Official London Olympics Doping thread

[sniper]

If you look at Basso, Valverde, etc they come back slower.

from macro- to micro-dosing.

 

[veganrob]

of course, that's it, and we all know.

So the question I'm asking is:
Are IOC unable to catch western athletes, or are they unwilling to catch western athletes?

(Or third option: are IOC catching western athletes only to subsequently shove the positives under the carpet?)

second and third options are pretty much the same, and yes they are the answer

 

[King Boonen]

Check out Blake's progress since he got suspended.

The 100m is one of those races you can only see as an exhibition. It's barely sport anymore. As a result I was cheering for Gatlin to win ahead of Blake because the headlines would've been hilarious.

I have to say I was as well. Him or Powell.

 

[saosinfangirl]

in the 1500m the Brits were way off the pace anyway, so i don't see where racism or xenophobia comes into it unless Algerians have an undeserved rep for doping.

Ohurugu - you really think there going to bring up her whereabouts violation tonight? Biased, but what do you expect?

sorry was it a missed test?

This - http://forum.cyclingnews.com/showpost.php?p=976136&postcount=891

Wiggins, Froome, GB track team - Brailsford, Leinders
GB rowing team - ex-east german coach
Mo Farah - Salazar
all of them are cheaters


lol. what a joke

Algeria's Taoufik Makhloufi has been excluded from the Olympic Games for not trying in Monday morning's 800m heat.
Makhloufi, who won one of Sunday's 1500m semi-finals, was forced to race in the 800m after Algeria failed to withdraw him before Sunday's deadline.
The 24-year-old completed barely 200m of his heat before quitting.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/19152117

what about Wiggins, Froome and Eisel for not trying to win RR

 

[King Boonen]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/olympics/19152117

what about Wiggins, Froome and Eisel for not trying to win RR

Does this mean Bourgain is out of the Keirin?

 

[Catwhoorg]

American judoka Nick Delpopolo has been expelled from the Games after a positive drugs test and admitted he had eaten food which contained marijuana.

Delpopolo insisted he had not known the unidentified food contained the banned substance, but that was not sufficient as a defence

From:
BBC Live text commentary

 

[Paco_P]

+1 Ye Shiwen bettered her PB by 4 seconds which was set 2 years ago, Ian Thorpe bettered his PB at a similar age by 5 seconds - no questions were raised there. A similarly brilliant from Ruta Meilutyle in the 100m breaststroke, she broke European records in heats, semi final then won the gold as a 15 year old - no questions raised there as she live in plymouth, England and her coach is English. The same BBC commentator Claire Balding who had raised doubts over Ye Shiwen immediately after her swim declared Ruta's performance as her fav non british of the games so far!

On Ye's final 50m - she was seventeen hundreds of a second faster than Lochte over the last 50m, she was 23.25 seconds slower over the 400m. Rebecca Adlinlington swam a final 50m albeit a freestyle event 2 hundreds faster than this only last year! Not only that she did it at the end of an 800m event and not a 400m event like Ye Shiwen!!! No controversy there - shes a brit.

Im a Brit who is enjoying the Olympics but some of the media coverage is so ridiculously biased. Im not saying Rebecca, Ruta or Ye are doped or not doped they are all fantastic athletes everyone just needs a slightly more balanced view before wading in with what the TV or papers are telling them.

A more immediate example that supports your point: 15 year old 800m freestyle champion Katie Ledecky. Her time was the second fastest ever (the record is Rebecca Adlington's), she won by 2 seconds, and beat her own PB by 5.

 

[Paco_P]

Somebody explain to me how swimmers can produce world class results when they are teenagers. Every other sport that is combination of aerobic and musclular effort has a peak age in the upper twenties or early thirties. A teenager winning in international competition would be unheard of. How many sixteen years olds or even twenty year olds have won the Tour de France?

I want to know the answer to this too. I wonder if the following speculation has anything to it - perhaps there is a lot less money in swimming than even in things like track and field and cycling - and so the top talent gets out of competition when it gets to an age (22+) at which there is a need to make a consistent living.

 

[BroDeal]

I want to know the answer to this too. I wonder if the following speculation has anything to it - perhaps there is a lot less money in swimming than even in things like track and field and cycling - and so the top talent gets out of competition when it gets to an age (22+) at which there is a need to make a consistent living.

I wonder if younger swimmers have better bouyancy or drag that outweighs the benefit of increased aerobic development.

