Official Lance Armstrong Thread **READ POST #1 BEFORE POSTING**

[Cloxxki]

I think the fact that vaughters hasnt testified yet, indicated the GJ still has a while to run.

Or, he is just another target. FEDs are likely to have more on him than the Clinic, especially after the hearings they already had.

 

[python]

I think the fact that vaughters hasnt testified yet, indicated the GJ still has a while to run.

this has been covered i think.

it may not be necessary to drag jv into the gj floor to get his take on the texas investigation.

one reason could be that novi already has a good feel for jv's input from other sources (like wada, which we know jv has talked to). another, is that novi may be keeping jv's input for a criminal trail phase because it's a more efficient use of assets.

i am positive jv figures in the investigation regardless of what public knows.

 

[Cimacoppi49]

My impression is that Lancey poo is now a thing of the past for the average Frenchie (myself not included). We are wonderfully spared the advertising by his sponsors and there is little or no coverage of the recent revelations. You could say that awareness is at an all time low.

My cycling bud is married to a French woman who comes from a cycling family. According to her, most French riders would love to see Lance do the perp walk during the Tour--during a mountain stage or ITT.

 

[Cimacoppi49]

I do not see any charges prior to or during the Tour. Wonderboy's recent bullying likely extending the investigation.

The more evidence, the longer the investigation, the more charges.

I agree. Looking at October or November, IMO. Of course they could always indict sooner and later file a superseding indictment.

 

[dbrmuz]

http://www.facts4lance.net has to be Floyd ;-)

Not sure about http://www.facts4lance.org/ - just noticed it has shifted from the "boys having fun" redirect to "cache-cache" !
http://whois.domaintools.com/facts4lance.net

I love the tab heading I get with the redirect:

Witness Intimidation

 

[thirteen]

even if there are no tapes from Cache Cache, the noose can still be tightened: http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/8...about-possible-witness-tampering-charges.aspx

According to Hostin, even if no images are available, Hamilton’s word may be enough to bring charges. “If Tyler Hamilton talks to the FBI and then says, ‘you know, I did feel intimidated, I did feel threatened, Lance Armstrong said this to me,’ that would be enough for witness tampering,” she stated.

 

[python]

even if there are no tapes from Cache Cache, the noose can still be tightened: http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/8...about-possible-witness-tampering-charges.aspx

you beat me by 5 seconds.

“Witness tampering in federal court is very serious. It's punishable up to 20 years in prison and possible fines. And so I would say [that] if the FBI is asking for videotapes of that encounter at that restaurant, which my understanding it's been reported that they are looking at that, [then] that spells some serious allegations.”

According to Hostin, even if no images are available, Hamilton’s word may be enough to bring charges. “If Tyler Hamilton talks to the FBI and then says, ‘you know, I did feel intimidated, I did feel threatened, Lance Armstrong said this to me,’ that would be enough for witness tampering,” she stated.

 

[Love the Scenery]

Larner did warn LA?

Has this interesting little tidbit already been commented on this thread? It appears that Larner did go out of her way to tell LA that Hamilton was there ...

Outside magazine editor Abe Streep reported what happened when Hamilton and Armstrong met in Cache Cache. It was initially suggested that the encounter may have been simply down to chance, but the restaurant owner Jodi Larner, a friend of Armstrong, later confirmed that she had informed the former pro that Hamilton was there having meal.

Read more: http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/8...-witness-tampering-charges.aspx#ixzz1Q0sNyEli

 

[Exroadman24902]

Has this interesting little tidbit already been commented on this thread? It appears that Larner did go out of her way to tell LA that Hamilton was there ...

However, if he was planning going there to meet others, if either of them were, they had every right to regardless of any grand jury stuff. That's not witness tampering. And walking by someone who was on your team for years, it would be hard not to acknowledge them in some way.

 

[python]

Has this interesting little tidbit already been commented on this thread? It appears that Larner did go out of her way to tell LA that Hamilton was there ...

yes it was mentioned a dozen of times.

just as many times the apologists called it 'nothing' willfully ignoring the outstretched hand of armstrong (confirmed by larner) that stopped hamilton.

 

[Love the Scenery]

OK, so Larner admitted "that she had informed the former pro" that Hamilton was in the restaurant ... do we know if this "informing" took place when LA was already in the restaurant for an unrelated reason, or did the "informing" take place by phone, so that LA went out of his way to go to the restaurant just because Hamilton was there? This has been a major point of debate in this thread, it would be nice to know. If the latter, I don't see how a charge of witness tampering could be evaded.

