, Lance goes into full-on hostility mode, IMO completely rejecting the advice of his top-drawer crisis managers. Now, the agony drags on and on and Lance's opponents become more and more implacable. Lance's only way to mess with them now is a long battle to delay t he inevitable. Unfortunately for him, it appears that is the best, and only, tactic remaining to him.

 

[buckle]

US Government didn't have a contract with UCI or ASO. They're suing Armstrong for breach of contract.

Wishful thinking on my part ...

I don't see how bankrupting a selfish man like Armstrong will clean up sport? Au contraire, it simply warns cheats not to be overly demanding and amounts to a sort of financial equivalent of the biological passport: cheat, get well paid for it but don't cheat too much or demand too much money.

In short, I would like to litigation against the enablers rather than the boring doers.

 

[movingtarget]

No offense MT but this is covered in another thread, or rather previously in this one.

Okay thanks.

 

[RownhamHill]

What he is doing isn't stupid at all, because he likely has no real choice, but what he has been doing is monumentally and colossally stupid. He has stupidly maneuvered himself into a no win situation.

He has dragged his downfall out for years. He has forced his opponents to allocate significant resources to fight him--now they're committed and they're not likely to back down until they get seriously paid.

Lance had the knowledge available to predict how bad this was going to get, at the latest, when he knew his former henchmen were talking to the GJ. That was when he needed to generously negotiate. He didn't need to admit any fault--he could have generously paid off the Times, the Feds, Acceptance, and maybe even SCA. Once the criminal process was over, he could have made his public apologies. Then, after a decent interval, he could have commenced his redemption campaign. Awful for awhile, but no loose ends.

But nooooo, Lance goes into full-on hostility mode, IMO completely rejecting the advice of his top-drawer crisis managers. Now, the agony drags on and on and Lance's opponents become more and more implacable. Lance's only way to mess with them now is a long battle to delay t he inevitable. Unfortunately for him, it appears that is the best, and only, tactic remaining to him.

As the man said:

You've got to know when to hold 'em
Know when to fold 'em
Know when to walk away
Know when to run
You never count your money
When you're sittin' at the table
There'll be time enough for countin'
When the dealin's done

I want to play poker with Lance and thehog.

 

[poupou]

Wishful thinking on my part ...

I don't see how bankrupting a selfish man like Armstrong will clean up sport? Au contraire, it simply warns cheats not to be overly demanding and amounts to a sort of financial equivalent of the biological passport: cheat, get well paid for it but don't cheat too much or demand too much money.

In short, I would like to litigation against the enablers rather than the boring doers.

You are right, same with criminals, to put them in jail doesn't stop others to commit crimes too. We should let them go too.

 

[buckle]

You are right, same with criminals, to put them in jail doesn't stop others to commit crimes too. We should let them go too.

I take your point but does the analogy fit? Many people received kickbacks from this scam so how does going after Armstrong solve the corruption which underpinned the fraud in the first place? Rasmussen exposed the absurdity of the police raids on Festina in ’98 when he claimed that the other teams were all doping in the adjacent rooms as Festina team members were being frogmarched to the local jail. Froome is proof that the persecution of Armstrong is not working.

 

[Benotti69]

I take your point but does the analogy fit? Many people received kickbacks from this scam so how does going after Armstrong solve the corruption which underpinned the fraud in the first place? Rasmussen exposed the absurdity of the police raids on Festina in ’98 when he claimed that the other teams were all doping in the adjacent rooms as Festina team members were being frogmarched to the local jail. Froome is proof that the persecution of Armstrong is not working.

Armstrong is not being persecuted! He was asked to assist the investigation, he chose not to, he got his ban and there it ended.

The court cases again are of his own making. His choice too as part of his choice to dope.

Dont see Indurain being repeatedly dragged through courts, nor Merckx, nor Hinault. Wonder why...........

Armstrong is in a situation of his own making. That people think he is being persecuted really dont fully understand or a willfully trolling.