 

[User Guide]

I want to know the answer to this too. I wonder if the following speculation has anything to it - perhaps there is a lot less money in swimming than even in things like track and field and cycling - and so the top talent gets out of competition when it gets to an age (22+) at which there is a need to make a consistent living.

+1 that and they train so much harder than youngsters in other sports at a very early age,no impact injuries id guess.
I remember at jnr school(under 11s) national age group champion in my class,she did a ridiculus amount for someone so young.
Although think rules tighter now in UK/Europe I think (although that may be on competitions)maybe someone would know more

 

[Paco_P]

Interim medal ranking (NB: only considering total number of medals and only considering countries with +10 medals)

Rank - Country - Nr. of medals
1 - USA - 45
2 - China - 43
3 - Großbritannien - 25
4 - Russland - 24
5 - Japan - 21
6 - Deutschland - 20
7 - Frankreich - 19
8 - Australien - 17
9 - Südkorea - 16
10 - Italien - 12

Here is the ranking reshuffled according to number of medals per million inhabitants (on the far right in bold):

1 - Australien -17 - 22.000.000 -0.772
2- Großbritannien -25 - 62.000.000 - 0.403
3 -Südkorea - 16 - 50.000.000 - 0.320
4- Frankreich -19- 65.000.000 - 0.292
5 -Deutschland - 20 - 81.000.000 - 0.247
6- Italien- 12 - 60.000.000 - 0.200
7 -Russland - 24 - 142.000.000 - 0.169
8 -Japan - 21 - 128.000.000 -0.164
9- USA - 45 - 311.000.000 -0.144
10 -China -43 - 1.300.000.000 -0.033

Of course, a lot of caveats to be made here (like the fact that there is a maximum number of participants per country, among many other things). So certainly doesn't allow to draw any farreaching conclusions, but it's interesting to see Australia doing so well on average. China's average performance is hardly suspect.

Much of China is still very poor and has no possibility whatsoever to compete in silliness like athletics competitions. That's not true for any of the other countries on the list.

 

[Paco_P]

What's up with long jumping anyway? No money to be won?

And where did all the people who beat the Olympic champion last year go? All 14 of them

Maybe doping doesn't help that much with jumping?

I mean this as a semi-serious question - is there any doping/drugging that clearly improves jumping performance?

With the long jump it grabs my attention that the world record has changed only once in 40+ years. I wonder if this is the world record profile of a relatively clean sport.

 

[Franklin]

1. Thorpe and vd Hoogenband were relatively old for Swimmers.
2. Inge de Bruijn also competed relatively long.

Strange enough those were sprint disciplines.

Also, Phelps isn't that young anymore

I do however think Swimming is less Aerobic and more strength then Cycling. I think that helps younger competitors.

Money isn't an issue. As always that's a red herring in motivating people. money does help in the infrastructure, the pay of the athletes is absolutely not a significant factor.

If knitting became an olympic discipline people would train 4 years 8 hours a day (and think of ways to cheat).

 

[will10]

A more immediate example that supports your point: 15 year old 800m freestyle champion Katie Ledecky. Her time was the second fastest every (the record is Rebecca Adlington's), she won by 2 seconds, and beat her own PB by 5.

Moreover, Adlington's time in Beijing was set in a supersuit, Ledecky's was not. Ledecky's swim here is far and away the best performance at 800m, ever.

 

[Franklin]

Maybe doping doesn't help that much with jumping?

I mean this as a semi-serious question - is there any doping/drugging that clearly improves jumping performance?

With the long jump it grabs my attention that the world record has changed only once in 40+ years. I wonder if this is the world record profile of a relatively clean sport.

Steroids definitely would help

But I think the profile of a longjumper is relatively narrow. Whereas we have long, short, thin, muscular cyclists, a longjumper needs to be long, light and explosive.

Cavendish and Wiggins both were pursuiters competing at the same level (Brad was better, but Mark was no slouch). If they were longjumping it seems clear Mark would be trounced

It's conjecture of course.

 

[Paco_P]

I'm not sure there's much difference ethically beteween doping a lot or only doping a little (and that's generous to Lewis to even say that). Cough sirup, really? Johnson may have had a more beastly physique than Lewis, but you really can't infer level of doping from that with any certainty.

Just to add to what you are saying - Tim Montgomery didn't look as doped as Ben Johnson - but now we all know better.