 

[python]

i posted a question about the time of the contact between larner and armstrong. it got buried...

it must be very easy to establish if you are the fbi.

 

[Exroadman24902]

OK, so Larner admitted "that she had informed the former pro" that Hamilton was in the restaurant ... do we know if this "informing" took place when LA was already in the restaurant for an unrelated reason, or did the "informing" take place by phone, so that LA went out of his way to go to the restaurant just because Hamilton was there? This has been a major point of debate in this thread, it would be nice to know. If the latter, I don't see how a charge of witness tampering could be evaded.

if LA goes there regularly to eat, why should he let Hamilton being there stop him? Perhaps Hamilton provoked?

 

[rhubroma]

if LA goes there regularly to eat, why should he let Hamilton being there stop him? Perhaps Hamilton provoked?

So since LA eats regularly at this public eatery, Hamilton's choice to also eat where LA eats is a provocation?

Well then, Hamilton should obviously have avoided the place at all costs, lest he provoke LA-and-friends, as anything to the contrary would have been an intollerable act of effrontery before the Texan, and at such a delicate moment, who obviously believes he has the right to decide who is welcome clientel and who is not.

 

[Exroadman24902]

So since LA eats regularly at this public eatery, Hamilton's choice to also eat where LA eats is a provocation?

Well then, Hamilton should obviously have avoided the place at all costs, lest he provoke LA-and-friends, as anything to the contrary would have been an intollerable act of effrontery before the Texan, and at such a delicate moment, who obviously believes he has the right to decide who is welcome clientel and who is not.

both of them are entitled to go to the restaurant they wish. It is unrealistic to expect them not to speak at some point in that restaurant.

 

[oldschoolnik]

i posted a question about the time of the contact between larner and armstrong. it got buried...

it must be very easy to establish if you are the fbi.

I took the new Velonation quote to mean Larner called or contacted LA to tell him that TH was there. If Lance were already in the restaurant, I doubt she would need to inform him that Tyler was eating nearby.

Obvious to me that Larner wanted brownie points with Lance and called/text/emailed him.

 

[Dr. Maserati]

i posted a question about the time of the contact between larner and armstrong. it got buried...

it must be very easy to establish if you are the fbi.

From the Aspen Daily news description.....

Larner said she knew Armstrong would be coming into the restaurant that night and gave him a heads up that Hamilton was eating dinner on the patio with a group.

.... it would appear sh contacted Armstrong before he was at the restaurant.

 

[Anonymous]

both of them are entitled to go to the restaurant they wish. It is unrealistic to expect them not to speak at some point in that restaurant.

True.

LA could have asked Ty about his dog, spoke about the weather, wished him luck in dealing with depression....

But, true to form, Lance pull the Simeoni card from the bottom of the deck. Some things just are... no further explaination necessary.

 

[Polish]

I was wrong when I speculated that owner Larner would not even have recognized Tyler.
But now I find it curious that she DID recognize him.

I mean Tyler can walk into almost any out-of-town eatery and not be recognized or even seen by the owner.

How and why did Larner recognize him?

Maybe because she and Lance have discussed and watched the 60 minutes show?
Maybe she is a cycling fan and thought "hey, that guy kind of looks like tyler hamilton"?

Or maybe she was "tipped off" in some way.
"This is Outside magazine and we would like to make a reservation for 10"
"Including Tyler Hamilton. You know, 60 minutes Tyler tic toc tic wink wink"

And how about subsequent illegitimate computer hacking of the Cache Cache business website? Damaging false reviews. Links to Cache Cache with headings "witness intimidation". Going to Lance's front gate. What was THAT all about?

"Witness tampering" with a witness doing the tampering?
Hopefully, Tyler or Floyd are not involved with ANY hacking or what not.
Could have an effect on the cases

 

[D-Queued]

both of them are entitled to go to the restaurant they wish. It is unrealistic to expect them not to speak at some point in that restaurant.

Are you kidding?

First, Larner's excuse for calling was that this is SOP for divorcees. Tyler just went on 60 minutes and spilled the beans that he had spilled the beans.

It would be completely UNREALISTIC to believe that Lance & Tyler would behave in any way but as though they had JUST settled an acrimonious divorce. In fact, partners in an acrimonious divorce might be more likely to speak to each other than these two at this point.