In the modern era of doping the gross physical aspects may just reflect an inferior program that leaves too many visible indications.

 

[VeloGirl]

And our first Olympic Weed case. USA! USA!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/06/nicholas-delpopolo-olympics-judo-pot-doping_n_1746758.html

 

[Leopejo]

The Italian Olympic Committee threw out one of the Italians, probably for an EPO positive result found by WADA.

It should be Alex Schwazer, one of the favourites of the 50 km walk.

 

[Catwhoorg]

With the long jump it grabs my attention that the world record has changed only once in 40+ years. I wonder if this is the world record profile of a relatively clean sport.

That's more to do with just how far outside the standard of the day Bob Beamon's jump was.
He moved the record forward 55cm.

High altitude, with a just legal wind assist and the jump of a lifetime.

These days if someone advanced the WR of any event the way he did that day, there would be large mumblings of PEDs.

 

[Anonymous]

Looks like Team GB are also nobbling their horses now, too.

Gold in Show Jumping. FFS - now it's getting to the stage of sporting fraud!

 

[Caruut]

That's an interesting question - are the horses for the equestrian events tested?

 

[iZnoGouD]

doper caught hehehe

http://olimpiadi.corriere.it/2012/n...ng_989d734e-dfe0-11e1-a2e0-2a62fa6322b0.shtml

 

[Galic Ho]

1. Thorpe and vd Hoogenband were relatively old for Swimmers.
2. Inge de Bruijn also competed relatively long.

Strange enough those were sprint disciplines.

Also, Phelps isn't that young anymore

I do however think Swimming is less Aerobic and more strength then Cycling. I think that helps younger competitors.

Money isn't an issue. As always that's a red herring in motivating people. money does help in the infrastructure, the pay of the athletes is absolutely not a significant factor.

If knitting became an olympic discipline people would train 4 years 8 hours a day (and think of ways to cheat).

Michael Phelps was on the 2000 USA Olympic team. He was 15 at the time. He is now 27. He is the anomaly. The outlier. More so than the others in the longevity of his career.

Ian Thorpe first came into fashion during the summer of 1997 at the Aussie Nationals. He was 15 and a world champion. He is 4 days younger than I am. I was surprised when he arrived at how large he was. He's very, very big. Weird proportions, just like the other two you mentioned. They don't look normal. I'm 30 in October for perspective. Thorpe retired in 2006. Making him 24 max at the time. His peak was between 17 and 21 years of age. Phelps went a bit older to 23 years of age.

Van den Hoogenband was 19 in Sydney from memory. Thorpe was 17, turning 18 a week and a half after the closing ceremony. They all had their peaks between 17 and 23 years of age. The time when they were almost untouchable. Phelps dragged it on longer.

Perspective. Alberto Contador won his first GT at 24 years of age in 2007. Ian Thorpe was just shy of two months younger at that time by comparison. At the same age, Ian had retired from professional competition. Multi millionaire. Lots of money made from advertising and brand representation, especially in Japan.

Do note, when Thorpe appeared, a head USA coach made some calls about Aussies using HGH on young athletes to get them big. Big like Thorpe, with a massive arm span and size 15 flippers for feet. Contrast to Phelps. All silence from the USA ever since. Look at the mans face. Blackcat can give you the low down on how one obtains a face like that. Or a face like Missy Franklins. Ain't nothing natural going on there. But they win gold. Small price to pay isn't it?

 

[Sylvester]

That's an interesting question - are the horses for the equestrian events tested?

Of course they are. A big number of doping cases over the last years, too.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-19091188

Van den Hoogenband was 22 years old in Sydney.

 

[Galic Ho]

Maybe doping doesn't help that much with jumping?

I mean this as a semi-serious question - is there any doping/drugging that clearly improves jumping performance?

With the long jump it grabs my attention that the world record has changed only once in 40+ years. I wonder if this is the world record profile of a relatively clean sport.

King Carl won Gold in the long jump. He's not the face of clean sport. Speed is one part, your velocity at leap coupled with your angle of takeoff and flight aerodynamics. A lot of the sport is the pure power coupled with technique. Higher altitude with lower air density improves flight distance. By as much as Beamon did? Probably. Arguably the most technically gifted long jumper in history. Mexico City is approx 2000m in elevation. Or is it 1800m? Note all the other Mexico records have been smashed. Elevation played a huge part because of the flight aspect of the event itself.