Yours is not only a gross understatement, the concept of a friendly discussion when they just happened to bump into one another - on purpose and on forewarning by Lance - is absurd.

Lance was forewarned. His contact with Tyler was premeditated.

Dave.

 

[Love the Scenery]

Maserati, thanks for the link.

Larner said she knew Armstrong would be coming into the restaurant that night and gave him a heads up that Hamilton was eating dinner on the patio with a group. As a restaurant owner in a small town, she said she extends the same courtesy to divorcees when one is coming in and the other is already there.

http://www.aspendailynews.com/section/home/147445
This actually implies that Larner told LA about Hamilton's presence as LA was coming into the restaurant, not by telephone. That in turn means that the whole time LA was at the restaurant, he knew Hamilton was in the patio eating--plenty of time to premeditate or fantasize about what he wanted to tell Hamilton. Not quite as damning as if Larner had called him and he had gone to the restaurant specifically to inflict himself on Hamilton. Nevertheless, if LA initiated the contact, it would have to be considered intimidation. The power and money differential between these two people alone would make virtually any contact from Lance intimidating. The guy has $140 million dollars, six lawyers, PR firms, and a reputation for destroying his enemies.

Something that Larner has not addressed is, if she knew already that Armstrong would be there that evening, and her policy is to warn divorcees of their mutual presence, why did she warn only Armstrong and not Hamilton? She could have avoided the whole incident by barring Hamilton from entering in the first place, instead of banning him after the fact. If she didn't orchestrate the event, she certainly had the power to stop it from happening, and didn't.

 

[uspostal]

True.

LA could have asked Ty about his dog, spoke about the weather, wished him luck in dealing with depression....

But, true to form, Lance pull the Simeoni card from the bottom of the deck. Some things just are... no further explaination necessary.

Ive seen the Simeoni card pulled out on here about LA a lot, Does anybody on here have proof of what was said between the 2 other than the 2 people that were involved. Just wondering because I don't recall seeing anybody else there to hear the conversation between the 2.

 

[Polish]

Maserati, thanks for the link.

http://www.aspendailynews.com/section/home/147445
This actually implies that Larner told LA about Hamilton's presence as LA was coming into the restaurant, not by telephone. That in turn means that the whole time LA was at the restaurant, he knew Hamilton was in the patio eating--plenty of time to premeditate or fantasize about what he wanted to tell Hamilton. Not quite as damning as if Larner had called him and he had gone to the restaurant specifically to inflict himself on Hamilton. Nevertheless, if LA initiated the contact, it would have to be considered intimidation. The power and money differential between these two people alone would make virtually any contact from Lance intimidating. The guy has $140 million dollars, six lawyers, PR firms, and a reputation for destroying his enemies.

Something that Larner has not addressed is, if she knew already that Armstrong would be there that evening, and her policy is to warn divorcees of their mutual presence, why did she warn only Armstrong and not Hamilton? She could have avoided the whole incident by barring Hamilton from entering in the first place, instead of banning him after the fact. If she didn't orchestrate the event, she certainly had the power to stop it from happening, and didn't.

Thanks for the link, Love the Scenery.

It indicates
1) Lance already had plans to eat there.
2) Lance did not know Tyler would be there
3) Larner told Lance that "Tyler was out on the patio" after Lance arrived.
4) Lance hung out in the bar, not the patio.

Still curious how Larner recognized Tyler though

 

[oldschoolnik]

True.

LA could have asked Ty about his dog, spoke about the weather, wished him luck in dealing with depression....

But, true to form, Lance pull the Simeoni card from the bottom of the deck. Some things just are... no further explaination necessary.

A++
This is spot on. A tiger can't change his stripes even when he is under federal indictment

 

[Stevie039]

"Tapes not necessary to bring tampering charges:

According to Hostin, even if no images are available, Hamilton’s word may be enough to bring charges. “If Tyler Hamilton talks to the FBI and then says, ‘you know, I did feel intimidated, I did feel threatened, Lance Armstrong said this to me,’ that would be enough for witness tampering,” she stated.

“It's not usually the case that you actually have a videotape of witness tampering. Witness tampering usually occurs on a side street. It usually occurs at someone's home. Sometimes it's just the mere presence of someone staring down at someone else.

“When I was a federal prosecutor, I had to deal with witness tampering, especially with gang cases. And so Tyler Hamilton, talking to the FBI, that would be enough to sustain a witness tampering charge.”

http://www.velonation.com/News/ID/8...about-possible-witness-tampering-charges.aspx